New hotas function

[gregfp66]

Hello, i've read in a recent newsletter that new hotas function are coming.

 

My question is what hotas command our hornet is currently missing?

[Dunx]

I may be wrong, but I believe (hope) it will be the ability to map 2 and 3 position toggle switches correctly.

 

Currently, we have to use external tools or LUA editing to map things such as Gear Up + Gear Down to a single 2-position toggle switch.

[gregfp66]

I think by hotas function they meant more function to existing Button like ability with scs down to switch between SA and HSI

[Brass2-1]

Great news!

[Hulkbust44]

Hello, i've read in a recent newsletter that new hotas function are coming.
 
My question is what hotas command our hornet is currently missing?

Our Hornet is missing *a lot* question is how much documentation does ED have. My guess is this next one will be castle forward twice to toggle EMCON. Who knows, they could give us radar Azimuth bump, of SA format range bump via TDC. Could be TDC selectable options for the SA and attack formats. (Have some for A/A radar but not all)

https://r.tapatalk.com/shareLink/topic?url=https://forums.eagle.ru/topic/262863-hotas-fuctionalities/&share_tid=262863&share_fid=74365&share_type=t&link_source=app

Previous discussion on this from more knowledgeable people than me....

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

[Swift.]

Off the top of my head, theres that whole thing about SCS depress being a modifier. So iirc:
SCS Depress+ Right/Left = IFF
SCS Depress + Aft = TGT Data

there will be others too, but those are the ones I've heard of.

[Jak525]

The post Hulk linked has a lot of the missing things. Another rather annoying thing is the automatic format selection on the left DDI. In DCS right now entering either A/A or A/G master mode brings to the Stores format. In AA, with the FLIR loaded, it brings up the FLIR which is just completely wrong and defeats the Az/El HOTAS mechanic with the FLIR and STORES pushbutton shortcuts.

 

What should happen is the left DDI is actually unchanged when entering a master mode. However, in NAV and AG Castling left will bring up the Stores format and in AA Castle left brings up Az/El. Castle for Az/El is implemented in DCS but not for Stores in AG/NAV, which'd be handy. The bigger issue is the Stores/FLIR formats raining on your parade whenever switching between AA and AG master mode. Very difficult to use.

 

Note the invoking of the Stores and FLIR format via master mode change seems to be from a very old OFP, predating things like the AzEl format entirely. With the later avionics it is very very annoying.

[Steel Jaw]

DDIs need to remember their page when switching modes.  Also need a DTC.

[Hulkbust44]

The post Hulk linked has a lot of the missing things. Another rather annoying thing is the automatic format selection on the left DDI. In DCS right now entering either A/A or A/G master mode brings to the Stores format. In AA, with the FLIR loaded, it brings up the FLIR which is just completely wrong and defeats the Az/El HOTAS mechanic with the FLIR and STORES pushbutton shortcuts.
 
What should happen is the left DDI is actually unchanged when entering a master mode. However, in NAV and AG Castling left will bring up the Stores format and in AA Castle left brings up Az/El. Castle for Az/El is implemented in DCS but not for Stores in AG/NAV, which'd be handy. The bigger issue is the Stores/FLIR formats raining on your parade whenever switching between AA and AG master mode. Very difficult to use.
 
Note the invoking of the Stores and FLIR format via master mode change seems to be from a very old OFP, predating things like the AzEl format entirely. With the later avionics it is very very annoying.

Do you know what OFP these were implimented in? Our Hornet's appears to be 20x.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

The post Hulk linked has a lot of the missing things. Another rather annoying thing is the automatic format selection on the left DDI. In DCS right now entering either A/A or A/G master mode brings to the Stores format. In AA, with the FLIR loaded, it brings up the FLIR which is just completely wrong and defeats the Az/El HOTAS mechanic with the FLIR and STORES pushbutton shortcuts.
 
What should happen is the left DDI is actually unchanged when entering a master mode. However, in NAV and AG Castling left will bring up the Stores format and in AA Castle left brings up Az/El. Castle for Az/El is implemented in DCS but not for Stores in AG/NAV, which'd be handy. The bigger issue is the Stores/FLIR formats raining on your parade whenever switching between AA and AG master mode. Very difficult to use.
 
Note the invoking of the Stores and FLIR format via master mode change seems to be from a very old OFP, predating things like the AzEl format entirely. With the later avionics it is very very annoying.

Also, any idea what the new HOTAS functions coming in this month are? Only thing on the roadmap is the EMCON toggle but I hope it brings more.

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[Jak525]

3 minutes ago, Hulkbust44 said:

Do you know what OFP these were implimented in? Our Hornet's appears to be 20x.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk
 

Our Hornet is not 20X nor 15C nor 21X nor 19C nor 91C. It's a frankenstein roughly circa the 2000s with some stuff from the 2010s and other things erroneously added from like, the 1990s. That said these are from I believe at least 15C (2001ish). Generally what's important is to get features in the "post-MSI" era as opposed to before that. This was 15C+, and is when a lot of things were overhauled with the integration of sensor fused MSI trackfiles. The Az/El format entirely, for example, was an invention that came with MSI.

Edited May 19, 2021 by Jak525

[Hulkbust44]

Our Hornet is not 20X nor 15C nor 21X nor 19C nor 91C. It's a frankenstein roughly circa the 2000s. That said these are from I believe at least 15C. Generally what's important is to get features in the "post-MSI" era. This was 15C+, and is when a lot of things were overhauled with the integration of sensor fused MSI trackfiles. The Az/El format entirely, for example, was an invention that came with MSI.

Gotcha, when I was looking through NATOPS it mentioned that DCML being the default corrdinate format was added with 20X, that's what I based my assumption on.

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[Jak525]

1 hour ago, Mower said:

DDIs need to remember their page when switching modes.  Also need a DTC.

They don't remember like the F-16 I believe does. For example if you had the FLIR up in A/G and switch to A/A the FLIR should stay there. If you then open the Stores format in AA, and switch back to AG, the Stores remains on the left DDI. It doesn't remember the format per master mode, rather it just does not change it. Exception applies to RDDI which invokes the Radar/Attack format on entering AA.

1 hour ago, Hulkbust44 said:

Gotcha, when I was looking through NATOPS it mentioned that DCML being the default corrdinate format was added with 20X, that's what I based my assumption on.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk
 

Yeah, 20X was 09 or something? It was the first merged OFP, hence the X. X means Super Hornet and Legacy. C means Legacy only and E means Super Hornet only. Of course the C and E OFPs were largely similar if not identical. Anyways, but with "X" they formally merged them.

 

I think generally as modern as possible should be the mantra if given a choice, within the 2000s timeframe.

Edited May 19, 2021 by Jak525

[HILOK]

thanks @Jak525 for all that info! please keep it coming  i for one find correct implementation of HOTAS functions/DDI management essential, and i hope our hornet will get all that good stuff soon

[104th_Crunch]

As per today's patch notes. Copy and pasted below. Is this all explained in the manual in the docs folder after the update? Can't check now. At work.

 

• Added Remaining options for HOTAS

• A/A Radar
  • Surface
  • TWS EXP
  • Mode
  • Azimuth Scan Centering
  • Change azimuth using cursor on tactical regions left and right
  • Mode

• A/G Radar
  • Mode
  • Freeze
  • EXP1, EXP2, EXP3
  • Pen/Fan
  • Silent
  • Range
  • Air
  • Active

• A/G EXP
  • FAST

• RDR Data
  • Age

• TDC
  • Azimuth on Radar Attack
  • Range on SA
  • Auto/man TWS option
  • PRF and Reset

• Event Marker
  • On/Off SA EXP

• Sensor control switch depress then right
  • CIT manual interrogation

• TDC cursor added for AG EXP mode

[Hulkbust44]

The majority of these are the ability to use the TDC + TDC depress to select options on the SA and attak formats. 
The TDC section is talking about bumping. Just as you can bump the radar scale by bring the TDC cursor out of the tactical area then back in within one second, you can now do the same on the SA format for scale and left/right side of the attack format to decrease and increase azimuth respectively. 

IFF CIT interrogation is no longer SCS depress (which was made up before) SCS depress actually acts as a modifier for other functions, but right now it's just depress and left for manual IFF.

RECEE event mark switch now toggles SA format EXP function. I don't know if that is context sensitive as that button also toggles JHMCS blanking, I would assume so with requirement being SA as TDC priority.

[naizarak]

yeah the wording is misleading. these aren't new HOTAS functions, they've just made the existing buttons TDC-compatible.

[Bunny Clark]

Here's what I've found so far, using the patch notes as a guide:

 

Things that now get a pop-up menu when you hover over them allowing you to make a selection with the TDC (like bars and azimuth do):

-A/A Radar: RWS / TWS

-A/A Radar: INTL / HI / LOW

-A/A Radar: Age Timeout (weirdly, you can't select DATA with the TDC to access this)

-A/G Radar: MAP / GMT / SEA / TA

 

Things that you can now select with TDC Depress as if you hit the adjacent OSB:

-SURF / AIR

 

A/A Radar:

-RSET

-ERASE

-TWS AUTO / MAN

-TWS EXP

 

A/G Radar:

-EXP1, EXP2, and EXP3

-PEN / FAN

-FRZ

-RSET

-SIL

-Range Arrows (were these not clickable before?)

-From EXP: FAST

 

Additionally there are new "bumps" you can perform by moving the cursor out of the tactical space and back in quickly:

A/A Radar Right Side: Increase Azimuth one step

A/A Radar Left Side: Decrease Azimuth one step

SA Page Top: Increase display scale

SA Page Bottom: Decrease display scale

 

The Cursor also disappears now from pages that are not Priority. 

 

[Smashy]

Thanks for the summary @Bunny Clark.  I briefly played around with the new HOTAS/TDC features and found them marginally useful.  I have my TDC axis sensitivities relatively low to help with fine adjustments when targeting so it's too slow for me to move it edge-to-edge on the DDI.  This is made worse by the way the cursor resets to the upper left corner after hitting the TDC depress when selecting something like the range arrows.

 

Some questions:

• anyone know what is "TA" mode on the A/G radar format?
• what is EXP: FAST?

I'll be digging around the docs and experimenting so if I figure anything out, I'll post here if no one answers.  I also need to find info on the new RAID features (SAM and 1LOOK).

[Zarma]

FAST = faster radar beam but lesser resolution

[Fromthedeep]

42 minutes ago, Smashy said:

• anyone know what is "TA" mode on the A/G radar format?
•  

TA is terrain avoidance, one of the currently unimplemented radar modes.

[Bunny Clark]

2 hours ago, Smashy said:

I have my TDC axis sensitivities relatively low to help with fine adjustments when targeting so it's too slow for me to move it edge-to-edge on the DDI.  This is made worse by the way the cursor resets to the upper left corner after hitting the TDC depress when selecting something like the range arrows.

This is something I've struggled with as well. I ended up leaving the sensitivity at max and using a curve instead. That gives me good fine control around center while still allowing fast movement if I push the TDC to full deflection. I'm finding the new azimuth bumps to be really useful, and the range bumps on SA are very welcome too. 

 

Ditto on the cursor resetting after depressing a button. That's quite annoying. I wonder if that's how it works in real life or a WIP thing that will get changed. I hope it's the latter. 

[Hulkbust44]

1 minute ago, Bunny Clark said:

This is something I've struggled with as well. I ended up leaving the sensitivity at max and using a curve instead. That gives me good fine control around center while still allowing fast movement if I push the TDC to full deflection. I'm finding the new azimuth bumps to be really useful, and the range bumps on SA are very welcome too. 

 

Ditto on the cursor resetting after depressing a button. That's quite annoying. I wonder if that's how it works in real life or a WIP thing that will get changed. I hope it's the latter. 

BN just tagged a report for it as "correct as is" unfortunately 

I just made a report for the lackluster TDC slew rate compared to IRL clips. Would make bumps a lot easier.

[Sacarino111]

16 hours ago, Bunny Clark said:

Here's what I've found so far, using the patch notes as a guide:

 

Things that now get a pop-up menu when you hover over them allowing you to make a selection with the TDC (like bars and azimuth do):

-A/A Radar: RWS / TWS

-A/A Radar: INTL / HI / LOW

-A/A Radar: Age Timeout (weirdly, you can't select DATA with the TDC to access this)

-A/G Radar: MAP / GMT / SEA / TA

 

Things that you can now select with TDC Depress as if you hit the adjacent OSB:

-SURF / AIR

 

A/A Radar:

-RSET

-ERASE

-TWS AUTO / MAN

-TWS EXP

 

A/G Radar:

-EXP1, EXP2, and EXP3

-PEN / FAN

-FRZ

-RSET

-SIL

-Range Arrows (were these not clickable before?)

-From EXP: FAST

 

Additionally there are new "bumps" you can perform by moving the cursor out of the tactical space and back in quickly:

A/A Radar Right Side: Increase Azimuth one step

A/A Radar Left Side: Decrease Azimuth one step

SA Page Top: Increase display scale

SA Page Bottom: Decrease display scale

 

The Cursor also disappears now from pages that are not Priority. 

HI.

Nice job. Thanks a lot.

Saludos.

Saca111

[Sacarino111]

HI, one adition to Bunny Clark.

When on MPCD (Center DDI) and on EHSI, bumping up or down in unavailable, as no TDC is present, but SSS aft toggles between SA and EHSI, so switch to SA, bump up or down till desired range and SSS aft back to EHSI. Not the fastest, but better than grabbing the mouse, selecting the range (going in one single direction!) clicking on OSB.

Saludos again.

Saca111

[Gianky]

17 hours ago, Bunny Clark said:

Here's what I've found so far, using the patch notes as a guide:

 

Things that now get a pop-up menu when you hover over them allowing you to make a selection with the TDC (like bars and azimuth do):

-A/A Radar: RWS / TWS

-A/A Radar: INTL / HI / LOW

-A/A Radar: Age Timeout (weirdly, you can't select DATA with the TDC to access this)

-A/G Radar: MAP / GMT / SEA / TA

 

Things that you can now select with TDC Depress as if you hit the adjacent OSB:

-SURF / AIR

 

A/A Radar:

-RSET

-ERASE

-TWS AUTO / MAN

-TWS EXP

 

A/G Radar:

-EXP1, EXP2, and EXP3

-PEN / FAN

-FRZ

-RSET

-SIL

-Range Arrows (were these not clickable before?)

-From EXP: FAST

 

Additionally there are new "bumps" you can perform by moving the cursor out of the tactical space and back in quickly:

A/A Radar Right Side: Increase Azimuth one step

A/A Radar Left Side: Decrease Azimuth one step

SA Page Top: Increase display scale

SA Page Bottom: Decrease display scale

 

The Cursor also disappears now from pages that are not Priority. 

 

 

Thank you very much, Bunny Clark, exactly what I needed to know and it's never explained in ED notes or documentation at patch release (having the manual updated only after weeks if not months is really annoying...)

 

Edited May 21, 2021 by Gianky