destroyex Posted April 9, 2005 Share Posted April 9, 2005 Is it just me or does it seem like the only way you can hit an su-27 with an amraam now is by being within 5nm? Everytime I fire on an su-27 from further away then that my missile passes harmlessly behind the enemy. Now why is this, did the DEVs think that the americans had too much of an edge? Because if they did than that is bullcrap. It was already pretty even in 1.02 but now the su-27 has become a ton better in WVR and it has some new radar modes and HOJ and all of that stuff while the F-15C only gets an AMRAAM that can't hit crap and has a further range. Well the further range isn't really that helpful if you have to be within 5nm to hit anything with it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
destroyex Posted April 9, 2005 Author Share Posted April 9, 2005 Hm I think nobody will fly the F-15 anymore then. Will be red vs red from now on then. Some russians claim that the amraam can't hit anything irl when the other a/c has RWR btw. I don't really find the russians saying it can't hit anything very truthful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GGTharos Posted April 9, 2005 Share Posted April 9, 2005 Nice job. You checked out less than half of the story ;) The AMRAAMs WILL hit ... so long as chaff isn't being used. Chaff works very well on the other radar guided missiles, too. As for what some russians claim, well, okay. I suppose an R-77 can't hit a plane with an RWR either, since the seeker's not all that different, right? ;) This is a sort of interim tweak while we wait for even better missile modelling in 1.2. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
destroyex Posted April 9, 2005 Author Share Posted April 9, 2005 Nice job. You checked out less than half of the story ;) The AMRAAMs WILL hit ... so long as chaff isn't being used. Chaff works very well on the other radar guided missiles, too. As for what some russians claim, well, okay. I suppose an R-77 can't hit a plane with an RWR either, since the seeker's not all that different, right? ;) This is a sort of interim tweak while we wait for even better missile modelling in 1.2. Well I was still hit by those R27ERs after doing a bunch of maneuvering and using chaff... and the AMRAAM didn't seem like it was going after any chaff, the missile just seemed to have a calculation error and go right behind the aircraft! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
355th_Xantris Posted April 9, 2005 Share Posted April 9, 2005 Sorry then. Deleted it;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D-Scythe Posted April 9, 2005 Share Posted April 9, 2005 If the AIM-120 consistently passes behind your target, it probably was following a pure pursuit profile...and probably using HOJ. I saw this issue coming from the demo, but...eh ;) But still, I don't think it's as bad as you say. Chizh did come out and state that the AIM-120 is modelled exactly like the R-77 in everyway (except rocket burn-time), and I believe him. If the AIM-120 has been nerfed, so has the R-77. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bflagg Posted April 9, 2005 Share Posted April 9, 2005 Nice job. You checked out less than half of the story ;) The AMRAAMs WILL hit ... so long as chaff isn't being used. Chaff works very well on the other radar guided missiles, too. As for what some russians claim, well, okay. I suppose an R-77 can't hit a plane with an RWR either, since the seeker's not all that different, right? ;) This is a sort of interim tweak while we wait for even better missile modelling in 1.2. GGTharos, Just for conversation sake, I could've sworn the 120 has the ability to "know" what chaff is (70% of the time?) and not fall forr the chaff trick. Am I wrong here? Thanks, Brett Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GGTharos Posted April 9, 2005 Share Posted April 9, 2005 Yep, both the 120 and 77 are supposed to have interesting ways of dealing with chaff. This hasn't been modelled yet. 1.2 may address a lot of missile issues. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
355th_Xantris Posted April 9, 2005 Share Posted April 9, 2005 Have tried the Amraam against exellent Su-27 and its hit chance is not what it was, but it sometimes hit and that farther than 5nm, so it's not that bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
destroyex Posted April 9, 2005 Author Share Posted April 9, 2005 Well I hope they can get 1.2 out fast... and this time I will wait until I see what people say about it before I buy it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
destroyex Posted April 9, 2005 Author Share Posted April 9, 2005 If the AIM-120 consistently passes behind your target, it probably was following a pure pursuit profile...and probably using HOJ. I saw this issue coming from the demo, but...eh ;) But still, I don't think it's as bad as you say. Chizh did come out and state that the AIM-120 is modelled exactly like the R-77 in everyway (except rocket burn-time), and I believe him. If the AIM-120 has been nerfed, so has the R-77. Well the su-27 I tested this on had no ECM pods. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yurec.orl Posted April 9, 2005 Share Posted April 9, 2005 Do not forget about new ECM modelling - if F-15 has ECM on, Su pilot don't know the distance to the target, and vice versa. But, one of the advantages of R-27ER was it's longer range (compared to AIM-120), and now this advantage is removed by ECM (burn-through range is equal, so Su pilot will probably launch his missile from the same distance as F-15 pilot). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kula66 Posted April 9, 2005 Share Posted April 9, 2005 Yep ... bought this up at length regarding the demo ... luckily 15s can carry Sidewinders ... otherwise we'd have to resort to ramming. My only hope is that the AI is flying a perfect/optimum defence and hence dodges the missile .... most human fliers will not be able to manage this :) After much testing I reckon that the cause is jamming/chaff ... you can watch AMRAAMs home in nicely then go stupid ... just before impact and miss. Very annoying!!! James Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GGTharos Posted April 9, 2005 Share Posted April 9, 2005 Kepp in mind that R77's behave in the exact same way. BTW, I tried playing online today ... got 2 kills, the first aircraft I hit disintegrated completely, but he was warping slightly to I had to fire inside of 5nm (the previous 3 missiles went to the drink) The second shot was a single shot sing kill, with a 20nm HoJ shot against a MiG29S. My AMRAAM set it on fire, my wingman's caused it to disintegrate. He also launched everything he had once he was hit. This is a very silly practice, but with aircraft prone to being disintegrated completely now or the pilot dying this should be reduced. BTW, if you're in a heavily damaged plane and youw ant to keep your point don't forge tto eject *quickly* ... they like to explode ... [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merlin Posted April 9, 2005 Share Posted April 9, 2005 120's are pretty much useless in 1.1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunmer Posted April 9, 2005 Share Posted April 9, 2005 In the "options" menu, how did you set "missiles effectiveness"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
destroyex Posted April 9, 2005 Author Share Posted April 9, 2005 It is at the default 50 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunmer Posted April 9, 2005 Share Posted April 9, 2005 Well, I do play with 100%. Beam, chaffs and flares stay effective if you use them well, and AA missiles (yours and ennemy ones as well) hunt pretty well. With 100%, it's still possible beaming an R-27ER (I've just done it 20 minutes ago with a MiG-29). Well, I'm going to have a look on your F-15 problem! :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunmer Posted April 9, 2005 Share Posted April 9, 2005 He's had it The Su-27 was an AI "excellent". Well, using the same tactics as in 1.02, I obtain the same result. Crank, ECM, fire from about 13 Nm, break, chaffs and splash one. One R-27ER lost in the sky. Here's the track. Have a look. Click here to DL Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D-Scythe Posted April 9, 2005 Share Posted April 9, 2005 Just because it worked in one place/situation, doesn't mean it will work in another. The AIM-120 and the R-77 seem to suffer the most from chaff, but SARH missiles like the AIM-7 and the R-27ER seem to be having their own problems with jamming. It sorta evens out, in a bizarre sort of way, but you won't be able to get in an F-15 and expect to go 5-6 for 6 AIM-120s anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Force_Feedback Posted April 9, 2005 Share Posted April 9, 2005 You F-15 fanboys keep cracking me up :D man, all the missiles are dumbed down, even in Falcon 4 the AMRAAM is dumber (when using against chaff equipped planes). Shepski/BIOLOG/other mods, please make a sticky "F-15C whine thread" "Booo-hooo, the su-25 now has an AFM, now I'll have to learn how to fly ***cry*** Oh my the Vikhr sping around, that isn't supposed to be, because I fly the Ka-50 in real life, so I know it, yes, you should beleive me, the Vikhr is unrealistic. So the AMRAAM should behave like in Falcon 4 BMS+SP4.23+weedmod+missile mod+ground radar mod!" :\ People, stop with the complaints, people that fly ground pounders or russian a-a planes hardly ever whine, even though they've "lost" the R-27AE, datalink, hadn't good gunzo pippers and so on. It starts getting immature. Creedence Clearwater Revival:worthy: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GGTharos Posted April 9, 2005 Share Posted April 9, 2005 FF, can it. Your second to last sentence shows exactly how clueless you are in the matter. They whined ENDLESSLY and it's not about to end. You're not saying anything useful. :P [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skywall23 Posted April 9, 2005 Share Posted April 9, 2005 FF, can it. Your second to last sentence shows exactly how clueless you are in the matter. They whined ENDLESSLY and it's not about to end. Yeah, the russian pilots do whine. (i used to whine too :p ) I remeber seeing on the UBI forum a thread with people whining about the removal of the R-27AE and it got locked. Well, but when it comes to the western comunity, I think, and this is only my opinion, that the F-15 pilots are whining more than the Mig and Su pilots. But it isnt much of a surprise, since the russian comunity is whining too last I heared, and they dont fly the Eagle so... I think 50/50 , but im NOT saying that the reasons for whining arent valid. This is just an observation about the russian/western whining :p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D-Scythe Posted April 9, 2005 Share Posted April 9, 2005 You F-15 fanboys keep cracking me up :D man, all the missiles are dumbed down, even in Falcon 4 the AMRAAM is dumber (when using against chaff equipped planes). That made no sense whatsover. What does a Lock On missile thread have to do with Falcon 4? Besides, if you actually read our posts, it was that BOTH the AIM-120 and the R-77 has been 'nerfed.' "Booo-hooo, the su-25 now has an AFM, now I'll have to learn how to fly ***cry*** Oh my the Vikhr sping around, that isn't supposed to be, because I fly the Ka-50 in real life, so I know it, yes, you should beleive me, the Vikhr is unrealistic. So the AMRAAM should behave like in Falcon 4 BMS+SP4.23+weedmod+missile mod+ground radar mod!" :\ Who said the spiralling Vikhr was unrealistic? People, stop with the complaints, people that fly ground pounders or russian a-a planes hardly ever whine, even though they've "lost" the R-27AE, datalink, hadn't good gunzo pippers and so on. Since when have you guys 'lost' the uber-datalink? (Which is more like a GCI link rather than an actual datalink, but people look the other way). And MiG and Flanker heads have been going ballistic ever since V1.02 made the AIM-120 the R-77 equal (as opposed to its inferior). "Waaa! V1.02 is an F-15 patch! ED is weak, listening to the capitalist whiners! Boo hoo, we have a broken gunsight! Why can't the Flanker do circles around an F-15, like I saw in a cartoon once? The FM of the F-15 is sooooo unrealistic!" and so on. I'm sure you get the idea. And don't even get us started on the whole East vs. West thing in Lock On. It starts getting immature. Yeah, it does. In any case, this is a thread about the AMRAAM, so let's keep it that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S77th-GOYA Posted April 9, 2005 Share Posted April 9, 2005 I'm getting plenty of kills with the 120. Eagle drivers need to change their tactics or get left behind. Whether the 120 is accurately modeled is something I don't know. Chances are you don't either. I do find that I'm using more missles on one target, but I do usually get kills. I do, however, reserve the right to bitch and moan at a later date. ;) :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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