reported Did 2.7/ATFLIR break Laser Mavericks?

[Recluse]

Using ATFLIR and LMAVS. There is now a countdown timer for the laser firing.  It seems it times out before the Maverick reaches the target and it falls way short.

 

I have tried it several times.

 

- When IN RANGE cue is achieved (about 10 miles) (2.7_lmav1.trk)

-MIndful of previous reports that the Laser is only good to 8 miles, I waited until range was  8 miles despite the IN RANGE cue being there. (2.7_lmav2.trk)

-Wait a little longer firing at about 7.8 miles. Laser times out while Maverick is still in flight and then the missile falls short. lmav_atflir.trk

 

I realize that the range might actually be shorter, but, in that case there is still a bug with the IN RANGE cue showing up sooner.

 

I tried it with the LItening Pod.  Same laser countdown, but the Litening Pod seems to give the laser more time to fire and I got hits at ~10 miles when IN RANGE cue appeared (lmav_litening2)

 

 

2.7_lmav2 2.7_lmav1 lmav_atflir.trk

lmav_litening2.trk

Edited April 16, 2021 by Recluse
Added LItening TRK

[Hulkbust44]

Using ATFLIR and LMAVS. There is now a countdown timer for the laser firing.  It seems it times out before the Maverick reaches the target and it falls way short.
 
I have tried it several times.
 
- When IN RANGE cue is achieved (about 10 miles) (2.7_lmav1.trk)
-MIndful of previous reports that the Laser is only good to 8 miles, I waited until range was  8 miles despite the IN RANGE cue being there. (2.7_lmav2.trk)
-Wait a little longer firing at about 7.8 miles. Laser times out while Maverick is still in flight and then the missile falls short. lmav_atflir.trk
 
I realize that the range might actually be shorter, but, in that case there is still a bug with the IN RANGE cue showing up sooner.
 
I tried it with the LItening Pod.  Same laser countdown, but the Litening Pod seems to give the laser more time to fire and I got hits at ~10 miles when IN RANGE cue appeared (lmav_litening2)
 
 
2.7_lmav2 2.7_lmav1 lmav_atflir.trk
lmav_litening2.trk

I believe that it's saying you are in range for the maverick presuming you have a target point designation. It would not account for laser range as a lot of the time Mavs aren't self lased. You could probably fire a maverick a high alt from 15 miles, but you would use a JTAC or closer aircraft for the laser.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

I believe that it's saying you are in range for the maverick presuming you have a target point designation. It would not account for laser range as a lot of the time Mavs aren't self lased. You could probably fire a maverick a high alt from 15 miles, but you would use a JTAC or closer aircraft for the laser.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

I've also never heard of mavs autolasing.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

[dorianR666]

i confirm this bug, automatic lasing cuts too soon.

[Recluse]

7 hours ago, Hulkbust44 said:

I believe that it's saying you are in range for the maverick presuming you have a target point designation. It would not account for laser range as a lot of the time Mavs aren't self lased. You could probably fire a maverick a high alt from 15 miles, but you would use a JTAC or closer aircraft for the laser.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

I've also never heard of mavs autolasing.

Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk
 

AGM-65E self lasing from the aircraft has been a feature of the DCS F/A-18 since the introduction of the Targeting pod. At first it required using the TRIG to manually lase. Auto Lasing by using or holding the Pickle button came a bit later. It has worked more or less fine since then and the IN RANGE cue has always been relatively accurate regarding the missile range when the missile is initially cued to the target designation.  AGM-65E generally had better range than the AGM-65F (in DCS anyway) though the laser seemed to be capped at 8 miles. Nonetheless, when the AGM-65E laser seeker goes solid, it means it has  picked up and is tracking the laser spot.

 

What is NEW in 2.7 is the countdown timer.  As shown, it continues to work fine with the older Litening pod, but with ATFLIR, the laser cuts out too soon.

6 hours ago, dorianR666 said:

i confirm this bug, automatic lasing cuts too soon.

 Thanks!!!

Edited April 16, 2021 by Recluse

[Scotflieger]

Same problem with Litening Pod and laser timing out reported by me here. At normal release ranges (10-6NM) the laser timer is set too small (<20s) for missile flight time. However, when closer to target (3-2NM) the timer is much longer (over 100s) when to start lasing late.

[Scotflieger]

Further information. The initial Litening/ATFLIR pod laser time out clock in HUD appears to be triggered by the Laser Arm selection. If armed early in run in the clock starts on arming not on weapon release. If the L ARM is cancelled and reselected the clock is reset and tends to cover the Maverick flight time thus enabling the target to be hit.

[Cobra09]

3 hours ago, Scotflieger said:

Further information. The initial Litening/ATFLIR pod laser time out clock in HUD appears to be triggered by the Laser Arm selection. If armed early in run in the clock starts on arming not on weapon release. If the L ARM is cancelled and reselected the clock is reset and tends to cover the Maverick flight time thus enabling the target to be hit.

If this is a new feature and not a bug, it has not been explained in the Mat Wagner's introduction videos of ATFLIR.

[Scotflieger]

4 minutes ago, Cobra09 said:

If this is a new feature and not a bug, it has not been explained in the Mat Wagner's introduction videos of ATFLIR.

It is a change to the functioning of Litening with AGM-65E as well as the new ATFLIR. It is not affecting other laser guided munitions like GBU-12 as far as I can see.

[Recluse]

5 hours ago, Scotflieger said:

Further information. The initial Litening/ATFLIR pod laser time out clock in HUD appears to be triggered by the Laser Arm selection. If armed early in run in the clock starts on arming not on weapon release. If the L ARM is cancelled and reselected the clock is reset and tends to cover the Maverick flight time thus enabling the target to be hit.

Hmmm.. I haven't seen this. I usually flip the LTD/R switch immediately upon setting the PRF Code and enabling the TPOD.  I haven't noticed the countdown starting until I pickle. I also only seem to see the short laser timeout with  the ATFLIR and the Litening seems to work OK.  Possible there are other variables that affect our respective observations. Either way, I think it is a definite issue with AGM-65E.

 

I think the problem doesn't exist with GBU because the flight time is generally shorter and the Laser doesn't even start firing until the terminal phase, so we might not notice a short laser timeout.

[Cobra09]

8 hours ago, Scotflieger said:

Further information. The initial Litening/ATFLIR pod laser time out clock in HUD appears to be triggered by the Laser Arm selection. If armed early in run in the clock starts on arming not on weapon release. If the L ARM is cancelled and reselected the clock is reset and tends to cover the Maverick flight time thus enabling the target to be hit.

NO WAY, It's a BUG and a big one. I have done many testing, the longer lazing time I have got at 9.9 nm and just enabling LTD/R before firing is 43 seconds, unsuficient to hit the target, the mave falls short. At distances of 8 nm time is 35 secs. at 5-6 about 25 sec. AGM-65E is USELESS.

Edited April 18, 2021 by Cobra09

[konraf]

Hi

 

I've also tested it several times. The bug is both with ATFLIR and "old" TPOD. 

[Papanowel]

I can confirm this too.

[imacken]

Same here.

I have reported the issue of the target diamond disappearing when using the Litening TPOD and there are various other issues relating to Mav E and F that are no longer working correctly.

But this running out of time on the laser fire is certainly a major one.

[BIGNEWY]

reported to the team 

 

thanks