Plane explodes when touches tip of the tree) Are you kidding me?)

[shagrat]

vor 13 Stunden schrieb Barra1:

I’m pretty sure MSFS doesn’t have a collidable tree model and what’s more there is apparently trillions of them to crash into. Maybe this could be your thing.

 

At least until one of the third party developers decides to do DCS: Spruce Tree Simulator. I can see it now, high fidelity tree damage model with bending or breaking branches, accurate wild life fall physics, and accurate leaf float model based on wind tunnel testing in our backyard.

They have. Actually any contact with an object while airborne results in a black screen with a message that you made a mistake and damaged the plane. Then you can restart.

[Frederf]

Is there any aircraft-tree interaction that results in minor damage or is it binary modeling only?

[musolo]

11 hours ago, BIGNEWY said:

Please understand this is not a tree simulator, the trees are objects and they have a collision model, hitting the collision model will result in a unplanned disassembly. 

 

I couldn`t agree more on that one. Nobody is asking to develop complex colliders fo the trees) But to say that current "disassembly" is WAY more severe that it should be doesnt even begin to describe it)  Disassembly(partial that is) is one thing - complete evaporation is another thing) You have a collision model - conical or square collider for the whole tree, shape does not matter that much. And say you  keep collider as it is if none of the above suggestions about collider editing are axeptable.

Here`s another solution - There is event triggered every time when this collider is touched. What the block of code is doing in triggered function? By changing contents of this triggered function you can deal lesser damage to a plane. Say you explode (for example R-60or any other small missile) with vertical offset from the origin point of the tree.  That trigered function then could  instead of destroing impacted game object completely just deal some damage to it. And by changing this one function you acheive desired effect every time it is called by any tree collider that is hit by the plane. 
Something crearly has to be done about this issue coz the way it is right now damage amount delt to the plane is ridiculous.

Instant fireball from a spruce broomstick is a bit of a stretch to put it mildly)))  

Edited August 21, 2021 by musolo

[Hoots]

2 minutes ago, musolo said:

I couldn`t agree more on that one. Nobody is asking to develop complex colliders fo the trees) But to say that current "disassembly" is WAY more severe that it should be doesnt even begin to describe it)  Disassembly(partial that is) is one thing - complete evaporation is another thing) You have a collision model - conical or square collider for the whole tree, shape does not matter that much. And say you  keep collider as it is if none of the above suggestions about collider editing are axeptable.

Here`s another solution - There is event triggered every time when this collider is touched. What the block of code is doing in triggered function? By changing contents of this triggered function you can deal lesser damage to a plane. Say you explode (for example R-60or any other small missile) with vertical offset from the origin point of the tree.  That trigered function then could  instead of destroing impacted game object completely just deal some damage to it. And by changing this one function you acheive desired effect every time it is called by any tree collider that is hit by the plane. 
Something crearly has to be done about this issue coz the way it is right now damage amount delt to the plane is ridiculous.

Instant fireball from a spruce broomstick is a bit of a stretch to put it mildly)))  

 

Mate, they’ve been very polite but it’s really time to drop this, learn not to fly into trees and to get on with enjoying all the other things that this simulation does so well. 
 

[Rudel_chw]

3 minutes ago, musolo said:

... Something crearly has to be done about this issue ...

 

Really? .. can't you simply learn to fly a bit higher? .. you are really wasting time ranting about this.

[Bagpipe]

I am starting to feel like this guy has just graduated Troll College and is wanting to test out his new skillset.

Let's just back away slowly...so as not to trip on any of the branches he is busy knocking off trees! 

 

But, genuinely, if you want this to change start gathering the relevant data proving your point. You can't just say "your trees suck, fix them".

Give them several real world examples, data driven examples, not just some random YouTube video.
Scientific reports showing the effects of clipping different trees at different times of year/growth and what the outcome was for the aircraft and the pilot involved.
Determine in your report the exact variables involved in the real world collisions i.e. Type of tree, height of tree, age of tree, did the tree have any signs of disease, angle of impact, speed of aircraft, model of aircraft, parts which collided with tree, engine RPM at time of collision, payload, wind speeds, ambient temperatures, dew point etc.

 

Then the guys at ED can maybe just about simulate with some degree of accuracy what you are asking for.
 

[pocketedition]

Goodness me, for the first time ever I'm fine with the sound of a bagpipe.

[musolo]

Evidence provided in this thread is more than sufficient to disproof any argument for current ridiculous impact effect. A true magic trick ) I mean i love magic tricks but when i know i`m watchig magic show)

I`ll rest my case knowing i gave my fare share of effort to show that to anybody who will ever come across this issue. Not coz of some  bystanders whos "filler" type comments are void of any substance or rational) I  allways have fun reading those.  This thread was adressed to members of ED team that have something to do with this miracle)  Proofs are shown, ways of possible fixes suggested.

If there`s a will there`s a way some say) 

I leave this thread  sending you this wonderful post card from Georgia)

Cheers! 

 

Edited August 22, 2021 by musolo

[Barra1]

12 hours ago, Bagpipe said:

I am starting to feel like this guy has just graduated Troll College and is wanting to test out his new skillset.

Let's just back away slowly...so as not to trip on any of the branches he is busy knocking off trees! 

 

 

You hit the nail on the head here.

Edited August 22, 2021 by Barra1

[shagrat]

vor 17 Stunden schrieb Frederf:

Is there any aircraft-tree interaction that results in minor damage or is it binary modeling only?

If you reference MSFS, there is no damage modeling at all.

Whenever something breaks the simulation stops, you get a black screen with a message "what" you broke/how, e.g. "overspeed airframe" etc. and then you exit or restart.

It hasn't changed since the first MS Flightsimulator. 

 

[shagrat]

vor 11 Stunden schrieb musolo:

Evidence provided in this thread is more than sufficient to disproof any argument for current ridiculous impact effect. A true magic trick ) I mean i love magic tricks but when i know i`m watchig magic show)

I`ll rest my case knowing i gave my fare share of effort to show that to anybody who will ever come across this issue. Not coz of some  bystanders whos "filler" type comments are void of any substance or rational) I  allways have fun reading those.  This thread was adressed to members of ED team that have something to do with this miracle)  Proofs are shown, ways of possible fixes suggested.

If there`s a will there`s a way some say) 

I leave this thread  sending you this wonderful post card from Georgia)

Cheers! 

 

 

Nice picture there

 

Now, imagine what happens if you shear that of and feed it into your engine turbine at 500kts... BOOOM!

...and as I've tried to explain multiple times: the FC3 planes lack the detailed internal damage model for engines and avionics so the result of the calculation is a big explosion.

Turbine blades are not designed to chop wood... That is the main reason aircrew clear runways as part of FOD prevention. And a bunch 30x1.5 branches plus a dozen egg-sized cones may classify as foreign objects. Just saying...

[shagrat]

vor 15 Stunden schrieb musolo:

But to say that current "disassembly" is WAY more severe that it should be doesnt even begin to describe it)  Disassembly(partial that is) is one thing - complete evaporation is another thing)

Then, fly an F-18C or A-10C into the trees and be amazed by the disintegration of wings, burning parts tumbling to the ground in beautiful cascade of events, triggered by collidiing with an object.

Their damage model is more detailed and can even model "shearing off/damaging a wing tip" and limp home with that. 

To sum it up: the tree model is fine, what you want is an upgrade to the FC3 damage model to provide a more detailed destruction after hitting objects at high speed.

What version of DCS (stable/openbeta, version no.) do you use. Because ultimately that is an interesting point worth investigating... The plane should disintegrate more or less similar to being destroyed by a direct missile hit.

[Wrcknbckr]

Without ridiculing the subject I suggest to put this topic at the very last item on the to-do list, together with requests for accurate modelling of the landing gear operation after belly landing, or any other request outside a realistic operating procedure/envelope.

[Bagpipe]

16 hours ago, musolo said:

I leave this thread ...

Come on man, it's over. I offered you a rational explanation for your observation as well as the correct way to file a data based request to change a fundamental element of the sim but you are now just making yourself look silly(er) and trolling my other posts is ridiculously poor form.

 

We can all move on, I won't hold it against you. It was an idea, just not the most pressing one for anybody else.

Nobody wins or loses here. It's just a game forum. 

 

Have a nice day

[Frederf]

6 hours ago, shagrat said:

If you reference MSFS, there is no damage modeling at all.

Whenever something breaks the simulation stops, you get a black screen with a message "what" you broke/how, e.g. "overspeed airframe" etc. and then you exit or restart.

It hasn't changed since the first MS Flightsimulator. 

 

I am asking about DCS.

[shagrat]

vor 8 Stunden schrieb Frederf:

I am asking about DCS.

Ah ok. For DCS helicopters shred of tips of blades, then disintegrate the whole blade, or dent the tail rotor, or clip the tail. Aircraft shred of wingtips, lose/damage, wings or nose at slower speeds, and explode when flying into objects at higher speeds. There is no difference that I know of between damage taken by trees, poles, masts, or buildings if you clip your wing for example. The factors seem to rely on speed, mass etc. and calculated damage dealt on impact to the section "touching" the object.

So if you hit a collision model with the fuselage of the plane at 500 kts plus the damage dealt to the fuselage will result in an exploding aircraft. It is open for debate, if the explosion, should be the same as we know from a larger missile hit, with the plane breaking apart, and parts tumbling down with a flaming trail, but that's part of the damage model of the plane, not the trees.

Edited August 22, 2021 by shagrat

[BIGNEWY]

Thread is done now. 

 

As mentioned trees have a collision model, dont fly into trees. 

 

thanks