dwpenney Posted January 3, 2009 Share Posted January 3, 2009 Can anyone explain what the EKRAN system is complaining about? I can not find anything in the manual about the message other than the reference on page 2-32. It sounds to me like the INS needs to be updated with a correct nav position but I have no idea how to do this (procedure). Anyone have an idea? (Cross-posted from SimHQ) Fridge ---------- Things which do you no good in aviation: 1) Altitude above you; 2) Runway behind you; 3) Fuel in the truck; 4) The airspeed you don't have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arneh Posted January 3, 2009 Share Posted January 3, 2009 See page 6-23 of the flight manual. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwpenney Posted January 3, 2009 Author Share Posted January 3, 2009 Return to Base Using Route Mode or Route Without Task? Do either of these fit? I have seen the message in a Mission I am building but I have been in neither of those two modes. Fridge ---------- Things which do you no good in aviation: 1) Altitude above you; 2) Runway behind you; 3) Fuel in the truck; 4) The airspeed you don't have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tbag Posted January 3, 2009 Share Posted January 3, 2009 (edited) Watch the producers note on navigation, it explains the update process quiet well. Have fun. Edited January 3, 2009 by Tbag [/url]"Time is an illusion. Lunchtime doubly so." - Douglas Adams Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nemises Posted January 3, 2009 Share Posted January 3, 2009 You will see the Ekran "perform Nav Fix" if you are within 13 KM's (?) of a Nav Fix point. A Nav Fix point is a predetermined set of co-ordinates that can be used to correct for the accumulated errors the INS will pick up due to airframe vibration. Thes Fix points are put into the game by the mission designer, and are usually put over an easily recognisable landmark. In the release version of the game INS error accumulation is not modelled, though you can still perform a NAV fix...and it is a good idea to get in the habit, as I'm sure INS error will be modelled in the near future! What is so bad about INS errors when you have a GPS ?.. well, your shkval and autopilot systems use INS data not GPS...so the potencial outcome is that you will be off by several kilomteres if you use standard navigation or Autopilot .. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tbag Posted January 3, 2009 Share Posted January 3, 2009 You will see the Ekran "perform Nav Fix" if you are within 13 KM's (?) of a Nav Fix point. Think it's 18k [/url]"Time is an illusion. Lunchtime doubly so." - Douglas Adams Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GGTharos Posted January 3, 2009 Share Posted January 3, 2009 The ABRIS corrects the INS every so often. Unless you run into some evil mission maker who'll blow the satellites out of the sky for you ... :evil: You will see the Ekran "perform Nav Fix" if you are within 13 KM's (?) of a Nav Fix point. A Nav Fix point is a predetermined set of co-ordinates that can be used to correct for the accumulated errors the INS will pick up due to airframe vibration. Thes Fix points are put into the game by the mission designer, and are usually put over an easily recognisable landmark. In the release version of the game INS error accumulation is not modelled, though you can still perform a NAV fix...and it is a good idea to get in the habit, as I'm sure INS error will be modelled in the near future! What is so bad about INS errors when you have a GPS ?.. well, your shkval and autopilot systems use INS data not GPS...so the potencial outcome is that you will be off by several kilomteres if you use standard navigation or Autopilot .. [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miguez Posted January 3, 2009 Share Posted January 3, 2009 The ABRIS corrects the INS every so often. Unless you run into some evil mission maker who'll blow the satellites out of the sky for you ... Hello GGTharos, What about EvilBivol's statement, which contradicts yours? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tbag Posted January 3, 2009 Share Posted January 3, 2009 Oh, and since we are at it :D: I remember that it is somewhere said that ABRIS and PVI-800 operate independently from each other (I think it is in the manual). But when I select a target point on the PVI-800, it flashes on the ABRIS, right? Does that mean that the PVI-800 is coupled with the targeting system and the targeting system is coupled with the ABRIS? So the ABRIS and the PVI-800 would be coupled indirectly? [/url]"Time is an illusion. Lunchtime doubly so." - Douglas Adams Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Necroscope Posted January 3, 2009 Share Posted January 3, 2009 A Nav Fix point is a predetermined set of co-ordinates that can be used to correct for the accumulated errors the INS will pick up due to airframe vibration. Thes Fix points are put into the game by the mission designer, and are usually put over an easily recognisable landmark. It's not really easy for me, couse I don't know which landmark I should use, and there no any info in debrif or on map on that. Всех убью, один останусь! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frederf Posted January 3, 2009 Share Posted January 3, 2009 Oh, and since we are at it :D: I remember that it is somewhere said that ABRIS and PVI-800 operate independently from each other (I think it is in the manual). But when I select a target point on the PVI-800, it flashes on the ABRIS, right? Does that mean that the PVI-800 is coupled with the targeting system and the targeting system is coupled with the ABRIS? So the ABRIS and the PVI-800 would be coupled indirectly? The ABRIS and PVI-800 aren't "coupled" in that they share information on a two-way street, it's strictly info going into the ABRIS. The ABRIS knows where the Shkval point of interest is but the PVI-800 has no idea what the ABRIS is up to for example. The PVI-800 is not GPS updated it requires overfly or Shkval updating periodically. I was surprised how far off the INU could get off over only 1 hour's worth of flying, 14km!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GGTharos Posted January 4, 2009 Share Posted January 4, 2009 Hm, my mistake :) But I'm also pretty certain it's 4km/hour, not 14 ;) [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Reminder: SAM = Speed Bump :D I used to play flight sims like you, but then I took a slammer to the knee - Yoda Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThunderChief Posted January 4, 2009 Share Posted January 4, 2009 (edited) I seems to me that this inacuracy of the INU is not modelled. 1. Even after long fligths without INU fix PVI and ABRIS show exactly the same position 2. When rotor RPM drops to much, INU will do a realignment and I would expect it to lose position information, but it still shows same position as ABRIS Did anyone ever expirienced a inacuracy of the INU / PVI 800? I will try to investigate on this with ABRIS disabled and see if INU will lose acuracy then. I think I read somewhere on ABRIS system page that it performs INU update every 3 minutes but I always thought it will read INU data and not write !? Edited January 4, 2009 by ThunderChief Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwpenney Posted January 4, 2009 Author Share Posted January 4, 2009 Well I was able to set the NAV POS in my custom mission. I added a Nav point to a bridge that was enroute to my target area and used that plus the Shkval to set it. Very cool. Fridge ---------- Things which do you no good in aviation: 1) Altitude above you; 2) Runway behind you; 3) Fuel in the truck; 4) The airspeed you don't have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miguez Posted January 4, 2009 Share Posted January 4, 2009 I seems to me that this inacuracy of the INU is not modelled. That's correct, someone mentioned in another thread that this is not modeled yet, and perhaps will be part of a future update. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThunderChief Posted January 4, 2009 Share Posted January 4, 2009 I just tested it by shuting of all systems (bat and gen off) and after power up, the PVI-800 shows a self position 1000s kilometers away from where I was but navigation (route mode) still worked as usual. Seems as inacuracy is not implemented yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miguez Posted January 4, 2009 Share Posted January 4, 2009 To add to this discussion: English manual page 3-36: MENU/CONTROL/K-041 Sub-mode "The K-041 page is used to check the status of the K-041 navigation and targeting system. When in “WORK” MODE, a countdown timer in seconds is displayed next to the TIME OUT field. This indicates the time until the next INS navigation fix from GNSS. Current aircraft coordinates; heading, track angle, and speed are also displayed here." Now maybe I am reading this wrong, but the INS should be the nertial Navigation System. From what I understand then, the INS gets a position fix from the GPS (GNSS), right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bengo Posted January 4, 2009 Share Posted January 4, 2009 It's not really easy for me, couse I don't know which landmark I should use, and there no any info in debrif or on map on that. Nec, I was struggling with this problem too. If you click on the flightplan in the briefing map, the track will turn white, and the INU fixpoints will appear in white as well as circles with a number next to it. It's rather difficult too see when they are located at a waypoint. Take a look at the 'Convoy hunt'-mission. You'll see 4 fix points. Nr1 is at waypoint 3 Nr 2 is just left of the trackline between waypoints 4 and 5 Nr3 is at the crossing of the runways a bit left of fix point 2 Nr4 is on a roadcrossing just a bit south of your homebase. Hope this helps. i7 6700k/GTX1070-8G/MSI-Z170A Gaming Pro Carbon/32GB DDR4 Kingston HyperX PREDATOR DDR4 3000MHZ Vengeance 1600/TM Warthog #6106/Samsung SB350_S27B350H/OCZ Agility3 SSD 128GB / Win10-64/TIR5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
71st_Mastiff Posted December 3, 2010 Share Posted December 3, 2010 hi guys sorry to bring this up again but I tried to fix my nav position but the Ekran will not except it. any ideas why? " any failure you meet, is never a defeat; merely a set up for a greater come back, " W Forbes "Success is not final, failure is not fatal, it is the courage to continue that counts," Winston Churchill " He who never changes his mind, never changes anything," MSI z690MPG DDR4 || i914900k|| ddr4-64gb PC3200 || MSI RTX 4070Ti|Game1300w|Win10x64| |turtle beach elite pro 5.1|| ViRpiL,T50cm2|| MFG Crosswinds|| VT50CM-plus rotor Throttle || G10 RGB EVGA Keyboard/MouseLogitech || PiMax Crystal VR || 32 Samsung|| Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bogusheadbox Posted December 3, 2010 Share Posted December 3, 2010 That's correct, someone mentioned in another thread that this is not modeled yet, and perhaps will be part of a future update. Yes that is correct, the feature is not implemented. Would you mind kindly putting this feature into my thread "Updates to Black Shark" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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