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DCS 2.7 VR performance


Charly314159

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Something in 2.7 has completely killed VR for me. I dropped everything back to the VR default settings, but even in the menu screen I only get around 14fps. In-game it dropped to 8. I need to do some diagnostics to see if something is off.

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DCS 2.7 New Clouds First VR Impressions! Reverb G2 + RTX 3090 - YouTube

 

Go to to 9.25 mins, Side by side of 2.5 vs 2.7.

 

I would suspect (happy to be corrected) this is why some are seeing no performance difference and some of us are. GPU usage in this vid shows higher usage for 2.7. If you have some headway and run ASW (or equivalent) then that higher usage may well be masked by the locked framerates. The GPU is working harder but frame times and on screen performance will look the same. i.e they have still lost performance but it is above the threshold where it is going to dip below 45 locked.

They may have been at an average 60 unlocked but dropped to 50 unlocked, but again as they are using a locked FPS, this performance dip will not be noticed.

 

If like a lot you run unlocked FPS and have tuned settings to this (this is what I have done), then the higher GPU usage is going to see you take a hit in FPS. To me it is a simple as that. (again happy to be corrected)

 

I would guess those seeing stuttering were at the limit of ASW and dropping below due to higher GPU utilization. 

 

So if want to maintain my unlocked 60 FPS average (in Helos my average is lower) , if the GPU utilization is higher then I am going to have lower some settings.

 

If ED is saying there is no performance difference then why is GPU utilisation higher in 2.7 ?? (at least as per this vid)

 

 

 


Edited by Clogger
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more efficient code... makes better use of the GPU? 

 


Edited by speed-of-heat
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SYSTEM SPECS: Hardware Intel Corei7-9700K @ 5.1 GHz, 32Gb RAM, EVGA 3090 XC3, Dell S2716DG, Virpil T50CM3 Throttle, T-50CM2 Base & Constellation Alpha + MFG Crosswinds V2, HP Reverb G2 @ 2836 x 2768
SOFTWARE: Microsoft Windows 11, VoiceAttack & VIACOM PRO, TacView

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15 minutes ago, speed-of-heat said:

more efficient code... makes better use of the GPU? 

 

 

 

Well I am certainty no expert but wouldn't the opposite be true ?? If the code is making better use of available GPU power then wouldn't the GPU be working less rather than harder trying to maintain the same scene ?? 

As per the above vid the GPU is working harder and performance headroom is being removed, if a user is already at the point of little or no headroom then surely a harder working GPU is going to see in game performance take a nose dive, unless you relieve that strain by lowering settings ??  (happy to be educated here)


Edited by Clogger
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no. 

 

expansion - the intent is to use as much of the engine as possible, which means making fuller use of the GPU is preferable, providing your frame times remain inside the requirement its a tough no simple non linear  balance 


Edited by speed-of-heat
expansion
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SYSTEM SPECS: Hardware Intel Corei7-9700K @ 5.1 GHz, 32Gb RAM, EVGA 3090 XC3, Dell S2716DG, Virpil T50CM3 Throttle, T-50CM2 Base & Constellation Alpha + MFG Crosswinds V2, HP Reverb G2 @ 2836 x 2768
SOFTWARE: Microsoft Windows 11, VoiceAttack & VIACOM PRO, TacView

VR Stuff:   My Settings for 3090 and G2  My Settings for 1080ti  Shaders MOD for VR  My variant of Kegetys mod with clear water and also IC PASS for current beta & stable, Patch Status

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I see no drop in performance drop with the 2.7 open beta release. I expected to lose something with clouds, but no, it's working great. And that's with a Nvidia 1070. Great work ED! 🙂

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I noticed circa 20% performance drop down on FPS so with all these new features ... I am satisfied 👌👌👌

Steel Hotas Warthog + Hoffmans F16 rudders, Oculus Rift S, EVGA RTX2080, Core i7 4790K

Hangar: Ka50, A10C, A10A, A10CII, SU27, SU33, SU25, Av8BNA, Bf109K4, F16C, F86, FA18C, FW190D9, I-16, L39C, Mi8, Mig15, Mig19P, Mig21, P51D, Spitfire, SuperCarrier, Yak52, P47, F14, Mi24P, Me262?

Flying over CAU, NEV, NORM, SYR, CHNL and PER

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I am bit baffled, I have quite "OK" machine but flying over the cities just kills the frametime totally. I am using always on motionvector, so steady 45 fps when flying in the clouds but any get close to any major city and its death. Huge difference to 2.5.6 where the latest patch allowed more or less steady 45fps over pretty much anything.

Any good tips for drivers? Latest and the 461.72, I can see no difference between 'em.

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5 minutes ago, Anteuz said:

I am bit baffled, I have quite "OK" machine but flying over the cities just kills the frametime totally. I am using always on motionvector, so steady 45 fps when flying in the clouds but any get close to any major city and its death. Huge difference to 2.5.6 where the latest patch allowed more or less steady 45fps over pretty much anything.

Any good tips for drivers? Latest and the 461.72, I can see no difference between 'em.

Yeah, cities are a killer for me too. Mostly smooth everywhere else. And I have a 3080.

Modules: Wright Flyer, Spruce Goose, Voyager 1

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cities on which map? the channel yes definitely others, there is a small hit but not much 

 

SYSTEM SPECS: Hardware Intel Corei7-9700K @ 5.1 GHz, 32Gb RAM, EVGA 3090 XC3, Dell S2716DG, Virpil T50CM3 Throttle, T-50CM2 Base & Constellation Alpha + MFG Crosswinds V2, HP Reverb G2 @ 2836 x 2768
SOFTWARE: Microsoft Windows 11, VoiceAttack & VIACOM PRO, TacView

VR Stuff:   My Settings for 3090 and G2  My Settings for 1080ti  Shaders MOD for VR  My variant of Kegetys mod with clear water and also IC PASS for current beta & stable, Patch Status

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13 minutes ago, speed-of-heat said:

cities on which map? the channel yes definitely others, there is a small hit but not much 

 

Yes, the Channel map and Syria. Stuttery when I look down at them.

Modules: Wright Flyer, Spruce Goose, Voyager 1

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Syria, Persian Gulf.. 

But I think I got it now, had left HAGS on for god knows why, disabled that and seems to be somewhat more stable.
Quite stable 45, though, this is offline and just free-flight without AI units. I mean, could just chase the clouds for the whole day, it looks epic. Once ED gets VR optimizations done... 
 

 

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channel's  perf is still a bit a pf a sorry state, i havent done much in syria yet ... i will give it a go later and rpeort back , but certainly on the FA/18 Freeflight IA mission it was OK

 

4 minutes ago, Anteuz said:

Syria, Persian Gulf.. 

But I think I got it now, had left HAGS on for god knows why, disabled that and seems to be somewhat more stable.
Quite stable 45, though, this is offline and just free-flight without AI units. I mean, could just chase the clouds for the whole day, it looks epic. Once ED gets VR optimizations done... 
 

 

yeah hags will screw you up...

SYSTEM SPECS: Hardware Intel Corei7-9700K @ 5.1 GHz, 32Gb RAM, EVGA 3090 XC3, Dell S2716DG, Virpil T50CM3 Throttle, T-50CM2 Base & Constellation Alpha + MFG Crosswinds V2, HP Reverb G2 @ 2836 x 2768
SOFTWARE: Microsoft Windows 11, VoiceAttack & VIACOM PRO, TacView

VR Stuff:   My Settings for 3090 and G2  My Settings for 1080ti  Shaders MOD for VR  My variant of Kegetys mod with clear water and also IC PASS for current beta & stable, Patch Status

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On 4/15/2021 at 3:07 AM, overkillke2 said:

My fps are relatively stable but I have a lot of stuttering when I'm above the clouds. I also have an image shake effect when I look at the clouds on the horizon

9700, 2080S, SSD, 16Gb RAM, HP G1.  I notice in all maps that as soon as I am below 12,000 ish feet I get frame drops to the 30s and more stuttering.  With the same settings in 2.5 I did not have this happen.  In a very dense location of course it is expected to get some FPS loss.  I do notice that I can turn shadows to high with better multiplayer experiences overall. 

 

Current state settings:

Left side

Textures. High

Gnd textures. Low

Water. High

Vis RNG. Low

Shadows. High (previous. OFF)

Heat blur. Off

MSAA. 2x

All else in this column off or low.

 

Right side.

Mid range slider for all.

Ground shadows. Off

GC illumination. Off

 

PD. 1.0

Tac view. Disable recording

MFD and Canopy reflections. Static

Mirrors, Pilot and stick. Hidden

 

In heavy missions below 12k it's stuttering and near 30 FPS.  Above 12k its great.  Shadows set to off make it normal again but I can play now with shadows on high with better results.

 

Overall I would say the game performs better, but once below 12k feet something noticeably falls apart.  The 2 new sliders for forest density and scenery detail seem to have little effect on FPS, but to seem to limit scenery building population.  Maybe this needs to be set to 0.0 or .1 for a better effect.  Seems like vis range of low is about the same draw distance that 12k feet might cause scenery population resulting in lower FPS and stuttering.?  


Edited by timothyboss
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3 hours ago, unlikely_spider said:

Yes, the Channel map and Syria. Stuttery when I look down at them.

Same.  No matter what settings I play with.  Even all on low or off.  Syria is just a very busy map and a great one to benchmark new settings.

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So,
Definitely worse performance for me in 2.7.

FPs-wise maybe 10-15 less.
But there’s a whole lot of stutter that doesn’t seem to be reflected in FPS-loss.

With reprojection it mostly stays above 45 (jitters alot between 43-55-ish) but still lots of stutters... when looking up it locks att 45 as expected.
But in 2.6 it locks at 90. So a clear difference.

Sorry for my ignorance, but is it possible to have acceptable FPS but lots of stutters?

Reverb G1
I7 9700 5,0
32 gb ram
Rtx 2080 Super
SSD

Don’t think my settings are ’too high’...

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*** reposting this in the proper thread...

 

I will say - as far as 2.7 goes on my system ( ASUS Hero XI Wi-Fi MB, i9900K OC’d 5GHz, ASUS Tuf 3090 OC, Reverb G2) - I have noticed that densely populated areas on many maps (e.g. Beirut, Damascus, areas around Ramat David on the Syria map for instance) now absolutely choke/bottleneck the 3090 whereas same settings/drivers with 2.5.6 I could pretty comfortably maintain 90fps w/o needing to run motion smoothing.   Now, in 2.7 I 100% need to run motion smoothing in order to negate stutters... despite the claim in the patch notes about perf improvements on Syria I’m definitely seeing the opposite... bumping the new scenery details and forest details sliders down to 0.1 don’t appear to alleviate the issues so I’m wondering if they wholesale increased the density of objects or something?  I’ve lost just enough GPU headroom to cover those densely populated areas.  Kind of a bummer because I was running pretty lean settings in 2.5.6 in order to run motion smoothing off (no shadows, no illumination, no lens flare/blur,  no traffic, no ground clutter, medium distance, etc. just 2x MSAA, 50% SS, 1.0 PD, w/ Kegetys VR shaders) not really too much else I could dial down.... the good news is I think since I stopped using Steam Motion smoothing in the past they’ve definitely improved the algorithm quality... it’s much better in my limited experience so far than a year+ ago I think (less really bothersome artifacts). 
 

ive also noticed (again flying around places like Beirut, and this free flight with no other vehicles on the map, etc) that the CPU core DCS is running on is almost completely pegged the whole time... don’t think I noticed that before on 2.5.6.  Clouds on or off don’t seem to make a difference so I guess kudos to ED for that but unfortunately my experience is that 2.7 doesn’t perform “better” than before in VR. Enabling ReBAR didn’t net any noticeable improvements so maybe a clean/reinstall is next...   The never ending tweaking continues....

i9-9900K @ 5.0GHz, ASUS ROG Z390 MAXIMUS XI HERO, ASUS GeForce RTX 2080Ti 11GB, 32GB DDR4 @ 3866MHZ, 1TB Intel 660P M.2 NVMe SSD, 1TB WD Black SN750 NVMe SSD, Oculus Rift S

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Hi, getting a large drop in frames.

was 45fps steady before, now 35 fps with artefact's on edges of plane wings and drops down to 20 fps in places.

Seems to be bad every where.

Clouds always look blurry (known issue) but they don't jitter too much if left on "standard".

MSAA seems to work much better to eliminate jaggies though.

 

10900k,

3090,

32bg ram @ 3600.

Reverb G2.

dcs.log

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Imagine having a 3090 and writing about how you had it good with no shadows, no illumination, no lens flare/blur,  no traffic, no ground clutter, medium distance, etc. just 2x MSAA, 50% SS, 1.0 PD, w/ Kegetys VR shaders

 

 

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So, I lowered the refresh rate fr 90 to 60 on my reverb G1.

I find it introduces some discrete periferal flickering, which is irritating at first but I find you get used to it. And I definitely prefer that flickering instead of stuttering.

And there’s suddenly a lot of head room to turn things up:) Raised SS in Steam VR from 100-140, turned on shadows (low settings though).

I can even fly a furball instant action mission over the cities in on the channels map with almost zero stutters. Looks great!
On this map the details level slider has a huge impact, and its possible to tune while in a mission to se exactly what happens.

So - this will be my solution until 2.7 runs better.

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Hello, since the update to 2.7 everything that is outside the cockpit is no longer sharp. The clouds also look very blurry ...... but at least they are now rendered for both eyes. 
HMD: Pimax 8kx
Best regards

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5 hours ago, Thundercat710 said:

Imagine having a 3090 and writing about how you had it good with no shadows, no illumination, no lens flare/blur,  no traffic, no ground clutter, medium distance, etc. just 2x MSAA, 50% SS, 1.0 PD, w/ Kegetys VR shaders

 

 

My settings are hilariously bad for a 10900k and a 3090.

I get better gameplay on every other vr game I play. 

I hear the clouds are even a server side thing, surely that'd take some load off of our own systems. 

I can run vr driving sims with like 300%ss and maxed out settings. 

DCS is literally perfect for vr as a lot of air forces are using it to train pilots but it's hideous. 

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21 hours ago, Twwhitey said:

*** reposting this in the proper thread...

 

I will say - as far as 2.7 goes on my system ( ASUS Hero XI Wi-Fi MB, i9900K OC’d 5GHz, ASUS Tuf 3090 OC, Reverb G2) - I have noticed that densely populated areas on many maps (e.g. Beirut, Damascus, areas around Ramat David on the Syria map for instance) now absolutely choke/bottleneck the 3090 whereas same settings/drivers with 2.5.6 I could pretty comfortably maintain 90fps w/o needing to run motion smoothing.   Now, in 2.7 I 100% need to run motion smoothing in order to negate stutters... despite the claim in the patch notes about perf improvements on Syria I’m definitely seeing the opposite... bumping the new scenery details and forest details sliders down to 0.1 don’t appear to alleviate the issues so I’m wondering if they wholesale increased the density of objects or something?  I’ve lost just enough GPU headroom to cover those densely populated areas.  Kind of a bummer because I was running pretty lean settings in 2.5.6 in order to run motion smoothing off (no shadows, no illumination, no lens flare/blur,  no traffic, no ground clutter, medium distance, etc. just 2x MSAA, 50% SS, 1.0 PD, w/ Kegetys VR shaders) not really too much else I could dial down.... the good news is I think since I stopped using Steam Motion smoothing in the past they’ve definitely improved the algorithm quality... it’s much better in my limited experience so far than a year+ ago I think (less really bothersome artifacts). 
 

ive also noticed (again flying around places like Beirut, and this free flight with no other vehicles on the map, etc) that the CPU core DCS is running on is almost completely pegged the whole time... don’t think I noticed that before on 2.5.6.  Clouds on or off don’t seem to make a difference so I guess kudos to ED for that but unfortunately my experience is that 2.7 doesn’t perform “better” than before in VR. Enabling ReBAR didn’t net any noticeable improvements so maybe a clean/reinstall is next...   The never ending tweaking continues....

That's weird that turning clouds on/off does not make difference for you in VR ? Are you sure about this ? 
My system is very similar but for me clouds on/off makes all the difference. If i turn the clouds to "nothing" i have exactly same performance as pre-2.7 
So i don't think it's the update itself but or me it's definitely specifically the clouds themselves :  
But ED is working on it i hear, let's just hope there is something horribly wrong for VR at the moment and that it will soon be fixed along with the server issues. 

image.png


Edited by Csgo GE oh yeah
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2 hours ago, Csgo GE oh yeah said:

That's weird that turning clouds on/off does not make difference for you in VR ? Are you sure about this ? 
My system is very similar but for me clouds on/off makes all the difference. If i turn the clouds to "nothing" i have exactly same performance as pre-2.7 
So i don't think it's the update itself but or me it's definitely specifically the clouds themselves :  
But ED is working on it i hear, let's just hope there is something horribly wrong for VR at the moment and that it will soon be fixed along with the server issues. 

image.png

 

Yeah funny you mention that.. I just got finished watching a few YouTube’s (Redkites being one) detailing pretty profound side-by-side FPS differences between clouds = none and clouds =  low, high, ultra.  I was under the impression that most players were NOT seeing perf impacts... apparently not the case.  I’m going to go back and retry today.  I tend to use the Instant Action missions as my benchmark missions so I have to dig those out and update the cloud settings.

 

I will say shortly before giving up yesterday I seemed to notice that on the same map some location (instant action Persian Gulf, Abu Dhabi) the perf differences between the Viper and F/A-18 was pretty profound.  The Viper being way worse IMO...

 

will play around more today....

 

*** Update ***

 

You are correct..... I disabled clouds in my benchmarking missions (set Clouds preset to "Nothing") and it made a world of difference in frametimes and FPS.. so yeah... no free lunch with the new clouds.  😕


Edited by Twwhitey

i9-9900K @ 5.0GHz, ASUS ROG Z390 MAXIMUS XI HERO, ASUS GeForce RTX 2080Ti 11GB, 32GB DDR4 @ 3866MHZ, 1TB Intel 660P M.2 NVMe SSD, 1TB WD Black SN750 NVMe SSD, Oculus Rift S

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