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Why the WW2 modules progress are too slow?


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Dont let me wrong.... i´m a WW2 silver backer and i happy to receive my regards from ED.

I´m not trying to blame ED or anyone, but its impossible to not think that are something wrong with the slow progress of WW2 modules and AI airplanes assets.

Years of slow progress... I´m afraid of dying before see all assets and planes completed as planned. And it is sad!

I´m not tryng to blame ED by kickstart faults and i know that ED was not respossible to complete what was promised by another one.

In real life in the World War 2, a lot of planes and variants was built in less time than here in this virtual WW2 "DCS World"...about only 4 year in real life.

 

How many time still needed to finish this limited set of airplanes?

Should it anyone from ED´s staff can say what is still planned to be done and show us the timeline?

 

Sorry if some words looks weird or wrong ...english is not my mother language.

 

 

 

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Hi , I am new to DCS World , but for my two cents worth , I totally agree with you , As WW11 was the greatest conflict the world has ever known , I thought it would be better represented in this Sim , and don't worry about your language , understood you completely , yours truly Vector1


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2 hours ago, greco.bernardi said:

In real life in the World War 2, a lot of planes and variants was built in less time than here in this virtual WW2


what a weird comparison ..  do you know how many people worked at Messerschmidt to design, test and build the 262? .. how can you compare that with the few dozen people working at ED?

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The WW2 modules are pushed out in a mostly completed state much faster than the modern modules.....not sure what the discussion here is about....

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I think @greco.bernardi shares the same concern that a lot of other people have. The thing is a lot of people don't realize/understand the size of the task ED is attempting to do with the limited amount of resources available. And while the plane models that ED does are very complex, the work is not just about making plane modules, but has to consider every aspect of the world they fly in. And these things are separate and in addition to all the resources needed to run the virtual world, which also needs updating.

 

The upcoming Mosquito is a perfect example of how much dedication and time ED spends getting each module just right. After months of work, ED delayed its release because something wasn't right with the model. Instead of passing on something that wasn't right to the paying customer, they absorbed the additional development costs to get it right. And to better understand the level of attention to detail that ED puts into each module, being made of wood, ED is now completely revamping the damage model for the Mosquito to accurately portray differences in damage depending on plane construction.

 

The end result is a better SIM.

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10 hours ago, Rudel_chw said:


what a weird comparison ..  do you know how many people worked at Messerschmidt to design, test and build the 262? .. how can you compare that with the few dozen people working at ED?

 

7 hours ago, Nealius said:

The WW2 modules are pushed out in a mostly completed state much faster than the modern modules.....not sure what the discussion here is about....

Sorry i´m not trying to do weirds comparations....I know that time is necessery to recreate a warbird. 

And you are right! Almost all planned ww2 modules was built except by the ME262 and we don´t know if still planned. 

The most importing thing that still remaning to be completed is the AI planeset.

Sometime ago ED talked about to do a 109G and 190F as a module and i will love to buy all of them, but i´m afraid of us will be a long waiting...too much.

I thing the discution is about what ED still planning to do and if they can show us the timeline. Any infomation is better than what we have now. It will be necessary a decade? Ok... but for what? 

The worst thing is the lack of information. I prefer to know what ED is planning before buy another ww2 module like the mosquito. I don´t know if the slow progress is about few dozen people working. 

And again... don´t let me wrong! I love ED´s ww2 warbirds, but if the development still slow and without infomation like now... Many people will lost interest.

I just want to undestand why the progress is too slow.

 

 

 

 

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1 minute ago, greco.bernardi said:

Many people will lost interest.

 

Those people are probably the ones that learn every module in a superficial way, never really caring to learn a new aircraft fully, never editing missions for it, never playing the Campaigns until completion, etc.

 

I've been learning the Hind since its release on mid June and I'm still not trough with it, and I'm giving full dedication to it in order to be free for when the Mosquito appears .. that's why I wouldn't mind if the Mosquito is delayed a bit more, to finish the Hind .. and you people lose interest? 🙄

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6 minutes ago, Rudel_chw said:

 

Those people are probably the ones that learn every module in a superficial way, never really caring to learn a new aircraft fully, never editing missions for it, never playing the Campaigns until completion, etc.

 

I've been learning the Hind since its release on mid June and I'm still not trough with it, and I'm giving full dedication to it in order to be free for when the Mosquito appears .. that's why I wouldn't mind if the Mosquito is delayed a bit more, to finish the Hind .. and you people lose interest? 🙄

I´m not talking about me..I´m still here 🙂  ...and flying in SOW server all time.

I have almost all WW2 modules and a lot of modern airplanes, but i love the ww2 warbirds and dedicate my time flying them in DCS.

The true is that WW2 modules need a great set of AI assets on ground, sea and air to permit us to fly and flight in a great enviroment. 

I don´t know why mosquito comes like a module before we have it as AI plane? And why we saw a lot of pictures of anothers AI ww2 planes years ago like dacota and still not present in the DCS world today. 

I have seen some people that loves ED´s WW2 birds talking about close your ww2 server or that will not add the mosquito in it by the lack of progress in bug clean of some warbird.

It´s not good for the WW2 DCS comunity when some consumers feels in this way. I think the ED can do a better comunication of yours plans and timeline. As we have now looks weird. Anyone know what is planned and what the DCS WW2 future.

Anyone here know what WW2 module will be done after Mosquito? 

 

 

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6 minutes ago, greco.bernardi said:

I think the ED can do a better comunication of yours plans and timeline.

 

If I were on ED's shoes, I would never reveal any plan nor give any timeline, as most people will take those plans and timelines as "promises" and then held the company accountable for those promises, taking away the ability of the company to change their plans as circumstances dictate. 

 

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15 hours ago, greco.bernardi said:

Dont let me wrong.... i´m a WW2 silver backer and i happy to receive my regards from ED.

I´m not trying to blame ED or anyone, but its impossible to not think that are something wrong with the slow progress of WW2 modules and AI airplanes assets.

Years of slow progress... I´m afraid of dying before see all assets and planes completed as planned. And it is sad!

I´m not tryng to blame ED by kickstart faults and i know that ED was not respossible to complete what was promised by another one.

In real life in the World War 2, a lot of planes and variants was built in less time than here in this virtual WW2 "DCS World"...about only 4 year in real life.

 

How many time still needed to finish this limited set of airplanes?

Should it anyone from ED´s staff can say what is still planned to be done and show us the timeline?

 

Sorry if some words looks weird or wrong ...english is not my mother language.

 

 

 


WW2, is a niche.. A HUGE niche. And it only accounts for a sliver of the DCS players, The gameplay is much stronger in the modern game and developing a Warbird Is more simple than an FA18 and so doesnt need the same amount of resources as a warbird doesnt have the same amount of systems..
If the numbers were matched in modern jets we'd be seeing a different story.

However, sales are the foreteller of development.
Unless we manage to match sales of the modern planes, we cant expect the resources to match the modern side as it wont be profitable in the grand scheme of the game.

Until we either get more players into Warbirds, or ED decides to better market that part of the game, things will carry on as is.
So just try to enjoy what we have.
 

 

51 minutes ago, greco.bernardi said:

I´m not talking about me..I´m still here 🙂  ...and flying in SOW server all time.

I have almost all WW2 modules and a lot of modern airplanes, but i love the ww2 warbirds and dedicate my time flying them in DCS.

The true is that WW2 modules need a great set of AI assets on ground, sea and air to permit us to fly and flight in a great enviroment. 

I don´t know why mosquito comes like a module before we have it as AI plane? And why we saw a lot of pictures of anothers AI ww2 planes years ago like dacota and still not present in the DCS world today. 

I have seen some people that loves ED´s WW2 birds talking about close your ww2 server or that will not add the mosquito in it by the lack of progress in bug clean of some warbird.

It´s not good for the WW2 DCS comunity when some consumers feels in this way. I think the ED can do a better comunication of yours plans and timeline. As we have now looks weird. Anyone know what is planned and what the DCS WW2 future.

Anyone here know what WW2 module will be done after Mosquito? 

 

 


I can relate to that, i think thats a good solid conversation.
Communication to the users and the way us users communicate back- has long been the problem here.
The minute you offend someone through opinion, the arguing starts, and before you know it, its spread like wildfire to the post.

I just hope it gets better, Ive waited for a long time and im in limbo right now, id love to see some actual fixes instead of the usual 'just wait unti you see whats coming', carrot dangling hype..

Hellcat, Im pretty sure we need a free warbird next, we cant expect the awesome SU25 to be playable, and live with the TF51 for much longer. The warbird game is dragging out way longer that it should have been..

Yeah the modules are top notch, but the gameplay.. Just isnt on the same level..

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10 minutes ago, StevanJ said:


WW2, is a niche.. A HUGE niche. And it only accounts for a sliver of the DCS players,

It is a HUGE niche. It's only a sliver of DCS players because it's under developed. 

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12 minutes ago, StevanJ said:


WW2, is a niche.. A HUGE niche. And it only accounts for a sliver of the DCS players, The gameplay is much stronger in the modern game and developing a Warbird Is more simple than an FA18 and so doesnt need the same amount of resources as a warbird doesnt have the same amount of systems..
If the numbers were matched in modern jets we'd be seeing a different story.

However, sales are the foreteller of development.
Unless we manage to match sales of the modern planes, we cant expect the resources to match the modern side as it wont be profitable in the grand scheme of the game.

Until we either get more players into Warbirds, or ED decides to better market that part of the game, things will carry on as is.
So just try to enjoy what we have.
 

 


I can relate to that, i think thats a good solid conversation.
Communication to the users and the way us users communicate back- has long been the problem here.
The minute you offend someone through opinion, the arguing starts, and before you know it, its spread like wildfire to the post.

I just hope it gets better, Ive waited for a long time and im in limbo right now, id love to see some actual fixes instead of the usual 'just wait unti you see whats coming', carrot dangling hype..

Hellcat, Im pretty sure we need a free warbird next, we cant expect the awesome SU25 to be playable, and live with the TF51 for much longer. The warbird game is dragging out way longer that it should have been..

Yeah the modules are top notch, but the gameplay.. Just isnt on the same level..

I fully agree!👍 

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28 minutes ago, LithiumR said:

It is a HUGE niche. It's only a sliver of DCS players because it's under developed. 

 

Well yeah, The way ED see's it- Theyre doing US a favour for taking over the kickstarter.. We should be grateful yeah?
In hindsight, Id rather they hadnt', I understand why they did, and it was very honourable, but id rather they never did, and left the game alone so they could carry on focusing on the modern game, and leaving those that wanted warbirds to go to 'the other game' for now.
They could have come back after they they'd accomplished some great stuff with the modern side of the game. And built one hell of an awesome Warbird Combat sim too if they felt there was a market for it..
But with how far weve come and how far weve got, how many were years are we away from that, Im betting at least 10.

Weve had 4 years since the release of the Asset Pack, and theres still no sign of other AI fighters, Bombers, Civil assets, or even Buildings. This is not down to the team that work on that module, but down to ED for outsourcing that design because they felt it wouldnt bring enough money in, if worked on full time by them..

And instead of having one amazing modern combat game, and then adapting that to Warbirds. We have what we have now.
An Open Beta sim, with loads of other stuff thrown in out of the obligation to make those that opted into the kickstarter, feel like they didnt get ripped off..

Dont get me wrong, we have some fantastic WW2 flight models to this game, but thats it.
Its not yet a WW2 combat sim, but flight sim? Sure, and most definitely.. And thats okay too.
Maybe in 20 years, we'll have something that brings home the gameplay, the players, and the feeling of delirium being excited or scared to be up against an AI that might be a hurricane, a typoon, or tempest, but right now, we dont have anything near that and as Op said 'I might not be around when this game is finished'- And im 38..

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7 hours ago, greco.bernardi said:

I´m not talking about me..I´m still here 🙂  ...and flying in SOW server all time.

I have almost all WW2 modules and a lot of modern airplanes, but i love the ww2 warbirds and dedicate my time flying them in DCS.

The true is that WW2 modules need a great set of AI assets on ground, sea and air to permit us to fly and flight in a great enviroment. 

I don´t know why mosquito comes like a module before we have it as AI plane? And why we saw a lot of pictures of anothers AI ww2 planes years ago like dacota and still not present in the DCS world today. 

I have seen some people that loves ED´s WW2 birds talking about close your ww2 server or that will not add the mosquito in it by the lack of progress in bug clean of some warbird.

It´s not good for the WW2 DCS comunity when some consumers feels in this way. I think the ED can do a better comunication of yours plans and timeline. As we have now looks weird. Anyone know what is planned and what the DCS WW2 future.

Anyone here know what WW2 module will be done after Mosquito? 

 

 

I couldn't agree with the highlighted text more. The planes in DCS WWII are amazing, but what makes those planes really shine for me is the environment I fly them in. The maps/assets are as important to me as the planes themselves. Have a look at the recent promotional video for the Mosquito and try and convince me the rich environment it is flying through isn't a major part of what makes it a great promotional video.

 

Regarding the DCS WWII future, my guess is that because of all the major projects/house keeping that ED has done this past year, we will probably see more in the way of assets after the WWII version of the Marianas is released. But I think @Rudel_chw has hit the nail on the head so to speak, because announcing plans too far in advance usually only leads to problems. Just look at the Me-262 for example. I am still hopeful that it will arrive, but because it wont arrive in the order it was expected to, a lot of people are disappointed. That being said, I agree with you in that it would be nice to get a better indication of where things are going.

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6 hours ago, StevanJ said:


WW2, is a niche.. A HUGE niche. And it only accounts for a sliver of the DCS players, The gameplay is much stronger in the modern game and developing a Warbird Is more simple than an FA18 and so doesnt need the same amount of resources as a warbird doesnt have the same amount of systems..
If the numbers were matched in modern jets we'd be seeing a different story.

However, sales are the foreteller of development.
Unless we manage to match sales of the modern planes, we cant expect the resources to match the modern side as it wont be profitable in the grand scheme of the game.

Until we either get more players into Warbirds, or ED decides to better market that part of the game, things will carry on as is.
So just try to enjoy what we have.
 

 


I can relate to that, i think thats a good solid conversation.
Communication to the users and the way us users communicate back- has long been the problem here.
The minute you offend someone through opinion, the arguing starts, and before you know it, its spread like wildfire to the post.

I just hope it gets better, Ive waited for a long time and im in limbo right now, id love to see some actual fixes instead of the usual 'just wait unti you see whats coming', carrot dangling hype..

Hellcat, Im pretty sure we need a free warbird next, we cant expect the awesome SU25 to be playable, and live with the TF51 for much longer. The warbird game is dragging out way longer that it should have been..

Yeah the modules are top notch, but the gameplay.. Just isnt on the same level..

Regarding the war birds, yes it would be nice to get something for free, but DCS already represents the best value SIM on the market IMO, not to mention the most realistic. Download DCS World for free and you get 3 maps (Marianas WWII arriving soon), a fully functional SEAD attack plane, and a fully functional WWII trainer.

 

As a highly detailed learning SIM, the TF51 serves its purpose very well IMO. The TF51 is meant to introduce new players to real world startup, engine management, taxi, take-off, radio communications, navigation, and landing. Anyone not familiar with flight in a real plane could spend weeks, or even months learning just those basics. And the advanced flight model of the TF51 makes it the prefect lead-in to flying the Mustang in a combat role, at which point the player can decide whether he/she wants to stay with the Mustang, or venture out in another direction. But the TF51 itself is a beautiful plane to get your feet wet with in DCS World.

 

The Su-25T rounds the initiation phase out IMO, because it gives the new player a taste for the look and feel of aerial combat. This includes the ability to join MP servers. So you can actually download DCS World and enjoy if for an untold amount of time without spending a penny. I don't know of another SIM that has the same level of detail as DCS where you can do the same. Add as your first purchase Combined Arms, and you have the capability to control your simulated battles in ways other SIMs could only dream of.

 

But I am always left wondering after reading your posts where you get your information from. Do you have actual sales data? This is just a question, so please don't take it as a challenge. But you often include in your discussion comments about sales, and how that affects which module get developed, and so on. So I was just wondering if you actually have data on how many people downloaded which module, and how many people ED has working on each module/project?

 

Or are you just going by your gut feeling when you say things like "WW2, is a niche.. A HUGE niche. And it only accounts for a sliver of the DCS players", or "sales are the foreteller of development".

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2 hours ago, Callsign112 said:

I couldn't agree with the highlighted text more. The planes in DCS WWII are amazing, but what makes those planes really shine for me is the environment I fly them in. The maps/assets are as important to me as the planes themselves. Have a look at the recent promotional video for the Mosquito and try and convince me the rich environment it is flying through isn't a major part of what makes it a great promotional video.

 

Regarding the DCS WWII future, my guess is that because of all the major projects/house keeping that ED has done this past year, we will probably see more in the way of assets after the WWII version of the Marianas is released. But I think @Rudel_chw has hit the nail on the head so to speak, because announcing plans too far in advance usually only leads to problems. Just look at the Me-262 for example. I am still hopeful that it will arrive, but because it wont arrive in the order it was expected to, a lot of people are disappointed. That being said, I agree with you in that it would be nice to get a better indication of where things are going.

 

almost 8 year ago

4 years ago ... before this we can fly in caucasus map... 🙂

 

...10 years ago i bought a A10 in beta access when DCS World does not exit yet! A10 was a stand alone sim and i will receive the Nevada map as regard when be doned. 🙂 

I flew the mutang in caucasus map when we didn´t have any another place or WW2 axis plane to fight. 

 

In my opnion after 8 years we have less AI planes than is needed to do a rich enviroment... And when i said "rich enviroment" its about do diferent missions types...scorting or engaging diferent bomber or fighters types.

Now we have only the JU88 (recently with bombs too), a B17 and a A20 as AI bombers.

Don´t let me wrong... We have now a better enviroment than before, but...Is its enought?

I know that ED don´t like to talk about plans or timeline.I know why...and i can understand that talk about release dates can be a problem but turn a lack of infomation a company policy looks weird.

 

 

 

 

But again, I´m not trynig to blame anyone. It´s only my personal opnion.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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@greco.bernardi, you raise a lot of good points and sharing our opinions is what the forum is for. I couldn't agree with you more, 8 years is a long time to wait for something to finish. But like you, I am not on the inside so all I can do is guess really as to the direction of things to come. The only thing I think we can all be certain of though is that circumstances cause even the best laid plans to change.

 

I certainly don't have the history you have with DCS, but looking back, I wonder if a lot of the delays/changed plans weren't caused in a way by the evolution of computer technology itself and the demands we put on it. In other words, the constant demand for more graphics, more effects, more realism is constantly moving the bar for what is acceptable, which affects everything in the loop including the SIM's core engine.

 

So if we dissect the last 8 years into what was done, in addition to things like core updates, damage models, clouds, propellers, DCS World now has 24 jets, 10 piston planes, 6 helicopters, 3 tech packs, and 6 navigation modules. My hope is that once ED finalizes the new graphics API that is supposed to happen by the end of this year, most of the big ticket house keeping items will be dealt with at least for a while, and we will see the development of things like assets speed up a little.  

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On 9/5/2021 at 2:14 AM, greco.bernardi said:

Dont let me wrong.... i´m a WW2 silver backer and i happy to receive my regards from ED.

I´m not trying to blame ED or anyone, but its impossible to not think that are something wrong with the slow progress of WW2 modules and AI airplanes assets.

Years of slow progress... I´m afraid of dying before see all assets and planes completed as planned. And it is sad!

I´m not tryng to blame ED by kickstart faults and i know that ED was not respossible to complete what was promised by another one.

In real life in the World War 2, a lot of planes and variants was built in less time than here in this virtual WW2 "DCS World"...about only 4 year in real life.

 

How many time still needed to finish this limited set of airplanes?

Should it anyone from ED´s staff can say what is still planned to be done and show us the timeline?

 

Sorry if some words looks weird or wrong ...english is not my mother language.

 

 

 

 

The kickstarter failed, we rescued it. Our WWII team is a small one currently, so work will take time. Its not easy to find devs with the correct skill sets for work on WWII aircraft. 

 

Work on the asset pack continues, the mosquito, and then we will have a focus on bug issues that are outstanding. 

 

thank you for your patience it will be worth the wait.

 

 

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26 minutes ago, Callsign112 said:

So if we dissect the last 8 years into what was done, in addition to things like core updates, damage models, clouds, propellers, DCS World now has 24 jets, 10 piston planes, 6 helicopters, 3 tech packs, and 6 navigation modules. My hope is that once ED finalizes the new graphics API that is supposed to happen by the end of this year, most of the big ticket house keeping items will be dealt with at least for a while, and we will see the development of things like assets speed up a little.  

 

We have some confusion here:

 

The core engine build core improvements and the new graphic API (Vulkan), that dont affect to build AI units to them or speed them, and that team go to continue to improve the core. The WW2 team has a AI team with has centred on build assets, but them has small and dont have the actual capability to the main AI assets team, with have rebuild and make new assets to the "core".

Meanwhile, on the 3D develop document put by ED some week ago, a 3D model (vehicle) take 6 months a to a year or more to build by a 3D modeler on 3DS Max by the actual ED quality standars. you require more personal, no a better engine.

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About WW2:

2012: ED release P-51D
2013: Luthiem make KS WW2 project and reach to funded.
2014: Luthiem goes to Bankrupt and ED rescue the project, Ugra Media continue build Normandy map. All release KS release dates has phased out. ED release Bf-190K-4 and Fw190D-9.
2016: ED Release Spitfire Mk.IX
2017: ED Release WW2 Assets Pack, Ugra Media release Normandy WW2. Spitfire Mark IXc LF added to Spirfire.IX

2018: ED Release Bf-190K updates and more WW2 assets pack units.
2019: ED added P-51D-25 and P-51D-30 to P-51D, update Fw-190D9 and  release Fw-190A-8. Octopus-G release I-16 Type 24 and Ugra Media make Normandy update.

2020: ED Release P-47D, new damage model and Channel Map, Assets pack update, new armament to WW2
2021: ED go to release Mosquito FB.VI, release new WW2 armament, propeller technology, assets pack update and improvements on Channel Map. ED has working on dinamic damage holes.  OctopusG make improvements on I-16 Type 24, Ugra Media make improvemens on Normady map.

ED has pleplanning phase of Marianas Map WW2 and plan Air, land and sea Assets to marianas. More europe WW2 assets on develop. Me262 has on "research" phase. Magnitude 3 working on F4-U1 Corsair with Pacific assets pack, OctopusG has talk about working on a new WW2 module.


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1 hour ago, Silver_Dragon said:

...

Meanwhile, on the 3D develop document put by ED some week ago, a 3D model (vehicle) take 6 months a to a year or more to build by a 3D modeler on 3DS Max by the actual ED quality standars. you require more personal, no a better engine.

This is how I feel also. I got the P-51 in 2012 and was super excited for DCS WWII development. I thought at the time maybe 2-3 years and DCS WWII would be ready. I bought every WWII module that would come out, partly because I did want it but mostly because I wanted to support WWII development. But fast forward almost 10 years and WWII is still only almost kind of there but not quite in a single theatre. People say that WWII has a small base and therefor a small development team.... but it's only a small base precisely because it's under developed. The market there is HUGE. 

 

I do understand ED's position though. I've got nothing but love for ED. But as a customer it's difficult also. For example I would love to invest in the Pacific theatre but if it's 6 months to a year for assets, 3-5 years for a module, and the development team is only big enough to do maybe 2 at a time... or let's be generous and say 5 at a time... we're looking at like 20 years in development haha. Which seems about right with the progress of the current WWII theatre. About 10 more years and it'll be all fleshed out. One problem with such a long development time is the change in technology in that span. The other problem for me with all of this is that I'm getting old! Maybe I will never see it! And with that in mind it's hard to continue to be the customer that buys modules simply to support development when in fact I probably won't live long enough to see it through at the current pace. But that's not really ED's problem haha. Just my problem. But I'm sure I'm not the only one who feels this. I want to be the kind of customer who is reasonable in my expectations... but to say "I'll be happy to fly this after I'm dead" is also not reasonable. So idk... maybe that's just how it is. 

 

And none of this is a bash on ED. I think they have done a tremendous job... but it is slow. If I was a gobillionaire I would just give them money for faster development haha. But sadly for them and for me I am not! Oh well... such is life.


Edited by LithiumR
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59 minutes ago, Silver_Dragon said:

 

We have some confusion here:

 

The core engine build core improvements and the new graphic API (Vulkan), that dont affect to build AI units to them or speed them, and that team go to continue to improve the core. The WW2 team has a AI team with has centred on build assets, but them has small and dont have the actual capability to the main AI assets team, with have rebuild and make new assets to the "core".

Meanwhile, on the 3D develop document put by ED some week ago, a 3D model (vehicle) take 6 months a to a year or more to build by a 3D modeler on 3DS Max by the actual ED quality standars. you require more personal, no a better engine.

Thanks for the clarifications @Silver_Dragon, this is all a little over my head so I appreciate your insight. I think the main point I was trying to make is that ED has covered a lot of ground in the last 8 years in terms of developing a digital combat simulator, and I didn't even mention the 7 maps.

 

I think its easy to get wrapped up in the scenario that all ED has to do is model a plane without realizing, or considering what goes into making the whole thing work.

 

And thanks for the dateline update, I think that is what the OP was asking for here.

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16 hours ago, Callsign112 said:

Regarding the war birds, yes it would be nice to get something for free, but DCS already represents the best value SIM on the market IMO, not to mention the most realistic. Download DCS World for free and you get 3 maps (Marianas WWII arriving soon), a fully functional SEAD attack plane, and a fully functional WWII trainer.

 

As a highly detailed learning SIM, the TF51 serves its purpose very well IMO. The TF51 is meant to introduce new players to real world startup, engine management, taxi, take-off, radio communications, navigation, and landing. Anyone not familiar with flight in a real plane could spend weeks, or even months learning just those basics. And the advanced flight model of the TF51 makes it the prefect lead-in to flying the Mustang in a combat role, at which point the player can decide whether he/she wants to stay with the Mustang, or venture out in another direction. But the TF51 itself is a beautiful plane to get your feet wet with in DCS World.

 

The Su-25T rounds the initiation phase out IMO, because it gives the new player a taste for the look and feel of aerial combat. This includes the ability to join MP servers. So you can actually download DCS World and enjoy if for an untold amount of time without spending a penny. I don't know of another SIM that has the same level of detail as DCS where you can do the same. Add as your first purchase Combined Arms, and you have the capability to control your simulated battles in ways other SIMs could only dream of.

 

But I am always left wondering after reading your posts where you get your information from. Do you have actual sales data? This is just a question, so please don't take it as a challenge. But you often include in your discussion comments about sales, and how that affects which module get developed, and so on. So I was just wondering if you actually have data on how many people downloaded which module, and how many people ED has working on each module/project?

 

Or are you just going by your gut feeling when you say things like "WW2, is a niche.. A HUGE niche. And it only accounts for a sliver of the DCS players", or "sales are the foreteller of development".


Calls DCS 'best Value SIM', Waits to buys modules cheaper in DCS Sale 🤔..

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Anyone that spends more than a couple of the weeks in the TF51, has obviously gone on holiday and left his game running.

Players numbers are available if you look for them.

Im going by the player numbers that are available, and by the amount of posts that have been made in the forum.

As i said, The SU25 is awesome. But there is nothing 'As Awesome' for the WW2 game, so im guessing with the complaints made recently towards WW2, ED are going to drop a better module than the TF51. Theyve said theyll be dropping more assets for the Marianas WW2 Map, so ill wait and see if it happens.
 

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2 hours ago, BIGNEWY said:

 

The kickstarter failed, we rescued it. Our WWII team is a small one currently, so work will take time. Its not easy to find devs with the correct skill sets for work on WWII aircraft. 

 

Work on the asset pack continues, the mosquito, and then we will have a focus on bug issues that are outstanding. 

 

thank you for your patience it will be worth the wait.

 

 

I know about it and i´m very gratefull to ED for that. 

When i participated in kickstart WW2 project and after the developer get out, i´m not afraid to lost the money....I´m afraid to lost a passion/hobby.

In that time... The old il2 dev.( Oleg Maddox) did close the doors one year before trying to do the new il2 Storm of War (i paid for it in pre-order). Sadly that sim bird dead (without future development).

When WW2 project start the crownfound campain it was a hope for WW2 warbirds lovers and when it gone be wrong and ED got to finished what they didn´t start... And without any obligation to do that... It was fantastic! Because it was a better chance to have a great WW2 Sim and future for my hobby.

In that time as now, i don´t have problem if ED did can not give me for free anything as a kickstart backers. I would buy all modules and would be happy to have a great Sim developer building a WW2 combat simulator. 

Why i saying this? 

You are right about that will be worth the wait...The problem is how many time. 

If anyone in comunity knows what is in development and what is in wait, it's looking like nothing is in working!

I know that is not true... but for someone that bought a WW2 module in early access and still wainting for a simple bug fix for years is difuculty to understand.

When to JU88 drop a bomb demand a lot of time...start to be litle frustating for the comunity.

I supose that should be fixed by a good comunication... I know that talk too early about something can be a problem here, but don´t talk anything can be also a problem.

 

 

Again... i love this sim!

 

 

 

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5 hours ago, Silver_Dragon said:

About WW2:

2012: ED release P-51D
2013: Luthiem make KS WW2 project and reach to funded.
2014: Luthiem goes to Bankrupt and ED rescue the project, Ugra Media continue build Normandy map. All release KS release dates has phased out. ED release Bf-190K-4 and Fw190D-9.
2016: ED Release Spitfire Mk.IX
2017: ED Release WW2 Assets Pack, Ugra Media release Normandy WW2. Spitfire Mark IXc LF added to Spirfire.IX

2018: ED Release Bf-190K updates and more WW2 assets pack units.
2019: ED added P-51D-25 and P-51D-30 to P-51D, update Fw-190D9 and  release Fw-190A-8. Octopus-G release I-16 Type 24 and Ugra Media make Normandy update.

2020: ED Release P-47D, new damage model and Channel Map, Assets pack update, new armament to WW2
2021: ED go to release Mosquito FB.VI, release new WW2 armament, propeller technology, assets pack update and improvements on Channel Map. ED has working on dinamic damage holes.  OctopusG make improvements on I-16 Type 24, Ugra Media make improvemens on Normady map.

ED has pleplanning phase of Marianas Map WW2 and plan Air, land and sea Assets to marianas. More europe WW2 assets on develop. Me262 has on "research" phase. Magnitude 3 working on F4-U1 Corsair with Pacific assets pack, OctopusG has talk about working on a new WW2 module.

 

Just to make it clear:

P-51D-25 and Fw190D-9 are original ED projects. Both are not from the KS project.

 

Researching for 7+ years for a certainly unclassified module is...yeah...interesting. Meanwhile ...F/A-18C, F-16C, AH-64D...

 

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