Any new Hind news?

[Gierasimov]

17 minutes ago, Lurker said:

Anyone else slightly worried that Petrovich AI won't be able to employ the ATGM AT missiles, at least initially on EA release? Hopefully I'm wrong about this. 

 

Multi-crew. Second crew member can be another player or "Petrovich" AI (basic AI level during early access phase)

 

AND

 

Full modeling of armament and weapons systems with ability to use 30mm cannon, unguided rockets (S-8, S-13, S-24B) and bombs from both cockpits in addition to the guided ATGM 9M114 operated by forward seated pilot-operator

 

Means that Early Access Petrovich will operate those, however knowing ED and their rather weird "thought - 2 - wording" process, combined with the above red and Petrovich reporting this truck in recent start up video (without Wags even commenting this) makes me believe EA Petrovich WILL NOT be capable of operating anything apart from heading / speed / altitude.    

[Jun]

42 minutes ago, Lurker said:

Anyone else slightly worried that Petrovich AI won't be able to employ the ATGM AT missiles, at least initially on EA release?

I'm not, what information is this concern based on? 

[Lurker]

1 hour ago, Jun said:

I'm not, what information is this concern based on? 

 

Yeah, the weird wording of EDs "press" releases, basically what Gierasimov said. Also the strange absence of any "new" AI information, other than the brief blurbs regarding it's hover and movement abilities, despite the imminent release of the Hind makes me believe that this is as far as they've come with the AI. Still, it's nothing concrete.

Edited May 31, 2021 by Lurker

[JimBo*]

steam had it releasing at 1200EST today, now it shows release in 6 hrs... 

[Morrov]

12 minutes ago, Porkie said:

steam had it releasing at 1200EST today, now it shows release in 6 hrs... 

 

From ED's Discord

 

 

Also, there's an update on the Steam page:

https://steamcommunity.com/app/223750/discussions/0/3166568651722149917/?ctp=3

Edited May 31, 2021 by Morrov

[Kovacs]

8 minutes ago, Porkie said:

steam had it releasing at 1200EST today, now it shows release in 6 hrs... 

in less than an hour for me (in France) but I do not know if this corresponds to a reality 

[Kovacs]

32 minutes ago, Kovacs said:

in less than an hour for me (in France) but I do not know if this corresponds to a reality 

 

 The message has just changed, product not available, will be released soon

 

 

[sagent54]

Changed to 16th june

[Gierasimov]

Good. More time for bringing more things to life. 

[JimBo*]

17 minutes ago, sagent54 said:

Changed to 16th june

and full price.

[monkie]

3 hours ago, Gierasimov said:

 

 

Full modeling of armament and weapons systems with ability to use 30mm cannon, unguided rockets (S-8, S-13, S-24B) and bombs from both cockpits in addition to the guided ATGM 9M114 operated by forward seated pilot-operator

 

Means that Early Access Petrovich will operate those, however knowing ED and their rather weird "thought - 2 - wording" process, combined with the above red and Petrovich reporting this truck in recent start up video (without Wags even commenting this) makes me believe EA Petrovich WILL NOT be capable of operating anything apart from heading / speed / altitude.    

 

Yeah I agree,  I don't read in there that the AI will be able to search, locate and engage targets on it's own while the player fly's from the rear seat. To me that just says you can operate the ATGM 9M114 from the front seat yourself. I could be wrong and I hope I am as that capabilty would be fantastic in early release and a real game changer.

[monkie]

 

HIND...... It's coming.

Edited May 31, 2021 by monkie

[ThorBrasil]

ED changed the date to June 16 on Steam. And that date falls on Wednesday. So, can it be real?

https://store.steampowered.com/app/223750/DCS_World_Steam_Edition/

[JimBo*]

8 minutes ago, ThorBrasil said:

ED changed the date to June 16 on Steam. And that date falls on Wednesday. So, can it be real?

https://store.steampowered.com/app/223750/DCS_World_Steam_Edition/

its a place holder... and just so happens to be 2 wks.

[Morrov]

I suppose we just need to monitor the "Early access date" thread and wait for the official info.

16th sounds very promising.

[sublime]

6 hours ago, Lurker said:

 

Yeah, the weird wording of EDs "press" releases, basically what Gierasimov said. Also the strange absence of any "new" AI information, other than the brief blurbs regarding it's hover and movement abilities, despite the imminent release of the Hind makes me believe that this is as far as they've come with the AI. Still, it's nothing concrete.

 

Yeah man this is why in my post after the simplified start up I said I was sorta worried.  When the F14 came out we had already heard jester do stuff and say a ton of stuff.  They couldn't really hide him at all. I didn't even notice the ai in this till someone said he said one line.  Still hoping I was wrong when I urged then to adapt jester and lease him from HB

[H0RN3T]

*18th 

 

lol and they changed it again to 16th xd

Edited May 31, 2021 by H0RN3T

[monkie]

The 13th.....  take that one to the bank and cash it.

[Lurker]

9 hours ago, sublime said:

Yeah man this is why in my post after the simplified start up I said I was sorta worried.  When the F14 came out we had already heard jester do stuff and say a ton of stuff.  They couldn't really hide him at all. I didn't even notice the ai in this till someone said he said one line.  Still hoping I was wrong when I urged then to adapt jester and lease him from HB

 

I guess we'll see soon enough. I am really going to hate switching seats, in the Hind. Not only is it immersion breaking, it's a whole lot of extra workload for a single operator, which would make using it in single-player a real pain until they implement proper AI. Hopefully the multicrew part will work out of the box, so I can train with a friend at least. *sigh*

Edited June 1, 2021 by Lurker

[sublime]

4 hours ago, Lurker said:

 

I guess we'll see soon enough. I am really going to hate switching seats, in the Hind. Not only is it immersion breaking, it's a whole lot of extra workload for a single operator, which would make using it in single-player a real pain until they implement proper AI. Hopefully the multicrew part will work out of the box, so I can train with a friend at least. *sigh*

 

I mean I'm still gonna get it I'm too pumped.  But it'll be module breaking for me if they don't get the ai to guide weapons etc.  I won't lie - I agree with what others thought reading between the lines (the explanation IS how ED thinks) and I'm pretty disappointed at the thought that they seemingly are going to have an AI that just auto hovers and flies in a straight line.  In the F14 Iceman can do all that and he's definitely considered the dumbass AI.  The autohover.. I mean they had autopilot auto hovers in other modules - this in practice would be really close.  To me it's like the f14 if jester couldn't use the radar.  It'd be a "wtf' moment. The hinds guided weapons.. are the reason that guy is there.

I'm still really pumped. But I got a gnawing bad feeling

 

[WinterH]

I'm in the polar opposite camp: I believe AI shouldn't be able to guide a missile, or find targets, but can very basically fly the helo so I can do those tasks. Letting AI find targets and guide missiles feels fairly cheaty to me in aircraft like Gazelle and Hind. That's me anyway. Sighting systems in these aircraft are completely manual, arguably apart from Viviane's thermal mode, but even then, they both feature no target lock ability, and no automatic tracking either. Just stabilization. And in case of Hind's Raduga, no rangefinding either. An AI that can spot targets and engage them with a guided missile by itself, takes away characteristic features of these systems, and the challenge/fun in using them IMO.

 

As far as I know, there is an actual hover autopilot mode on the real helo, and as far as we know so far, Petrovich will be able to do these as well. So, I think I'll probably be happy myself :). And AI hovers or flies a straight line is exactly what I wanted all along, even better if I can tell them to slightly ascend/descend, or turn x degrees left/right.

 

I can understand Jester to some degree because of Tomcat's and AWG-9's uber-complexity. But an essentially bot merrily finding and plinking away random targets while I'm flying in a Hind just sounds wrong to me.

[Gierasimov]

15 minutes ago, WinterH said:

I'm in the polar opposite camp: I believe AI shouldn't be able to guide a missile, or find targets, but can very basically fly the helo so I can do those tasks. Letting AI find targets and guide missiles feels fairly cheaty to me in aircraft like Gazelle and Hind. That's me anyway. Sighting systems in these aircraft are completely manual, arguably apart from Viviane's thermal mode, but even then, they both feature no target lock ability, and no automatic tracking either. Just stabilization. And in case of Hind's Raduga, no rangefinding either. An AI that can spot targets and engage them with a guided missile by itself, takes away characteristic features of these systems, and the challenge/fun in using them IMO.

 

As far as I know, there is an actual hover autopilot mode on the real helo, and as far as we know so far, Petrovich will be able to do these as well. So, I think I'll probably be happy myself :). And AI hovers or flies a straight line is exactly what I wanted all along, even better if I can tell them to slightly ascend/descend, or turn x degrees left/right.

 

I can understand Jester to some degree because of Tomcat's and AWG-9's uber-complexity. But an essentially bot merrily finding and plinking away random targets while I'm flying in a Hind just sounds wrong to me.

Pertrovich will not be perfect. He will have hard time spotting outside of perfect visual conditions and will react with a lag as per real life cabin communications challenges and human processing. That was so far chinted in various posts and discussions. 

Otherwise the work on this AI would have been already done, but ED wants to make it really good AI, coz they absolutely need it for Apache as well as the other helo in works. 

[sagent54]

The only problem in that discussion that you didn't mention unpossibleness of switching between seats in multiplayer. Or it will be implemented?

[Lurker]

27 minutes ago, WinterH said:

I'm in the polar opposite camp: I believe AI shouldn't be able to guide a missile, or find targets, but can very basically fly the helo so I can do those tasks. Letting AI find targets and guide missiles feels fairly cheaty to me in aircraft like Gazelle and Hind. That's me anyway. Sighting systems in these aircraft are completely manual, arguably apart from Viviane's thermal mode, but even then, they both feature no target lock ability, and no automatic tracking either. Just stabilization. And in case of Hind's Raduga, no rangefinding either. An AI that can spot targets and engage them with a guided missile by itself, takes away characteristic features of these systems, and the challenge/fun in using them IMO.

 

As far as I know, there is an actual hover autopilot mode on the real helo, and as far as we know so far, Petrovich will be able to do these as well. So, I think I'll probably be happy myself :). And AI hovers or flies a straight line is exactly what I wanted all along, even better if I can tell them to slightly ascend/descend, or turn x degrees left/right.

 

I can understand Jester to some degree because of Tomcat's and AWG-9's uber-complexity. But an essentially bot merrily finding and plinking away random targets while I'm flying in a Hind just sounds wrong to me.

 

There are a whole lot of people (according the Eagle Dynamics a majority of people) who never play multiplayer. I think it would be extremely unfair of Eagle Dynamics (or anyone else for that matter) to scam these people into buying a two-person module, that can't effectively be operated by one person. 

I have no idea why you feel this way, maybe you think that the AI will be able to do this task better than a real person, maybe you are an online-only guy who doesn't want any kind of AI messing up his and his team-mates' experience in the game. In any case, you will be able to disable the AI (or limit it to very basic tasks) on your multiplayer servers, this has already been confirmed by Eagle Dynamics so you don't have to worry. You don't have to play with us "cheaters" if you don't want to. 

Edited June 1, 2021 by Lurker

[WinterH]

Just now, Lurker said:

There are a whole lot of people (according the Eagle Dynamics a majority of people) who never play multiplayer.

And I am one of them. And yet...