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Extended force feedback support?


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Posted (edited)

Hi

 

I am planning on getting the Brunner CLS-E joystick (with a Virpil grip). I am however on the edge, and wondering about the following:

 

- It does not support any special effects programmed with DirectX for other FFB sticks (e.g. MSFFB2). I am thinking here about recoil from gun (wherever it is felt), aircraft vibration, wind gusts, turbulence, transonic regions (airflow disturbances), buffeting, etc... Is there any chance to have these effects re-emulated for the software environment that Brunner uses?

 

- I read that one has to use Brunner´s proprietary CLSSIM2 for setting up the trim. Why does it not work through DCS controls? I understand that one can bind keys on the same physical buttons from both CLSSIM2 and DCS, but this isn´t a perfect solution. Also, it becomes clumsy if one is to establish new bindings for a fresh module.

 

- Future support? Will ED focus on this product, and potentially improve it´s support? Is it possible for you to emulate the FFB-effects to natively support the Brunner CLS-E joystick without any third-party software, only their dedicated DCS-pluggin?

 

This is really essential for me, and I guess anyone else on the edge of getting into this product-line. This joystick is the only way of simulating a real trim-system in a helicopter, except specific hydraulic systems. Support from ED on this product would have an immense impact on DCS and further the struggle for realism. Could any ED-representative give an insight on how you perceive this case? @BIGNEWY @NineLine @Wags

 

Thank you in advance!


Edited by zerO_crash

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If a FFB stick for USD 2-300 came along, hopefully with an open source new FFB implementation, and enough users bought it. I'm sure ED and third parties would embrace it. But the Brunner? Don't think ED will waste time and resources for the five (wild guess), users that has it. Sorry.
I have now acquired four MS FFB2, and hopefully I get time to mod and mate them.

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27 minutes ago, MAXsenna said:

If a FFB stick for USD 2-300 came along, hopefully with an open source new FFB implementation, and enough users bought it. I'm sure ED and third parties would embrace it. But the Brunner? Don't think ED will waste time and resources for the five (wild guess), users that has it. Sorry.
I have now acquired four MS FFB2, and hopefully I get time to mod and mate them. emoji4.png

Sent from my MAR-LX1A using Tapatalk
 

 

Well, "five" might have them now, but in part, due to somewhat questionable support and future of this product within DCS-environment. MSFFB2 was great for its time, but is limited compared to what we have today. Even if you mod it, it´s not an optimal solution. A Brunner is still cheaper than some hydraulic-setups. Still, for me, it´s the size that plays the role. Brunner allows you to have a much more compact setup, while still being able to simulate a realistic, off-center trim.

 

As to how much work it needs; there is a user on these forums which made a mod for the Arduino to literally emulate the DirectX forces to something that the Brunner can read. My only gripe with it is that it needs a bit more setup and indeed a separate Arduino with external software running in the background. I´m asking, is it then not possible for ED to create something similar and ship it integrated without the need of running more software in the background? The Arduino-solution, although operational, is not a ultimate one.

 

Also, with regards to thinking ahead. If ED would have such an emulator within the simulation, then effectively, all equipment made for MS2020, would work with DCS. People that exclusively fly MS2020 are potential customers here. Plus, I´m not sure, but it doesn´t seem like FFB requires a lot of maintenance. I don´t really see an issue with this. You do it once, and it´s there to stay. Right now, DCS has FFB which few can use (I loved my MSFFB2, but I would never go back to it from my Virpil CM-base). Brunner however is a solution with modern approach, and proper software for it is multi-use for other future products, even from other companies.

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Hi, 

 

We continue with MSFFB as it is now, but I am not aware of any plans to expand it sorry. I can mention it to the team but can make no promise. 

 

thanks

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8 minutes ago, BIGNEWY said:

Hi, 

 

We continue with MSFFB as it is now, but I am not aware of any plans to expand it sorry. I can mention it to the team but can make no promise. 

 

thanks

Would be awesome if you could BIGNEWY, if you have a chance to update me on your internal thoughts about this, it would be great too.

 

In the end, atleast as long as the current implementation remains, I’ll live. But if it get’s dropped somewhere along the line, then that’s bad investment for me.

 

Thanks

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Well, the only problem I have with the FFB2, is that it's a little softness in "the center", but people have solved that with timing belts.
1000 for a stick that doesn't seem to hold a Warthog grip with an extension?
I would never be happy. It'll probably be more fun building my own.
But I cross my fingers for you. Do lots of users in that new som have Brunners? Wouldn't a FFB yoke fit more?
Cheers!

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I'm dying for a decent FFB HOTAS setup.  I hope one is on the horizon.  I would pay good money for it.  If anyone has the Brunner and the Audrino setup and could give feedback on what's supported it would greatly help my purchase decision.  My main concern is the time it can hold max force.

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 6/2/2021 at 12:43 AM, jwflowersii said:

I'm dying for a decent FFB HOTAS setup.  I hope one is on the horizon.  I would pay good money for it.  If anyone has the Brunner and the Audrino setup and could give feedback on what's supported it would greatly help my purchase decision.  My main concern is the time it can hold max force.

 

There isn't really any problem with running high loadings on this joystick. Those who manage to overheat the base, seem to be running rather long extensions (above 20cm), or simply heavy sticks. If you don't use any extension, then its not a problem, simply because the stick becomes heavy to fly with and you won't force it the same way as you do with an extension. This is really a non-issue.

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