Scaring off the newbies?

[bluepilot76]

Hi Folks,

I just wanted to make a light hearted and gentle reminder that you CAN fly this sim with a cheap joystick, and untill you try and do something complex like start the engines or fire a maverick, you can probably get a lot of enjoyment out of just flying around and crashing and working things out for yourself.

 

In my case I did find that I was warned off Blackshark because it was soooo complicated from forums I got the impression that you certainly could not do it without reading the manual. When I eventually decided "what the hell Im getting it anyway", I found that I was blowing stuff up within a couple of hours. Its not that hard. I STILL cant start the engines, but I know that if I am ever that way inclined I can read a manual and find out. However it turns out the KA50 was not really my cup of tea.

 

Anyway my point is, sometimes looking on here, I would get the impression there is no point buying the sim if you cant afford a TM Warthog, or an X52 or a set of hand crafted aluminium rudder pedals, which is totally not true, and there is also no point buying it if you dont have 6 weeks to put into groundschool before getting into the cockpit. Most people dont have that much money or time to devote to a sim. To all those people I say dont worry, just get stuck in with what whatever stick you have, and whatever time you have. Even if its only 5 minutes whilst you wait for the rice to boil, just get stuck into an instant action and you will soon start enjoying yourself, even if you dont know what your doing!

 

Of course if you find you want to start the engines and no matter what buttons you press they wont start, or your HUD is all wonky, Then the manual would be a good idea, then the video tutorials and of course ultimately all the people on here who are happy to help!

[bluepilot76]

pS You DO need a Track IR though

 

HAHA Only Joking!

 

logs out quickly....

[SmokeyTheLung]

looks like someone needs to RTFM!!!!!:book:

[Caspar]

Hi bluepilot.

 

Im glad to hear. Some posts are a bit scaring. Just startet off with my Logitech Extreme 3d pro, think it'll do fine for my needs, it was what I had from FSX anyway...

[159th_Viper]

Hi Folks.....

 

You are quite right.

 

It is sometimes very easy for us Veterans and other members who have just caught on quickly to forget just how intimidating the SIM is, from FC2 to the current reiteration, the Warthog. I remember being intimidated by the A10A In LockOn Gold with the training tutorial having me do an Immelmann turn???? WTF!!!! Whatever happened to 'Up' and 'Down'? Barrel roll? Split-S? Speak English gawddammit!

 

:P

 

I slowly figured it all out and it takes time. To that end, DCS is currently far more user-friendly than it's predecessors insofar as that it caters from Game Mode to Simulation Mode and here's the important bit: It is eminently scalable from Game Mode to Sim mode. In addition to the Flight Manual, there's also the Quick-Start manual (often overlooked but an important reference for the newcomer). Together with the Wiki, Youtube and forums, there is a wealth of info to aid.

 

Mirroring my inevitable progression in knowledge was the inevitable 'upgrade' of hardware and peripherals......It all comes with time and is definitely not necessary at the outset. In my case it just happened until you blink your eyes one day and you're surrounded by wires wondering WTF happened?

 

So yeah - we'll do well to remember our first couple of weeks in the Virtual Flight SIM world and tailor our advice accordingly when dealing with newcomers to the hobby :)

[Krippz]

As the OP has noted obviously you can fly the sim without a HOTAS (heck you could even do it with a keyboard or Xbox 360 controller) whether or not that's optimal is an entirely different matter. With modifiers a traditional joystick is very effective in DCS A-10C.

 

Difficulty in a sim varies from individual to individual. I personally do not view DCS A-10C as "difficult" if you RTFM and put some stick time in you'll be on your way (I personally was able to start the aircraft, takeoff, land, employ weapons effectively after 6 hours of book and stick time).

 

Guess the moral of the story is to play the sim the way that you want to play it; don't allow public opinion to deter you from enjoying the sim the way that you want to enjoy it.

[Username455]

I'll agree with this tread. I'm a newbie myself.. Even asked this forum if I should bother buying this game since I have zero sim experience. It was intimidating, but well worth it. If you love flight then that's all you need. Take the time to set up your controls and then go! You'll get the hang of it either through the training, these forums, or trial and error. Just yesterday I learned to use the maverick, ccrp, and ccip (well sorta, might not be able to repeat) and it was a blast!! And remember, I have no idea what I'm doing haha!

 

Disclaimer: this game will probably make you want to spend lots and lots of money. I'm looking at multiple monitors, rudder pedals, trackIR(upgrade from facetracknoir), and multiple iPad apps! Anything to add to the experience :)

[GGTharos]

Forget multiple monitors. Get a 40" LED backlit TV instead - something like one of those 40" 60Hz Samsungs (the 60Hz models are going cheap, and yet they're quality!).

[mooshim]

You are quite right.

 

- we'll do well to remember our first couple of weeks in the Virtual Flight SIM world and tailor our advice accordingly when dealing with newcomers to the hobby :)

 

This is a damned good post and I'm glad I read it.

 

+1 rep

 

It was tough enough to read...my eyes kept dropping down to evontroy's cleavage.

Edited June 22, 2011 by mooshim
gratuitous cleavage comment

[MemphisBelle]

Guess the moral of the story is to play the sim the way that you want to play it; don't allow public opinion to deter you from enjoying the sim the way that you want to enjoy it.

 

Sorry, I´ve to quote it...that sentence actually earns some reps.

 

Agreeing with my previous speakers (writers).

HOTAS, TrackIR and what not is not quite needed, it´s simply handy and makes the game looking awesome. Thats all. But it has to be mentioned that while in Multiplayer vs Games, other players would definately be in advantage against players without such a hardware...on the other hand, back in FC1 I remember a "girl" she easily beated every other Pilot...in vs dogfights...just by using keyboard only.

[Krippz]

This is a damned good post and I'm glad I read it.

 

+1 rep

 

It was tough enough to read...my eyes kept dropping down to evontroy's cleavage.

 

:lol::megalol::smilewink:

[Viruz77]

I cant resist after reading posts from the "newbies" :joystick:

 

Its so wonderfull to see so much "newbies" here who are bringing

the "simulation-genre" back to life. This genre was so often called

dead, i cant remember how often i heard this.

 

I was wondering since the release of Black Shark if this new sort

of Simulation will fear too much new players who are probably

interestet. But i was proofen wrong (thanks to god ^^).

 

I am playing sims since the 80s (Commodore C64 and Amiga included,

anyone remembering this machines? ^^) and i have bought nearly all

sims ever released. But since the launch of Black shark i can say,

i have only 2 Simulations. Black Shark and Warthog. I am not able

call all other as "simulations" anymore, they are just "Games".

I recall many voices who said "who wants to play a game where you

have to switch thousand buttons and switches?" and

"i dont think that this will sell much"

 

So i want to thank ED so much, you are exceptional. And i have to

thank you again for dont letting the sim genre dying like the others

(microprose, DID, Janes combat simulations and so on). Keep up the

work i will buy any module you ever release, i promise :)

 

And no, i dont get payed for this text :)

[S77th-konkussion]

This is a damned good post and I'm glad I read it.

 

+1 rep

 

It was tough enough to read...my eyes kept dropping down to evontroy's cleavage.

 

 

what? Is there a conversation going on here? OK go ahead...

[Toothcake]

People definitely shouldn't let the absence of a primo joystick scare them away. I recently bought a HOTAS stick (that should be here tomorrow. Yay!) but since I bought the sim in October, I've been playing with a Logitech Extreme 3D Pro and the keyboard. The convenience factor isn't there with a simple stick, but you can still learn, play and have a blast.

 

Viva la $30 joysticks!

[LostOblivion]

I agree with the thread starter. Albeit a much, much more advanced and to the absolute detail simulation than most other flying sims out there (FS, etc), it is not hard to learn how to start the A-10 and fly it. This can all be done in a few hours of fiddling with it.

 

I don't really understand the comments people make to the new-to-DCS simmers wanting to try out the hog for the first time only to be faced with a wall of negative feedback of how hard it is starting the A-10 and flying it, having to read the entire manual, etc, because this is really not necessary, and flying the hog is really easy if you just put a few hours into it--like in any game really.

 

What takes time, however, also for real pilots, is learning about how the systems work, why they work, and why you need them, what to do in certain situations, how to handle a bogey callout using the navigation computer and bullseye navigation, how to operate the ILS, how to and how not to speak on the radio with your wingmen, how to (most simmers don't need this) interpret weather conditions and handle your aircraft accordingly, how to make sure that the LGB lands on that IFV without blowing up the 83 civvies living in the building right next to it, etc, etc.

 

This is what takes time, not the flying. The flying is easy. And even blowing stuff up in this sim is very easy once you've done it once or twice.

 

Having said that, this is a throughrough sim, and if you want the most of it, and you probably will once you've become so proud from starting that damned pig successfully all by yourself, you will want to read up a bit on how to do certain things.

 

Happy flying!

 

Edit: Oh, and I played this sim myself for two months with my Sidewinder Presicion Pro before deciding to buy myself the TM HOTAS Warthog and a set of rudders, so it's not really a MUST to spend hundreds of silver to enjoy this game, although you probably will once you've become addicted. ;)

Edited June 22, 2011 by LostOblivion

[GGTharos]

What takes time, however, also for real pilots, is learning about how the systems work,

 

No, that's just aircraft operation. What REALLY takes time, is learning how to fly the aircraft. That's before you ever even get to discuss weapons, weaopn systems, and tactics. Learning to FLY alone is a 1-2 year run for air forces, IIRC.

 

This is what takes time, not the flying. The flying is easy. And even blowing stuff up in this sim is very easy once you've done it once or twice.

Wrong. In real life it's the flying right up front. That should make you wonder what it is that you don't know ;)

 

(Incidentally though, non-airforce flying - like your private license, is a matter of putting in 40 hours in the air to qualify. More or less. Should raise a few more questions!)

[TulsA-10]

I am a "Newbie" to A-10C and have been a flight sim fan since FS 98 and have always dreamed of someone making a sim as close to 100% reality as possible. Jane's USAF was a dream until the software would no longer run on newer versions of windows properly.

 

The A-10 has been my favorite combat aircraft ever since the days of G.I Joe and my little blue cobra jet..lol. So i welcome the challenge of a complex sim especially the A-10. I'm one of those crazy people who get excited to read a 670+ page flight manual and adding more on top of that. For me the point is to get as close to reality as i can so this is perfect for me.

 

I have spent the last month printing and organizing the flight manual into sections in color coded binders for quick reference. So if i need to sit in ground school for months learing every in and out before going up so be it.

As I have been learning i have been acquiring hardware and tweaks so when i am ready to lift the nose wheel i will have all of the basics behind me and that is what i call fun.

Sick i know right?..lol

 

I hope and pray that dcs keeps putting out authentic flight simulations because i have been depresed a little ever since Jane's died. I will be flying this sim for years to come so if it takes me a year to retain everything im all in!

 

If your not as sick as i am then just hit the game mode button.

[bluepilot76]

Glad to see so much positivity on the thread! I certainly dont want to stand on the toes of those that DO enjoy to read the manuals first, its all good. Everyone can folow their own path right!

 

Respect to the cheap stick brigade. I think we should start a new squadron!

 

I think DCS will provide a good home to flight sim nuts for many years to come! Lets get as many in as possible!

[159th_Viper]

Respect to the cheap stick brigade. I think we should start a new squadron!

 

Once the Bug Bites you'll have to rename to the 'Cheap Stick in Reserve' Brigade.

 

:D

[rextar]

Hi bluepilot.

 

Im glad to hear. Some posts are a bit scaring. Just startet off with my Logitech Extreme 3d pro, think it'll do fine for my needs, it was what I had from FSX anyway...

 

Itworks great i agree!:thumbup:

[Bucic]

I have to admit that some of my posts might have given that impression in the past. Thank you for bringing that issue out. I'll be more considerate of the fact that you can have hours and hours of genuine satisfaction of DCS without even taking off at all! It's not only about learning systems. There's also spectating (is the word right?), recording videos (a perfect platform for that), mission/campaign making, participating in the forum discussions...

[celticcoho]

I have to admit that some of my posts might have given that impression in the past. Thank you for bringing that issue out. I'll be more considerate of the fact that you can have hours and hours of genuine satisfaction of DCS without even taking off at all! It's not only about learning systems. There's also spectating (is the word right?), recording videos (a perfect platform for that), mission/campaign making, participating in the forum discussions...

 

It's how we all learn, TY for this forum!!!Expert, Novice, Newbe, All seem welcome here, I like it.:thumbup:

[EbonySeraphim]

Once the Bug Bites you'll have to rename to the 'Cheap Stick in Reserve' Brigade.

 

:D

Roger that! After failing to get Janes F/A-18 and Janes USAF to install and run in Window 7 64-bit or run effectively in a VM with Windows 2000 or XP earlier this year, I discovered DCS: A-10 back in April. Before dropping $60 on it, I did some homework and found out that Eagle Dynamics had been around for a while and made LockOn. So I grabbed LockOn: Platinum and a Thrustmaster T.Flight HOTAS X from MicroCenter. That's when the bug hit --

 

Later that week I ordered TrackIR5, purchased DCS:A-10 on Steam, and exchanged my T.Flight for a TM Warthog. One week after that, I dropped another $270 on Saitek Pro Combat Pedals and MFD Cougar. I have no regrets -- but then again, I have a good job and disposable income. The only thing preventing me from getting triple monitor right now is space, convenience, and the fact that it would cause me to get a GTX 590 - and I built my rig less than a year ago.

[GGTharos]

Like I said ... forget the triple monitor. Get a 40" LED Backlit TV. It'll cost you as much as the triple monitor and card upgrade, possibly less! :P

 

I reccomend SAMSUNG.

[Ninjaofdoom]

Forget multiple monitors. Get a 40" LED backlit TV instead - something like one of those 40" 60Hz Samsungs (the 60Hz models are going cheap, and yet they're quality!).

 

I agree with this. I thought about multi-mon and then just got a deal on a 60hz 46" toshiba. Works AMAZING. :thumbup: