213 Posted May 22, 2012 Share Posted May 22, 2012 You mean the ground texture in the last screenshot? It appears to be normal mapped. i wasn't referring to that. read what i was responding to and look up what mipmap means. there is no change to the terrain mesh, otherwise shadows wouldn't work properly from a distance. the reason terrain looks less detailed in the distance is because the texture has been mipmapped. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blaze Posted May 22, 2012 Share Posted May 22, 2012 i wasn't referring to that. read what i was responding to and look up what mipmap means. there is no change to the terrain mesh, otherwise shadows wouldn't work properly from a distance. the reason terrain looks less detailed in the distance is because the texture has been mipmapped. I'm sure though that at some point LOD's have to be built into the terrain mesh to keep performance up... Luckybob, correct me if I'm wrong. i7 7700K | 32GB RAM | GTX 1080Ti | Rift CV1 | TM Warthog | Win 10 "There will always be people with a false sense of entitlement. You can want it, you can ask for it, but you don't automatically deserve it. " Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nate--IRL-- Posted May 22, 2012 Share Posted May 22, 2012 I'm sure though that at some point LOD's have to be built into the terrain mesh to keep performance up... Luckybob, correct me if I'm wrong. They are called clipmaps I think - there was mention of the use of them in regard to Nevada IIRC. Nate Ka-50 AutoPilot/stabilisation system description and operation by IvanK- Essential Reading Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raven68 Posted May 22, 2012 Share Posted May 22, 2012 Always best to search because some people will no doubt say "use the search function" BUT. Expect a few airfields. Nellis and area 51 have been in screenshots. Square mileage, ummmm, big? But not crazy big. I was going to compare it to the Black Sea map, but its not exactly the same because the Black Sea map is more rectangular since you have the ocean as a limiting area, where as Nevada can be thought of more of a square. As far as cities, its Nevada, not California or Arizona :) the biggest one to expect would be Las Vegas. Thank for the response Bob. I was trying to do a rough comparison also to the Black Sea map. My thinking was since Nellis and Las Vegas being tucked down in the southern point of Nevada being near the border of those 2 states that it may be a possibility to consider the 2 cities that I mentioned. Considering the Nellis Airbase being the central point of the Nevada map. Please don's slap me too hard for my assumption. Intel i5-9600K @ 3.7GHz Gigabyte Z370XP SLI Mobo G.SKILL Ripjaws V Series 32GB (2 x 16GB) 288-Pin DDR4 GIGABYTE GeForce RTX 2070 8GB 256-Bit GDDR6(Assume the latest driver version) Thermaltake Water 3.0 Certified Liquid Cooling System Windows 10 Professional Oculus Rift-S /TrackIR 5 in case VR dies Thrustmaster HOTAS Warthog w/ Thrustmaster T-Flight Rudder Pedals Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALDEGA Posted May 22, 2012 Share Posted May 22, 2012 I'm sure though that at some point LOD's have to be built into the terrain mesh to keep performance up...The terrain mesh in DCS appears to be static (and rather undetailed). The detail is the same up close as it is 20 miles ahead ... Outtera has a dynamic terrain mesh which show much detail (geometry) up close and little in the distance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silver_Dragon Posted May 22, 2012 Share Posted May 22, 2012 Nevada Training grounds map The terrain mesh in DCS appears to be static (and rather undetailed). The detail is the same up close as it is 20 miles ahead ... Outtera has a dynamic terrain mesh which show much detail (geometry) up close and little in the distance. Outerra has a graphic motor only........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALDEGA Posted May 22, 2012 Share Posted May 22, 2012 Outerra has a graphic motor only........And that is the exact reason why I referred to it, not for its aircraft simulation ... ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luckybob9 Posted May 22, 2012 Share Posted May 22, 2012 I'm sure though that at some point LOD's have to be built into the terrain mesh to keep performance up... Luckybob, correct me if I'm wrong. Im not sure how much I can actually say, but this would seem like a good idea to include... The current Black Sea map has LOD's for the ground. I think currently they just switch between texture size, but there should be no reason why it could not do geometry as well since it is just a different model. Did I give away enough hints? Nevada map contributer EDM Modeling tools FAQ: http://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=1418067&postcount=1 Seo libh a chairde is chanadh liom. Líonaigí'n oíche le greann is le spórt. Seo sláinte na gcarad atá imithe uainn. Mar cheo an tsléibhe uaine, iad imithe go deo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALDEGA Posted May 22, 2012 Share Posted May 22, 2012 there is no change to the terrain mesh, otherwise shadows wouldn't work properly from a distance.Why not? Check Outtera. the reason terrain looks less detailed in the distance is because the texture has been mipmapped.The mip maps could use tweaking. In the current Caucasus map the difference between the mip maps is sometimes too noticeable. (see attached screenshots) Moreover the distance for the different mip map stages could use adjusting. This could affect fillrate noticeable though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALDEGA Posted May 22, 2012 Share Posted May 22, 2012 (edited) I think currently they just switch between texture sizeThat's the mip mapping. Sadly, it's (too) obvious ;) LOD's are ideally designed so that the difference between them is not too noticeably (at least when using high graphics settings). The Caucasus terrain mip map changes are particularly noticeable since they were done manually, there is too much difference in the content. They aren't auto-generated. Edited May 22, 2012 by ALDEGA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luckybob9 Posted May 22, 2012 Share Posted May 22, 2012 It is using a different physical texture file for the second LOD. Is that still considered mipmapping? My understanding of a mipmap was a single texture that had multiple sizes on it, and the engine would be intelligent to only pull X amount of pixels at a time Nevada map contributer EDM Modeling tools FAQ: http://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=1418067&postcount=1 Seo libh a chairde is chanadh liom. Líonaigí'n oíche le greann is le spórt. Seo sláinte na gcarad atá imithe uainn. Mar cheo an tsléibhe uaine, iad imithe go deo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALDEGA Posted May 22, 2012 Share Posted May 22, 2012 As far as I know, you can auto generate them or manually create them (= allows for manual optimization). The different mip map textures can show something completely different if you want. In the case of DCS, they appear to be manually created since there is too much difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Team NineLine Posted May 22, 2012 ED Team Share Posted May 22, 2012 Im not sure how much I can actually say, but this would seem like a good idea to include... The current Black Sea map has LOD's for the ground. I think currently they just switch between texture size, but there should be no reason why it could not do geometry as well since it is just a different model. Did I give away enough hints? Will the Black Sea map be updated for the release of E.D.G.E. then? Forum Rules • My YouTube • My Discord - NineLine#0440• **How to Report a Bug** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blaze Posted May 22, 2012 Share Posted May 22, 2012 Will the Black Sea map be updated for the release of E.D.G.E. then? It's been said it will not be updated. Too much work. i7 7700K | 32GB RAM | GTX 1080Ti | Rift CV1 | TM Warthog | Win 10 "There will always be people with a false sense of entitlement. You can want it, you can ask for it, but you don't automatically deserve it. " Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nate--IRL-- Posted May 22, 2012 Share Posted May 22, 2012 (edited) Will the Black Sea map be updated for the release of E.D.G.E. then? No - AFAIK the black sea region would have to be started from scratch in EDGE as the current terrain is not compatible - and no it is not just a question of importing 3d models, lots more goes on under the hood besides that. Nate Edited May 22, 2012 by Nate--IRL-- Ka-50 AutoPilot/stabilisation system description and operation by IvanK- Essential Reading Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterP Posted May 22, 2012 Share Posted May 22, 2012 Will the Black Sea map be updated for the release of E.D.G.E. then? Tomorrow morning , probably at -6 UTC Sorry, cant hold it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luckybob9 Posted May 22, 2012 Share Posted May 22, 2012 As far as I know, you can auto generate them or manually create them (= allows for manual optimization). The different mip map textures can show something completely different if you want. In the case of DCS, they appear to be manually created since there is too much difference. The early beta Nevada had the same texture but resized to stretch out. I cant remember exactly what it had, but lets say it had a single 1024 texture per tile, the LOD for that would be 4 tiles combine into one, and the 4 tile textures combined and a single 1024 texture. The difference in the mountain that you posted is most likely the noise file not coming through on the distant screenshot. Nevada map contributer EDM Modeling tools FAQ: http://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=1418067&postcount=1 Seo libh a chairde is chanadh liom. Líonaigí'n oíche le greann is le spórt. Seo sláinte na gcarad atá imithe uainn. Mar cheo an tsléibhe uaine, iad imithe go deo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luckybob9 Posted May 22, 2012 Share Posted May 22, 2012 Tomorrow morning , probably at -6 UTC Sorry, cant hold it... why!!!!! this was classified information. brb need to do damage control! No - AFAIK the black sea region would have to be started from scratch in EDGE as the current terrain is not compatible - and no it is just a question of importing 3d models, lots more goes on under the hood besides that. Nate Your knowledge is correct 1 Nevada map contributer EDM Modeling tools FAQ: http://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=1418067&postcount=1 Seo libh a chairde is chanadh liom. Líonaigí'n oíche le greann is le spórt. Seo sláinte na gcarad atá imithe uainn. Mar cheo an tsléibhe uaine, iad imithe go deo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ALDEGA Posted May 22, 2012 Share Posted May 22, 2012 At least we're another day closer to the Nevada terrain release. (+ Myanmar :D) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Team NineLine Posted May 22, 2012 ED Team Share Posted May 22, 2012 No - AFAIK the black sea region would have to be started from scratch in EDGE as the current terrain is not compatible - and no it is just a question of importing 3d models, lots more goes on under the hood besides that. Nate Just wondering as it sounds like the maps will be quite different once all is said and done (under the hood). Will that hurt the performance of the Black Sea Map with the E.D.G.E. at all? Forum Rules • My YouTube • My Discord - NineLine#0440• **How to Report a Bug** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterP Posted May 22, 2012 Share Posted May 22, 2012 Originally Posted by PeterP Tomorrow morning , probably at -6 UTC Sorry, cant hold it...why!!!!! this was classified information. brb need to do damage control! :chair:...:badmood:..:cry:... ouch! - my back hurts! OK,OK... it will be probably something like Tomorrow morning at -6 UTC + several/many Moons. ... happy now? :prop: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nate--IRL-- Posted May 22, 2012 Share Posted May 22, 2012 Just wondering as it sounds like the maps will be quite different once all is said and done (under the hood). Will that hurt the performance of the Black Sea Map with the E.D.G.E. at all? Not at all, the black won't be using EDGE, it will stay as it is. Nate Ka-50 AutoPilot/stabilisation system description and operation by IvanK- Essential Reading Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ED Team NineLine Posted May 23, 2012 ED Team Share Posted May 23, 2012 Not at all, the black won't be using EDGE, it will stay as it is. Nate I thought EDGE was a replacement for the current Graphics Engine, so either the game will use 2 different graphics engines depending on content loaded or I really dont understand what EDGE is lol... Forum Rules • My YouTube • My Discord - NineLine#0440• **How to Report a Bug** Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blaze Posted May 23, 2012 Share Posted May 23, 2012 I thought EDGE was a replacement for the current Graphics Engine, so either the game will use 2 different graphics engines depending on content loaded or I really dont understand what EDGE is lol... Correct, EDGE will only be used for the Nevada map (and most likely future maps as well) and not for the current Black Sea map, which will use the current engine. i7 7700K | 32GB RAM | GTX 1080Ti | Rift CV1 | TM Warthog | Win 10 "There will always be people with a false sense of entitlement. You can want it, you can ask for it, but you don't automatically deserve it. " Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nate--IRL-- Posted May 23, 2012 Share Posted May 23, 2012 EDGE is the rendering engine Nevada is built upon, it allows the use of several DX11 (I think) features to improve the rendering performance. To take advantage of these features the terrain is built with to a design that uses things like clipmaps etc. In order for the Black Sea terrain to utilise these features it would have to be completely built again from scratch - this is not going to happen any time soon, if at all. I'll say never. Nate Ka-50 AutoPilot/stabilisation system description and operation by IvanK- Essential Reading Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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