DCS FC3 AFM

[Rikus]

The DCS FC3 AFM modules, can now land and touch the runway with one wheel?

 

Or still is scripted

[159th_Viper]

The DCS FC3 AFM modules, can now land and touch the runway with one wheel?

 

At this stage there are no FC3 AFM modules.

[EchoMasterMind]

At this stage there are no FC3 AFM modules.

 

I think he means to ask if they will have these fiunctions once released.

 

And isn't the FC3 - SU-25 AFM?

[159th_Viper]

I think he means to ask if they will have these fiunctions once released.

 

In that case, answer here:

 

http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=108764

 

These modules will feature:

....

....

3- Advanced Flight Model (AFM)

 

One could accordingly safely assume that the behaviour wanted will indeed be included, ie won't be scripted.

 

 

 

And isn't the FC3 - SU-25 AFM?

 

Yes, but it's not yet modular.

Edited June 23, 2013 by 159th_Viper

[TimeKilla]

Can never get my head around scripting a landing as you think the approach would be different each time so how would you line that up what would happen if you did land on one wheel when scripted would it just ignore that?

[EtherealN]

You set a touchdown condition (or a few) looking at position relative to terrain and check parameters at that moment.

 

Basically: the way it was always done, until computers became strong enough for proper AFMs, which is relatively recent. (Last decade or so.)

 

Doing it dynamically is way more complex, especially if you don't already have dynamic data - which, for table-models (which was standard until recently) you don't have.

[EtherealN]

Actually, I think this is a better way to explain it:

 

With an AFM, your airplane is made up of many many components (for example, your landing gear :D ), wich each has forces computed and these are then summed to get what happens to the aircraft in general.

 

In an SFM, you have "an aircraft"; you have one set of parameters going in, which are compared to the table and get some other magic done to them. Basically, with the SFM, there is no such thing as "just one gear". There is just the one "aircraft object". Doesn't mean it is strictly impossible to get fancy landings and so on with such a thing, but it becomes a bit of a hack - it is a lot better to simply get a proper AFM in place rather than have all kinds of ugly special-case stuff going on constantly looking at whether you might be landing in any of a zillion funky ways.

Edited June 23, 2013 by EtherealN

[SimFreak]

Try playing with Su-25T and see if you can do it. Expect same if not better FM in the feature.

 

 

Long ago that FM made me a believer...

[thinkr]

I have been thinking about purchasing Flaming Cliffs 3 & Lock on...

The only thing holding me back is the fidelity which = fun for me.

 

I don't understand what you guys mean when you say the scripted landing? Doesn't Flaming cliffs 3 let you manually land the plane currently? If so which planes are currently 3d cockpit in FC3? Any? or do we have to wait for the modules? It worth it to own FC3 what do you guys who own it think is it worth it or should I wait for the Modules?

Edited June 24, 2013 by thinkr

[thinkr]

Update I bought FC3!

 

This sold me!

These updated FC3 aircraft will be made available for FREE to Flaming Cliffs 3 customers.

[/Quote]

 

Thanks ED! You Rock!

Edited June 24, 2013 by thinkr

[Robin_Hood]

I have been thinking about purchasing Flaming Cliffs 3 & Lock on...

The only thing holding me back is the fidelity which = fun for me.

 

I don't understand what you guys mean when you say the scripted landing? Doesn't Flaming cliffs 3 let you manually land the plane currently? If so which planes are currently 3d cockpit in FC3? Any? or do we have to wait for the modules? It worth it to own FC3 what do you guys who own it think is it worth it or should I wait for the Modules?

 

I will try to answer some of that.

 

Scripted landing doesn't mean that you don't land the plane manually. It means that the plane landing is not realistic. It is done by "if the plane touches the ground this or that way, the plane lands safely" kind of things, an therefore doesn't give a realistic feel. Furthermore, it will overlook a lot of things that can happen. For example, with scripted landings (FC3 planes - except Su-25), if you try landing with only one wheel touching the ground, then your aircraft will suddenly roll level and be landed with both wheels touching the ground.

 

Another way of saying this is that you have two different "states" and associated behaviours for your aircraft: on the ground, and airborne. And the transition between the two doesn't really feel well, especially on some situations. With an AFM, the very same rules and flight model are used whatever state you're in, and a very realistic transition between them will occur.

 

I hope I was clear enough (probably not entirely technically right, but I think this is the idea).

 

As for 3D cockpits, several FC3 planes have 3D cockpits: F-15C, Su-27, Su-25 and A-10A, i believe.

 

About buying FC3, now that we know that AFMs updates will be free for FC3 owners, I would say, unless you really are interested in only one aircraft, then buy FC3, especially since it is on sale now.

[howie87]

Strangely the su25 flight model still feels a bit more 'FC3' than 'DCS' to me... Can't quite put my finger on why. Compared to the A-10C and Mustang it just feels a bit more wooden.

[Brisse]

Strangely the su25 flight model still feels a bit more 'FC3' than 'DCS' to me... Can't quite put my finger on why. Compared to the A-10C and Mustang it just feels a bit more wooden.

 

Well, I assume it is just a modified Su-25T flight model. It was ED's first AFM (FC1) it is very likely that improvements were made to the newer AFM's that the other modules use.

[EtherealN]

It's just an older model. Not entirely sure what the bigger differences is, but remember that there is no such thing as "the AFM". Every "AFM" aircraft has it's very own, hand-crafted, flight model. Sometimes it's easy to transplant (like Su-25T -> Su-25), but you don't, for example, get a P-51D flight model through tweaking values in the A-10C flight model.

 

You start over from scratch an analyze that specific aircraft. (But of course, when you've done a few of them, you get better at it, and I would expect that just like in all software projects there are code snippets and functions and so on that you can re-use.)

 

Contrast this to SFM, where all SFM aircraft actually use the same flight model - just with different values plugged in. For a "survey" simulator, being able to do this is pretty key from a financial point of view, since scratch-building is expensive and time consuming. But with the decision that was made for these new AFMs, it seems the long work is paying off. :)

[Witchking]

Su25 AFM is not arcadeish...There is a stark difference between Su25 and the T versions....one feels like a pig and the other is a lot more nimble and FC series have always represented these fantastically. Of course, it may not have as many systems modelled as the other newer DCS aircraft, but check this out: http://lockon.co.uk/en/flaming_cliffs/?PAGEN_2=3

 

The physics is modelled pretty well...there is a solid feel to the aircraft with no awkward transitions anywhere. The Su25 as its supposed to be, very very fast and nimble...but the T toad is more like the warthog...slower, but armed to the teeth.