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DCS F-35A


Wags

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As far as I see, they already did some homework, and made some progress.

Look here:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/27277424@N04/sets/72157634318581967/

 

I hope it will turn out for the best.

I for sure, looking forward to fly that beast!

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That's the whole point of Kickstarter, to give money first and create later, thanks to the funding.

 

well not quite/always... look as beczl MiG-21Bis... he's done mods for FC1 then FC2 and only after he put into lot of work already and showed to the public what he's capable of, he asked for kickstarter funds and only because he needed it to fund DRM and pay someone for better art work (to make final product more professional) and for this I was more than happy to fund DCS MiG-21Bis, but not this F-35

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Thus i'm not in a stable financial situation, I would have easily wired a hundred € if the guy would have announced anything from a WW2 bird to a ~1980 plane. A 5th Gen fighter? -not interrested.

 

People complains about the Amraam / R27 balance.... It's going to be fun when it'll come down to a poorly modeled su27 against 5th gen F35.

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That's the whole point of Kickstarter, to give money first and create later, thanks to the funding. Crowd-funding is a very successful marketing and funding method across the globe these past few years, imo it's more a question of popularity of the chosen aircraft.

 

I don't care what kickstarter is. If you want money, first you have to show what you've got to offer. That's natural law, you can't just bypass it. And, as you can see for yourself, reality has verified it pretty quickly.

Popularity of chosen aircraft? Look around, get real, how many mashines we've got already and how many years have passed? Everyone on this forum will buy everything released, even the DCS: Paper Plane. I'll be happy if only 1/3 of already announced aircrafts see the daylight, within next 5 years, if ever.

 

Beside that, marketing and marketing. Look at Star Citizen. (personaly, ithink dude's got nothing, but has great marketing)


Edited by q800
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I don't care what kickstarter is. If you want money, first you have to show what you've got to offer. That's natural law, you can't just bypass it. And, as you can see for yourself, reality has verified it pretty quickly.

 

And your carelessness towards KS obviously makes you miss its point. Its sole purpose it so crowd-fund a project, sometimes it's a project that is near completion with plenty to show sometimes it's just a fresh idea that calls for community support, in both cases something is shown, if it's not enough for you then fair-enough, don't participate in the campaign, that doesn't mean what is displayed isn't good enough for someone else to pledge.

 

Popularity of chosen aircraft? Look around, get real, how many mashines we've got already and how many years have passed? Everyone on this forum will buy everything released, even the DCS: Paper Plane. I'll be happy if only 1/3 of already announced aircrafts see the daylight, within next 5 years, if ever.)

 

You're just one of these people that love to think they speak for everyone else, you're not. That community you like to define as undemanding compulsive buyers is probably the complete opposite, it's not compulsive, it is dedicated, it is not undemanding but incredibly exigent and acute customers like most niche communities. Yes some aircraft are vastly more popular than others.

 

Beside that, marketing and marketing. Look at Star Citizen. (personaly, ithink dude's got nothing, but has great marketing)

 

'Dude' had spent 2 millions on the Star Citizen prototype and two years time of work before staging his coming back with Star Citizen and its crowd-funding debut, if that's nothing to you and merely marketing well I understand your expectation weren't matched with KI's campaign.


Edited by Vivoune
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The problem is exactly this.. KI did not proven to be capable of doing what he claimed, it's just a bunch of words: we can do this, we can do that, but the facts (and the money) is something else. In fact only 316 people trustem them, again: 316 PERSONS .. it is such a low number that more than one bell should ring into your head: am I doing something wrong? Obviously yes!

Probably KI believed that a bunch of "believers" were enough to finance a "dream".. but the reality is pretty different.

 

I'll give to you my money ONLY AFTER you have proven (with facts) that you are capable of doing what you want to do.. otherwise let's see you on release time.

 

The F35 is the worst decision they could ever made, probably they believed that developing a "unknown" aircraft would have been easier (ppl does know nothing about it, so we can just invent everything: the flying model, the avionics.. who will notice it's completely off?), but ppl aren't that stupid.. we'll apart some of them (316?).

 

Now KI will ask for money elsewhere... this project will never see the light as someone would imagine (DCS level module) .. if not in several years... by that time we will have more concrete aircraft released (hopefully).

 

And to be honest.. man.. the F35 (I mean the real one) is overpriced crap, made only to steal money here and there... and those countries participating into the project are figuring it right now.. cancelling their orders, turning on something a little more concrete (the good "old" superhornet.. or the Eurofighter).

 

And you still surprised why this thing didn't even hit the half of the funds on KS? :) I am suriprised that there were those 300 giving 32k for nothing instead!

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The problem is exactly this.. KI did not proven to be capable of doing what he claimed, it's just a bunch of words: we can do this, we can do that, but the facts (and the money) is something else.
Speak for yourself. Based on what I know, KI has the experience, knowledge and access to make this happen.

 

In fact only 316 people trustem them, again: 316 PERSONS .. it is such a low number that more than one bell should ring into your head: am I doing something wrong? Obviously yes!

Probably KI believed that a bunch of "believers" were enough to finance a "dream".. but the reality is pretty different.

Maybe there would have been more if they didn't have a few dedicated haters trying to scuttle their project? Sure they could have done things differently to reach a larger audience - that is life...

 

I'll give to you my money ONLY AFTER you have proven (with facts) that you are capable of doing what you want to do.. otherwise let's see you on release time.
Completely your choice, but the constant attacks against KI gets really old.

 

The F35 is the worst decision they could ever made, probably they believed that developing a "unknown" aircraft would have been easier (ppl does know nothing about it, so we can just invent everything: the flying model, the avionics.. who will notice it's completely off?), but ppl aren't that stupid.. we'll apart some of them (316?).
So now anyone that wants to see this project come to fruition is stupid? Congratulations you just violated the forum rules...

 

There is a lot known about the aircraft, a little research goes a long way...

 

Now KI will ask for money elsewhere... this project will never see the light as someone would imagine (DCS level module) .. if not in several years... by that time we will have more concrete aircraft released (hopefully).
And when they do deliver what will you say? How much crow will you eat?

 

And to be honest.. man.. the F35 (I mean the real one) is overpriced crap, made only to steal money here and there... and those countries participating into the project are figuring it right now.. cancelling their orders, turning on something a little more concrete (the good "old" superhornet.. or the Eurofighter).
You could not be further from the truth. The F-35 is not overpriced, in fact it's less than an F-22. It has more capabilities than any aircraft flying. A four-ship F-35 flight can engage more targets, both air to ground and air to air, simultaneously than a larger flight of any other aircraft.

 

Most countries are not pulling out of the F-35 program, that is an outright lie on your part. No nation has actually pulled out of the program yet. Several nations have looked at reducing their initial order, but still plan to order their original intended amount. Most nations, due to kenyesian economics, are in a budget crunch that has nothing to do with the F-35 program. In fact Turkey increased their intended total order from 100 to 120...

 

The "good" old superhornet or Eurofighter are great aircraft, they simply cannot compete with an F-35.

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And to be honest.. man.. the F35 (I mean the real one) is overpriced crap, made only to steal money here and there... and those countries participating into the project are figuring it right now.. cancelling their orders, turning on something a little more concrete (the good "old" superhornet.. or the Eurofighter).

 

This has nothing to do with this thread.

 

Should be posted here: http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=35070

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but ppl aren't that stupid.. we'll apart some of them (316?).

 

A little harsh dont you think ???..

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...in both cases something is shown, if it's not enough for you then fair-enough, don't participate in the campaign...

 

Which explains their failure I guess. What they've shown was not enough for so many people...

 

You're just one of these people that love to think they speak for everyone else, you're not. That community you like to define as undemanding compulsive buyers is probably the complete opposite, it's not compulsive, it is dedicated, it is not undemanding but incredibly exigent and acute customers like most niche communities. Yes some aircraft are vastly more popular than others.

 

Well, the guy was probably exaggerating when he talked about DCS Paper Plane, but he's got point. Yes, some planes are more popular than others, but I think that every "mainstream" module (F-18, Mig-29, Harrier, you know what I mean) would be in similar sales numbers as the previous modules. Same for F-35.

 

And yes, many people here do buy all the modules, not always to fly them day and night, but sometimes only to try them out or just to support the devs. So please don't make the same mistake you're criticizing and don't speak for "the community".

 

The F35 is the worst decision they could ever made, probably they believed that developing a "unknown" aircraft would have been easier (ppl does know nothing about it, so we can just invent everything: the flying model, the avionics.. who will notice it's completely off?)

 

Really? We have some people around here who know quite a bit about real F-35, including a crew chief...

 

 

but ppl aren't that stupid.. we'll apart some of them (316?)

 

Great. Now the situation has developed into name-calling. Yes, maybe some of them are little easy to convince, but calling them all outright idiots? :doh:

 

And what about me? I haven't pledged, because I haven't seen enough evidence, but on the other hand, I don't share your hating point of view towards KI. Tell me, am I stupid too?

 

Now KI will ask for money elsewhere... this project will never see the light as someone would imagine (DCS level module) .. if not in several years... by that time we will have more concrete aircraft released (hopefully).

 

You seem to be happy that there will be on potential DCS module less. Can I ask why? Maybe more diversity should actually help DCS, no?

 

And to be honest.. man.. the F35 (I mean the real one) is overpriced crap, made only to steal money here and there... and those countries participating into the project are figuring it right now.. cancelling their orders, turning on something a little more concrete (the good "old" superhornet.. or the Eurofighter).

 

And who cares? How many Ka-50's were produced, and how many combat action have they seen? Not much, right? And does it stop us from enjoying Black Shark?

 

I'd happily fly overpriced crap if properly simulated, shame on me.

 

Maybe there would have been more if they didn't have a few dedicated haters trying to scuttle their project?

 

Well, it's always easier to see causes of the failure on the other side... But maybe you overestimate those "haters" a bit.

 

 

But honestly, this discussion is getting a bit boring. It seems that there are only two opinions to KI, both of them extreme and not entirely true IMO. Life is not black and white, guys.:smartass:

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Speak for yourself. Based on what I know, KI has the experience, knowledge and access to make this happen.

 

Facts, not words.

 

Maybe there would have been more if they didn't have a few dedicated haters trying to scuttle their project? Sure they could have done things differently to reach a larger audience - that is life...

 

There's no hater that can fight facts. On the other side they can fight a bunch of "promises".

 

So now anyone that wants to see this project come to fruition is stupid? Congratulations you just violated the forum rules...

 

I never said or wrote that, you're interpreting my words in the wrong way, so please do not put in my a mouth a phrase that I never wrote (this would be certainly against the forum rules). To reply to your question then, my answer is: "No, I did not". There's certainly some stupid people in the world, but I never labeled anyone of this forum with that word. If anything I would call those ppl who pledged: "extremely naïve".


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These "Promises" are supported by ED. Aren't you just so cool, being all skeptical and everything? Here's a fact, KI has experience with this field, look on their website, also here's a fact, Wags made the first post in this thread, not eagle13. If you want to bash third party developers because it's cool, make a separate thread to do so.

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I never said or wrote that, you're interpreting my words in the wrong way, so please do not put in my a mouth a phrase that I never wrote (this would be certainly against the forum rules). To reply to your question then, my answer is: "No, I did not". There's certainly some stupid people in the world, but I never labeled anyone of this forum with that word. If anything I would call those ppl who pledged: "extremely naïve".

 

but ppl aren't that stupid.. we'll apart some of them (316?).

 

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Here's a fact, KI has experience with this field, look on their website,

 

Ok, I don't get it. Have you looked at their website?

What exactly about that is convincing? They make Simpits that look very nice and that's about it.

Everything else I see there is a section for the DCS F35 and Flighttime (whatever that is) which are both WIP.

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Why bother with npole? It's apparent that he neither get's the idea behind kickstarter, nor does he understand what the real F35 is about. ("Facts"... Yeah, yeah, ok :P)

 

It seems he is just upset because KI didn't chose a plane to develope he likes and now starts trolling around. So just let him do this as long as he want's to.

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Why bother with npole? It's apparent that he neither get's the idea behind kickstarter, nor does he understand what the real F35 is about. ("Facts"... Yeah, yeah, ok :P)

 

It seems he is just upset because KI didn't chose a plane to develope he likes and now starts trolling around. So just let him do this as long as he want's to.

 

I don't care if he get the idea behind KS or F-35. The fact that he is trolling around should be investigated by moderator, and if he did break any rule then receive the consequences accordingly.

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The problem is exactly this.. KI did not proven to be capable of doing what he claimed, it's just a bunch of words: we can do this, we can do that, but the facts (and the money) is something else.

In your opinion.

 

In fact only 316 people trustem them
You're confused. 316 people donated. How many trusted isn't counted anywhere.

 

The F35 is the worst decision they could ever made, probably they believed that developing a "unknown" aircraft would have been easier (ppl does know nothing about it, so we can just invent everything: the flying model, the avionics.. who will notice it's completely off?), but ppl aren't that stupid.. we'll apart some of them (316?).
This is something invented. Provide a shred of evidence for anything you've said here.

 

A reason to expect this project to fail has yet to come up, so I'm yet to think that it will go down. Unless you're trying really hard not to set yourself up for disappointment, I don't see any reason to go along with these exaggerations.

 

There's no hater that can fight facts. On the other side they can fight a bunch of "promises".

 

It can be easy with misinformation.

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These "Promises" are supported by ED. Aren't you just so cool, being all skeptical and everything? Here's a fact, KI has experience with this field, look on their website, also here's a fact, Wags made the first post in this thread, not eagle13. If you want to bash third party developers because it's cool, make a separate thread to do so.

 

Again, i'm interested into the facts, and I operate of logic. It's not a matter of like (or not) a particular aircraft, neither about third party modules.. in example I don't think I would ever fly the Mig21 (talking about another third party developer), but I recognize the reason behind that choice.

I'm not there to "bash" em because I don't like the Mig21, it wouldn't make sense! I'm interested into the DCS success (nor because I earn money from it, but because it will continue to exists.. giving to me fun).

 

Now talking about the fun, what I'm worried is that inaccurate third party modules will step into DCS, transforming a "serious" simulator into something else, at that point I will bail out.. the problem is that there's really not many places where to go. :)

 

To resume: it's not about KI; it's not about the F35.. it's about the consequence = the possibility that DCS will dive towards the inaccuracy, becoming less and less simulative.

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I guess most are like me, who thinks this will never see the light of day.

 

I'm afraid of the same, but I sincerely wish to be wrong on this one. I'd like to fly it one day.

 

To resume: it's not about KI; it's not about the F35.. it's about the consequence = the possibility that DCS will dive towards the inaccuracy, becoming less and less simulative.

 

I understand your concerns. I think nobody here wants DCS to turn into semi-arcade game. But right now, we don't have enough reason to believe this is the case.

 

After all DCS is ED's baby and I hope they will pick their partners wisely, so DCS can grow and flourish.

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