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map TAIWAN or (FORMOSA ISLAND)


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On 6/11/2021 at 5:35 PM, Tank50us said:

 

You don't seem to understand... The Chinese Government, who've vowed to take Tiawan back by force, would love to have a map such as this specifically so they can learn how to defeat Tiawans air forces with minimal casualties. As I've said before on other subjects: Cities change, terrain doesn't. You would effectively be giving one of the most evil empires on the planet the key to defeating their adversary. Trust me, it's an extremely bad idea. Unless you want a real war were the missiles that are flying aren't pixels on a screen, they're really fixed with HighEx, and they will be killing real people.

that's reaaaaallllllllllly dumb reasoning, like seriously, the CCP doesn't need some game to get maps of the island right next door, I'd be worried more about the CCP denying the representation of the Area of the map that would be mainland china instead

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54 minutes ago, Kerbo 416 said:

that's reaaaaallllllllllly dumb reasoning, like seriously, the CCP doesn't need some game to get maps of the island right next door, I'd be worried more about the CCP denying the representation of the Area of the map that would be mainland china instead

 

Given how they flipped out about people cheering that Taiwan actually beat them at the Olympics, are you sure about that?

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6 minutes ago, Tank50us said:

 

Given how they flipped out about people cheering that Taiwan actually beat them at the Olympics, are you sure about that?

Yes I'm sure, if anything this'll be a great sell for the Chinese market finally having a part of China represented, besides  how does them getting offended relate to them studying a DCS map for an invasion of Taiwan like you claimed? 

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3 minutes ago, Tank50us said:

Because that offense also comes the real possibility of war.

this has absouletely nothing to do with the idea of China using a Taiwan map for intel as you suggested, however, are you really claiming a war, probably a Third World War, would start over China getting mad some soyboys are shooting virtual planes marked in PLAAF markings? wow that's some galaxy big brain shit right there

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  • 3 weeks later...

This is a great, great idea for a map!!  I encourage this map to be explored.  Taiwan is supported by the United States; however, Mainland China claims that Taiwan belongs to them.  This map would be a great way to have missions and campaigns where the Taiwanese and Americans defend the island against China.  Positioning a carrier task force group in the Sea of Japan or the Pacific Ocean, which could be used to counter hostile forces.  

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  • 1 month later...
On 6/11/2021 at 5:35 PM, Tank50us said:

 

You don't seem to understand... The Chinese Government, who've vowed to take Tiawan back by force, would love to have a map such as this specifically so they can learn how to defeat Tiawans air forces with minimal casualties. As I've said before on other subjects: Cities change, terrain doesn't. You would effectively be giving one of the most evil empires on the planet the key to defeating their adversary. Trust me, it's an extremely bad idea. Unless you want a real war were the missiles that are flying aren't pixels on a screen, they're really fixed with HighEx, and they will be killing real people.

That's ridiculous. As if the CCP/PLAA would have need of DCS to plan their attack on Taiwan. They have their own simulators, they have their own maps and they have their own intel. DCS is sketchy at best when it comes to anything other than air combat, and even that is really not that accurate but more of a guestimate of real platform and weapon performance. Besides all that it'll be a decisive victory for china in any case. They can just shell Taiwan to bits with artillery and send a massive amphibious landing fleet. Also wouldn't it allow Taiwan to plan a defense against the chinese? Wouldn't caucasus allow russia to plan to take over georgia? Wouldn't the persian gulf map allow iran to plan an attack on oman? This logic is ridiculous. DCS is a consumer product. I'd love to see the south china sea/taiwan and the korea maps.

 

Besides all that Taiwan is defacto it's own country and many nations across the globe do recognize that. Are we going to label everything to appease china now just because they're butthurt over it otherwise? Are we just going to say the south china sea belongs to them because someone scribbled a line on a chart? I for one am not going to give in to their "soft power" bullshit. Taiwan is Taiwan or republic of china and not part of the PRC. I don't get this whole political nonsense about being careful what you call who. I can say the sky is yellow with purple stripes and green dots all year long. Doesn't make it so. In any case whatever map you look on Taiwan will be labeled Taiwan except those maps produced and sold in the PRC and I don't see why ED should do it any differently. Maybe they can label it "Rogue province of china" in the Chineese translation or something. Nobody cares.


Edited by FalcoGer
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Build in Ryukyu Okinawa Islands and this would be ideal for the previous WW2 scenario of USN/USAAF during prior to and during operation Iceberg against the IJAF/IJN Kamikaze using the F4U/P-51 and P-47 and hopefully future Japanese aircraft. This would be in addition to the current/future flashpoint that must surely utilize USA assets from Okinawa 

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  • 2 weeks later...

It would be called DCS: Taiwan or DCS: South China Sea depending on how expansive they want to make the theater. I have in depth and on location data regarding Taiwan so if anyone wants to collaborate to make this a reality I am more than happy to oblige with my expertise on the subject. Furthermore I completed a full tour of the dynamic campaign in Commanche vs Hokum which featured the entire island of Taiwan. Like Marianas, I would prefer a modern version of the island rather than a WW2 version. I want to include an unprecedented 500 important or landmark objects such as Taiwan 101, the Presidential Palace, capital buildings, temples, disused fortifications and bunkers from the occupation period, etc, etc.

The topography of Taiwan naturally lends itself to helicopter operations, it can be flown over via fighter jet quite quickly, but for helicopters it's perfect, furthermore there is a variety of terrain from rocky mountains, dense forested mountains and jungles, to lowland valleys, swamps, arid dusty regions, many different types of shores, ports, wharfs to highly congested population centers and everything in between. With Taiwan the transition from industrial factory to Buddhist pagoda ridden mountainous jungles is often 15 minutes bus ride apart. Not to mention all the windy mountain roads, tunnels, and bridges. The variety of geography, architecture, infrastructural development within a 10 mile radius is astounding. Again, it's the perfect template for a low level helicopter sim. terrain obstruction and flying nap of the earth through canyons is unparalleled in Taiwan.

Furthermore the armed forces of Taiwan is comprised mostly of US exports, so to build the indigenous force of the ROC faction will be quite easy. Cobras flying overhead are a very common sight to Taiwanese residents

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On 6/11/2021 at 8:35 AM, Tank50us said:

 

You don't seem to understand... The Chinese Government, who've vowed to take Tiawan back by force, would love to have a map such as this specifically so they can learn how to defeat Tiawans air forces with minimal casualties. As I've said before on other subjects: Cities change, terrain doesn't. You would effectively be giving one of the most evil empires on the planet the key to defeating their adversary. Trust me, it's an extremely bad idea. Unless you want a real war were the missiles that are flying aren't pixels on a screen, they're really fixed with HighEx, and they will be killing real people.

Very bad take and signals an ignorance regarding the politics of the region. They've been saying that for 50 years. Furthermore, no matter how detailed our map will be, the Chinese will have access to more detailed and accurate data than anyone can ever produce, from military satellite and drone surveillance to the fact that they can literally swim from china to taiwan and have done so routinely in the past for training their spies and assassins. They probably have people on the ground in Taiwan right now, and all this data has been gathered over a period of half a century. they don't need to reference a video game map made in 2 or 3 years based on publicly available information. The idea that a modern superpower's battle plan hinges on a video game is the epitome of dunning-krugers

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Just requires careful marketing. It can be implied in descriptions and marketing that Taiwan is a part of China/is a rebel province. Map labeling can be modified so instead of “Taipei” it’s “Chinese Taipei” (Taiwan competes in the Olympics as Chinese Taipei to appease China). The faction will be titled as “ROCAF” to distinguish between a rebel government on the Island of Taiwan vs Taiwan being its own country. This should be enough to sastify the Chinese government, after all its a video game.
 
Eagle Dynamics is also not risking any political statement doing this. Air Canada got pressured by the PRC into relabeling their flights to Taipei from “Taipei, Taiwan” to “Taipei, Taiwan, China”. It’s pretty widely accepted by the world that Taiwan is a touchy topic and certain phrases must be used. In reality countries and people know Taiwan is de facto independent and not some rebel province. The fact that major world countries accept an ROC passport as valid for entry is enough to prove this. For comparison, major countries like the US, UK, etc. do not accept an Abkhazian Passport, requiring any person from Abkhazia to use either a Georgian or Russian Passport, which clearly shows they do not accept Abkhazia as independent (de facto or de jure). Not to mention the US recently sold 66 brand new state of the art F-16Vs to Taiwan. No way in hell would the US sell the latest block F-16s to just some Chinese rebel province. So yeah, Eagle Dynamics wouldn’t be taking any political statement risks because they chose to use certain phrases.
 
Edit: I just realized, maps are sold as DLC anyways. If the map really would be a big issue with the Chinese government, perhaps ED can make it so that you can't purchase the map if you're location is in China. If Steam is able to make certain games unavailable in certain regions, so can ED.

I too, badly want a Taiwan/South China Seas map to play out the defense of Taiwan against the encroachment of an increasingly belligerent China.

The last thing that we should accept or encourage is for ED to exclusively parrot and distribute Chinese Communist Party propaganda in marketing materials all for a buck, or even more lamely, for our mere entertainment.

If that’s what it takes, then screw it. It’s not worth it. And I’m frankly appalled that capitulating and pandering to a totalitarian state— all to get toys for our hobby— is what’s even being suggested as a recommended “solution” here.

Sure, if China gets one version and the rest of the world gets another, that’s one thing. It’s a bit weasly, but okay. Or if the labels and descriptions change based on the side selected, great. Justifiable and immersive. Instant buy.

But to suggest that the module should only label the independent, democratic, sovereign state of Taiwan “a rebel province of China”, and then push that view through international marketing— this is exactly how China uses “soft power” to export false propaganda globally and force international business and culture to self-censor all that doesn’t comply with the CCP’s narrative.

You can argue “we know better”, but China’s strategy is to keep this up for long enough that eventually “we” won’t, whoever the next generation of “we” might be. ED should not be part of this, nor should it involve its players in support of this brand of exported totalitarianism either.

I don’t care to get “political” when talking about DCS, but some of the “solutions” and suggestions presented here really raise my ire and are too important to not address.

TLDR: a Taiwan map would be amazing. Faction specific labels for Taiwan would be fine. Labeling Taiwan *only* as a “rebel province” and then exclusively pushing that narrative through international marketing materials to appease China as some suggest here would be awful, pathetic, tasteless, and soulless.
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In any case whatever map you look on Taiwan will be labeled Taiwan except those maps produced and sold in the PRC and I don't see why ED should do it any differently. Maybe they can label it "Rogue province of china" in the Chineese translation or something. Nobody cares.



They can label Taiwan whatever they want in the SIMPLIFIED Chinese translation.

In the Traditional Chinese translation, it should say Taiwan, and/or Republic of China depending on time period.
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