Problem with Warthog Throttle

[Ziggy]

Succellus,

iMac is the model name. OSX is the OS and Apple tell us they make all the components for their computers.

As I said, I have a partition where I run XP so I can fly the Black Shark and the Hog and I do most everything else in "mac world."

I've done some preliminary research. I know the iMacs are made in china (beautifully made by the way) but everything is under the Apple banner as far as I can tell.

[Wolf Rider]

I flew Warthogs from May through November on an Asus P5B Deluxe...and it was on that motherboard that I did the stress test attempting to force my preproduction unit to fail after some of the earlier reports of failures came out.

 

Not counting the stress testing, the WH was plugged into a monitor the majority of the time, with power being applied and removed several times a day (cycling the monitor). Also spent a few weeks plugged into a motherboard USB port.

 

Yes, plugging into the monitor most of the time does weaken the argument against it being the motherboard...but as I said there were weeks of regular use plugged into the motherboard, AND a pretty hardcore few days of testing with all kinds of unplugging, plugging, rebooting, power on/off etc. trying to get it to fail. I was taking notes on everything I did so that if I suddenly had it brick on me I'd have an "activity log" I could submit to TM. No luck.

 

I've never had the stick itself plugged into anything but the MB, but again...that's not terribly significant since the throttle is by far the more likely failure, when it's happened.

 

Just a data point.

 

 

what was your switch/ button configurations though?

[icemaker]

I flew Warthogs from May through November on an Asus P5B Deluxe...and it was on that motherboard that I did the stress test attempting to force my preproduction unit to fail after some of the earlier reports of failures came out.

 

Not counting the stress testing, the WH was plugged into a monitor the majority of the time, with power being applied and removed several times a day (cycling the monitor). Also spent a few weeks plugged into a motherboard USB port.

 

Yes, plugging into the monitor most of the time does weaken the argument against it being the motherboard...but as I said there were weeks of regular use plugged into the motherboard, AND a pretty hardcore few days of testing with all kinds of unplugging, plugging, rebooting, power on/off etc. trying to get it to fail. I was taking notes on everything I did so that if I suddenly had it brick on me I'd have an "activity log" I could submit to TM. No luck.

 

I've never had the stick itself plugged into anything but the MB, but again...that's not terribly significant since the throttle is by far the more likely failure, when it's happened.

 

Just a data point.

You're right teej, but it seems the problem comes when you plug at the same time a peripheral that uses a lot of power from usb (Scanner, Hardrive not self powered...) the USB chipset can't handle to manage the power asked and the Throttle doesn't supports the power variations.

[sndwv]

Weren't there any throttle failures with people using the WH itself from a powered USB hub? That should rule out failures due to motherboard voltage fluctuations.

[twobells]

I have created a topic for all owners of bricked units to specify their motherboards specs.

Hopefully it will be stickied as we need to sort this out urgently.

 

http://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=66542

[hassata]

My bet is on questionable component suppliers. They'll sort it out in the next batch as with the MFDs. There's a saying in my country Thrustmaster: cheap ends up being expensive.

[Feed]

Weren't there any throttle failures with people using the WH itself from a powered USB hub? That should rule out failures due to motherboard voltage fluctuations.

 

Yes - mine. I had it connected via an externally-powered hub. My motherboard is an Intel DG33FB (Stop that snickering!):(

[jerda]

I thought my MFD went out today - but i had accidentally unplugged the cord :)

 

When my throttle went out, i was maxed out on usb ports, running everything at the same time. I also had a hub running several ~5 things. I wonder if the load on the power supply caused a strong enough surge when the computer started to cause problems.

[Succellus]

Well So far, so its still very relative, we got:

No throttle briked with ABIT;

No throttle bricked with AMD, so all throttle bricked with Intel.

Throttle seem to brick with every intel range, from L775 up to 1366, no Sandbridge bricked, but there s too few out there to be reliable info.

Taking in acount that asus is one of the most sold brand, due to the single fact its present to the not bricked and bricked, and due the fact that there s many more bricked throttle in the Asus team, i would say:

Intel is the problem, AMD is safe.

The throttle brick with ANY brand with asus being more prone to problem.

 

Now due to the fact that no beta reported brick AFAIK, i would say its probably some " we need to cut cost" or "We need to throw it on the market change the furnisher" or both issue.

 

Now what AMD have that Intel doesn t have on theyr mobo beyond, main chip and mobo controler chip.

 

As for the USB self powered fry, if the energy spike on the mobo toward the USB and its not controled, no matter on what your throttle is plugged he s gonna get the spike. So self powered can dampen the problem but will not solve it.

It seems a (some) component(s) on the WT would not be able to deal with some energy issue.

So far the only ones that can sleep soundly until further notice are AMD owners.

 

PS: i dont think any firmware issue will solve this.

Edited January 28, 2011 by Succellus

[Teej]

what was your switch/ button configurations though?

 

I tried many iterations. I can tell you one thing I didn't ever do much of was holding any of the "momentary" switches on when I plugged it in as I figured that was how they would trigger a reset if there were a way to do so (like the trigger on the Cougar).

 

I tried with as many switches as possible in a "button on" state (forward for a 2 way, anything off center for a 3 way) and with all switches neutral. Max throttle, min throttle, split throttles at opposite ends, etc.

[Teej]

I wonder if the load on the power supply caused a strong enough surge when the computer started to cause problems.

 

Devices are only allowed to pull a certain amount of power...up to 200ma if memory serves...without negotiating with the OS for a higher level of power. The USB controllers tell the OS how much power they can supply and so on. If a device draws more power than it has negotiated for, the OS will shut down the device.

 

Thus I don't believe an unpowered device could cause a "surge" like that.

[Toadster]

Hi guys.

 

My Throttle just packed it in as well (SN: 01865). I tried all the items suggested here with no success. A bit disappointed due to the cost factor in purchasing the unit. So, an e-mail is sent to TM Support and I'll wait to see what they say. I will update any progress that I may have.

 

PC Specs: Alienware Aurora (Mobo 0H869M) BIOS A11 / i7920 O.C @ 3.2 / ATI 5870 1GB DDR5 / 9GB RAM

 

Vendor TM was purchased from: Extreme Gaming Devices, Saskatoon, Saskatchewan, Canada.

 

My Location: Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada

 

PS: to all the people who posted their opinions on why "this" product or "that" product sucks, thanks for wasting my time reading absolute nonsense while trying to see if anyone had a real resolution to this growing problem.

 

Keep it on topic please...

[twobells]

Perhaps we must use external usb hubs that power the unit constantly as a short term fix.

Maybe the ones using usb hubs that DID brick turned off power to the hub at some point at the same time they turned off/on the pc?

Edited January 28, 2011 by twobells

[Slammin]

If it matters, I've not had any issues and I've used my throttle while plugged into mobo usb ports, also my 24" Dell monitor and also my 19" Dell monitor (currently plugged in) usb hub ports.

 

When using the mobo usb ports or when using the 19" monitor usb hub ports, the throttle stays lit when I go into standby. The only way to get the lights out is to unplug it and plug it back in after entering standby, which I usually do every night. When I had it plugged into the 24" monitor's usb hub port, it still would stay lit, but I just hit the power button on the monitor and the lights on the throttle would go out. It stays lit when I power off the 19" monitor.

 

Bottom line, even with Dell, it would seem that they use a different usb hub on the 19" and 24", so I'm not sure how revealing it would be to try to narrow down what mobo might be causing this, especially when out of all the components you might have connected via usb, the only one tanking is the WH throttle.

 

Rather than everyone scample and panic, one thing is for certain and that is the WH throttle seems to have a defect and it does not seem like there is anything an end-user can do to cause, or prevent the failure. Also do keep in mind that not all the throttles are failing too.

 

Also, since noone has reported smoke or burning smells, I tend to think the problem is firmware related and not hardware related and hope TM can produce a firmware that actually does lock the firmware the way they claimed the last firmware update was supposed to do.

[hassata]

that

[twobells]

If it matters, I've not had any issues and I've used my throttle while plugged into mobo usb ports, also my 24" Dell monitor and also my 19" Dell monitor (currently plugged in) usb hub ports.

 

When using the mobo usb ports or when using the 19" monitor usb hub ports, the throttle stays lit when I go into standby. The only way to get the lights out is to unplug it and plug it back in after entering standby, which I usually do every night. When I had it plugged into the 24" monitor's usb hub port, it still would stay lit, but I just hit the power button on the monitor and the lights on the throttle would go out. It stays lit when I power off the 19" monitor.

 

Bottom line, even with Dell, it would seem that they use a different usb hub on the 19" and 24", so I'm not sure how revealing it would be to try to narrow down what mobo might be causing this, especially when out of all the components you might have connected via usb, the only one tanking is the WH throttle.

 

Rather than everyone scample and panic, one thing is for certain and that is the WH throttle seems to have a defect and it does not seem like there is anything an end-user can do to cause, or prevent the failure. Also do keep in mind that not all the throttles are failing too.

 

Also, since noone has reported smoke or burning smells, I tend to think the problem is firmware related and not hardware related and hope TM can produce a firmware that actually does lock the firmware the way they claimed the last firmware update was supposed to do.

 

Your post would have helped more if you had actually stated your motherboard make and spec as well, counter to what you wrote indicating which mobo chipset design cause the brick may be essential to a firmware fix.

Regarding smelling burning components; that is plainly ludicrous as parts fail all the time without creating any Hollywood special effects.

As for 'scrambling and panicking' I've seen none on ED Forums rather the opposite actually so please link me a thread where all this girlish behaviour is going on.

Edited January 29, 2011 by twobells

[Blackrat_UK]

Just got my throttle back from TM a 14 day return trip, all working and now has firmware 20 on it, I think 18 is the latest you can download. Intel and Asus here so fingers crossed.

[twobells]

Just got my throttle back from TM a 14 day return trip, all working and now has firmware 20 on it, I think 18 is the latest you can download. Intel and Asus here so fingers crossed.

 

Firmware 20?

Any chance you could ask TM support to attach it as a file to you?

[Slammin]

Your post would have helped more if you had actually stated your motherboard make and spec as well, counter to what you wrote indicating which mobo chipset design cause the brick may be essential to a firmware fix.

Regarding smelling burning components; that is plainly ludicrous as parts fail all the time without creating any Hollywood special effects.

As for 'scrambling and panicking' I've seen none on ED Forums rather the opposite actually so please link me a thread where all this girlish behaviour is going on.

 

 

Why so adversarial? I have stated my mobo and specs in at least two other threads already in trying to assist. I was just pointing out here that even though both my monitors are Dell, they seem to be using different usb hubs in them.

 

We have several threads already on the subject and as you can see, trying to compile anything when it seems like each day a new thread pops up about it sounds a little like panic to me, but I never called anything girlish, or in any other way criticized any effort of anyone in this community that is trying to help, so why are you attacking me?

 

As far as what I think the problem with the throttle is, that is just my own conclusion and reason for it. I may be way off, but all the same, it is what I think. It must be what TM thinks too since their initial attempt to rememdy it was via firmware patch.

[twobells]

Why so adversarial? I have stated my mobo and specs in at least two other threads already in trying to assist. I was just pointing out here that even though both my monitors are Dell, they seem to be using different usb hubs in them.

 

We have several threads already on the subject and as you can see, trying to compile anything when it seems like each day a new thread pops up about it sounds a little like panic to me, but I never called anything girlish, or in any other way criticized any effort of anyone in this community that is trying to help, so why are you attacking me?

 

As far as what I think the problem with the throttle is, that is just my own conclusion and reason for it. I may be way off, but all the same, it is what I think. It must be what TM thinks too since their initial attempt to rememdy it was via firmware patch.

 

Apologies, I didn't see your other posts :-(

Re: The firmware patch, it seems that TM are sending out throttles with a new firmware (20)

Edited January 29, 2011 by twobells

[Blackrat_UK]

Hmmm, it seems with this new firmware my throttle lights now go off when I shut the computer down, it is in a different USB port though so will try the original when I get home. Before it would stay live unless I switched the PSU off.

 

I am sure TM will be releasing v20 when they are happy to.

[Slammin]

Apologies, I didn't see your other posts :-(

Re: The firmware patch, it seems that TM are sending out throttles with a new firmware (20)

 

 

 

Accepted. Let's cross our fingers that the new firmware patch does actually prevent these failures because I can imagine the frustration and dissapointment some folks are going through with this.

[hassata]

Uh, let's hope the updated firmware doesn't end up bricking some units. I'm almost scared to update.

[Toadster]

Hi again.

 

TM Tech Support has responded to my intial e-mail to them and assigned a trouble ticket number. They first asked what my MoBo was, then they sent a second e-mail with the instructions below.

 

I already had the latest version of the 2010_TMHW_1.exe driver. The only problem is that since my Throttle is not recognized by Win 7 correctly, I cannot set the throttle into "Bulk Mode" which means I cannot complete the Firmware test that they sent me. I sent them the Joystick Firmware results (tmJoyFlashEeprom), but told them that the Throttle will not boot into Bulk Mode with the instruction that they provided (hold the AP Eng and LG Warn silence buttons while plugging the Throttle into the USB port)...

 

Dear Mr. Todd Cormier,

 

Thank you for your request. In order to resolve the issue you have encountered with your HOTAS Warthog, please refer to our response herewith:

In order to correctly assess and solve the problem please follow these steps:

1. download the latest driver package WITHOUT installing it:

ftp://ftp.thrustmaster.com/accessories/pc/hotas/exe/HOTAS_Warthog/2010_TMHW_1.exe

2. download the FSR program WITHOUT installing it:

ftp://ftp.thrustmaster.com/accessories/pc/hotas/exe/HOTAS_Warthog/TMHW_FSR.zip

3. open the Warthog_Fimrware_procedure_v1 11.pdf procedure and follow the instructions;

4. send us the resulted firmware file (very important for future improvement and development).

Feel free to contact us for any other information.

We hope that the information we have provided is useful and has helped to resolve your query. Have a good day and please remember that Thrustmaster Technical Support is at your disposal for any other information you may need. You can reach us via the Web at the following addresses:

 

http://ts.thrustmaster.com/eng for the latest updates and FAQs

 

or by telephone at one of the numbers listed on the following page:

 

http://ts.thrustmaster.com/eng/index.php?pg=contact King regards,

Your Thrustmaster Technical Support Agent, Ana

 

PS: To ensure the most efficient follow-up of your query, please be sure to include the reference number [266822-XXXXXXXXXX] of your file in the subject line of any emails you may send us later on

 

I am away next week on business, but I'll still be corresponding with TM Tech Support until I get results (by that I mean an RMA # at this point I think).

 

More to follow...

 

S!

 

[Succellus]

Firmaware 2.0... thats nice, but it seems they still don t know if it will solve the problem, i think thats why they haven t released it to problematic warthogs owners they don t want to scream eureks before time.

 

As far as i can see Asus aint the problem but Intel is the problem, now what would it be ? Can t say, mobo ship, less strict voltage amperage compliance ?

 

On a side note My warthog landed and taxied home. If there wasn t this fear dampening the joy, i would go out and troll someone :clown:

I ll wait 2.0 start kicking in public as 1.8 wasnt a solution.