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Silent hunting in a russian plane


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I don't know if what we get in lockon right now is realistic or not but I find it disturbing that there is no way to be completely silent while tracking a target in EOS mode .

 

last nite I was following an F-15 that was heading away from me , I was in a Mig-29S , had my radar OFF , a 73 selected and was in EOS mode , at no point was I aware of EOS mode automatically switching to active radar when losing track like it happens with an active missile selected .

 

I should have been silent , my thermal lock should have remained undetected by my target.

 

after talking with the F-15 pilot it turns out I wasn't silent at all , I was silent at times but if I was to lose my EOS lock ,and had to reaquire , everytime the tracked target got a lock warning (not sure of the exact moment, wether it was when I lost lock or when I reacquired) , there was no indication to me at all that my weapons systems gave me away .

 

I feel betrayed by my own plane :( , surely this shouldn't happen in lockon and I hope it doesn't happen in real life either, I think the capacity to remain passive is of utmost importance and the pilot should have the means to be sure of that at 100% .

 

so... is this a bug ? or am I doing something wrong ?

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That is a big problem for me too. This is one problem I think to be corrected. Its not realistic that a target lost by EOS is picked up by radar. And even to lock a target by both of these devices. There is a radar and an EOS master mode. No combo :) By the way, if its not corrected, has anyone got a real solution for this? In situations like this I always try to break lock of the EOS before it switches to radar, but many times I fail :) For example in dogfight.

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That is a big problem for me too. This is one problem I think to be corrected. Its not realistic that a target lost by EOS is picked up by radar. And even to lock a target by both of these devices. There is a radar and an EOS master mode. No combo :) By the way, if its not corrected, has anyone got a real solution for this? In situations like this I always try to break lock of the EOS before it switches to radar, but many times I fail :) For example in dogfight.

 

Unfortunately the manual of the real thing said otherwise, but, heck, I guess you kow something that isn't in the manual. And while you're at it, wat is the usable tactical distance of the R-27R in a head on medium altitude engagement, and what is the pk of the two missiles fired at one target?

Also, can I have more info on the proximity fuse system, especially on the right radiofrequencies?

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I like to retard the throttles when I have a su/mig chasing, or rather, when I think they are chasing me with eos ... usually their eos will then lose lock and their radar will come on ... hehe :D

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Unfortunately the manual of the real thing said otherwise

In the real thing it's pilot can use the radar and EOS both in conjunction and separately, i.e., he's able to turn the radar OFF.

But there are some other modes. For example, the pilot cas set eos to master mode, and radar - to slave mode, and then, if eos looses lock, radar tries to pick it up. But as i understand, that doesn't happen when the "ИЗЛ-ОТКЛ" switch is set to "ОТКЛ".

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In the real thing it's pilot can use the radar and EOS both in conjunction and separately, i.e., he's able to turn the radar OFF.

But there are some other modes. For example, the pilot cas set eos to master mode, and radar - to slave mode, and then, if eos looses lock, radar tries to pick it up. But as i understand, that doesn't happen when the "ИЗЛ-ОТКЛ" switch is set to "ОТКЛ".

 

That's the only answer that really makes sense. Do you have any proof of it?

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It's in well-known Su-27 flight manual.

 

Also, all these things can be seen in it's cockpit.

 

Weapons system switch for 7 positions:

 

fail-safe mode:

Ф0,

 

nav mode:

nav,

 

bvr modes:

ols - sets eos master mode

rls - sets radar master mode

 

wvr modes:

vert

opt

shlem

 

------

 

And 2 swithes also, turning radar ("izluch-otkl") and laser rangefinder ("ld") ON and OFF.

002-2.jpg.8cd15f1b2d9b7b9cd83b90e5dfb4e2c7.jpg

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I can't remeber off hand, but didn't you see the HUD symbology change to indicate?

 

When I have an active missile selected I can see the automatic switch to radar on the hud , that's what I meant in my first post , but when it's a 73 selected I see no difference in hud symbology telling me I just given my self away .

 

In the real thing it's pilot can use the radar and EOS both in conjunction and separately, i.e., he's able to turn the radar OFF.

 

Thanks for the input , I hope you are right and that a real life pilot can REALLY switch his radar off .

 

We need this ability in lockon too , modeled as it is right now EOS mode is usefull as a fall back option to radar losing track but it is useless as a stand alone , silent hunting target acquiring system.

 

Complain to the system integrators and pilots who likely figured this was a good thing

 

GG I'm sure the system integrators and pilots meant it to work this way when this particular mode was selected , the way Maximus_G explains it however ;with an option to be able to really turn the radar OFF is the only way that makes sense .

 

What do you say ED ?

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There's a lot of little things like that in LOMAC ... I don't think they'll fix them all until they can transition all the 'pits to the new tech. The F-15 for example is also missing a lot of radar modes, and the existing ones don't work exactly as they should either, and so on and so forth.

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There's a lot of little things like that in LOMAC ... I don't think they'll fix them all until they can transition all the 'pits to the new tech. The F-15 for example is also missing a lot of radar modes, and the existing ones don't work exactly as they should either, and so on and so forth.

 

I understand and appreciate all the hard work they do at ED , this particular "bug" I hope will make it to the "fix it soon list " because I feel it is taking a lot away from the game right now.

 

I really miss being completely silent ... when did that change ? was it 1.1 or 1.11 because we used to be able to be "really" silent before... maybe it wouldn't be a lot of work to change it back... I know if I had a choice it would be OFF means OFF :)

 

also is the forgotten (1.11) addition of real load outs for Migs (6x 77s)going to happen in 1.12 ?

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I understand and appreciate all the hard work they do at ED , this particular "bug" I hope will make it to the "fix it soon list " because I feel it is taking a lot away from the game right now.

Unfortunately that's not a bug. It's just an inadequate level of modelling.

Still hope they could do that. It shouldn't be that hard to implement just a single switch, no new objects or functions at all.

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There's a lot of little things like that in LOMAC ... I don't think they'll fix them all until they can transition all the 'pits to the new tech. The F-15 for example is also missing a lot of radar modes, and the existing ones don't work exactly as they should either, and so on and so forth.
Than again some of those little things has been fixed, like the silent HOJ-lock for the F-15, so you never know ;)
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Seeing this thread last night, I tried to reproduce what you gentlemen have been discussing but the AI never knew I was there (single player) except one time when I broke hard right. Still had the EOS lock, however, when he reacted. Still not sure why he did. At one point, I even turned radar on manually while he was EOS locked and got no reaction. Is this problem online specific?

 

Would love to see some tracks of it happening. If anyone has one: richards7(at)earthlink(dot)net

 

Rich

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yeah , was in multiplayer , I'm sure it's easily reproducible because it seems to do it all the time . I remember many instances when I saw a bandit turn around to engage me when I was in EOS with radar OFF and a heat seeking missile selected... when I asked "did you know I was there ? " the answer was "yes" .

 

I'll try to get a track tonite.

 

I'm sure it qualify as a "bug" because it's "bugging" me :) lmao

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I can confirm it, i did some tests in my LAN.

 

Enemy has AB on, you have EOS lock

Enemy turns of AB, you loose lock, no indication is shown that the radar is used but it is apparently switched on and then off (when no lock can be made)

 

You'll show up on the F-15:s RWR, the mig-29 actually gave a lock warning.

I'll see if I can record a track, it won't really prove anything, but I guess you could record from both sides and then compare the time of accourance.. :)

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Seeing this thread last night, I tried to reproduce what you gentlemen have been discussing but the AI never knew I was there (single player) except one time when I broke hard right. Still had the EOS lock, however, when he reacted. Still not sure why he did. At one point, I even turned radar on manually while he was EOS locked and got no reaction. Is this problem online specific?

 

Would love to see some tracks of it happening. If anyone has one: richards7(at)earthlink(dot)net

 

Rich

 

 

Very much seems to be, I dont play online much ....:) but when I try to be silent I can tell you its only futile. Yeah in single player it works its in the training, .....................track with EOS and they wont know your there........pop radar on and get instant reaction most of the time. Sorry I cant be more detaled at this time, being silent and losing lock and then giving a sign i am there is news to me. I have bigger fish to fry online at this time.

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Maybe you're tracking from too far, or you're allowing the target to get out of EOS gimbals ... if he disapears below your nose in particular, you can assume you spiked him.

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Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D

I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda

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Ok, here's two tracks one recording from the Su-27 and one from the F-15 (connected from a laptop). Btw damn airliners ;)

Thanks, PeterJ, that's what I was looking for. This definitely looks like a bug. Comparing the tracks, the F-15's RWR shows a precise 7 sec spike each time you lose lock even though you have done nothing to cause the spike to disappear. Spike 1--12:00:31 until 12:00:38. Spike 2--12:01:03 until 12:01:10.

 

So it does not look like a case of inaccurate system modeling. Rather there appears to be a bug causing a spike of fixed?? duration. Folks, is it always 7 seconds long? Anyone else with tracks that they can take a measurement on?

 

I was able to mimic perterj's track in single player and the AI most definitely does not react. Another indication (if we even need one) that this is a bug rather than inaccurate modeling.

 

Rich

YouTube Channel: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCU1...CR6IZ7crfdZxDg

 

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