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Hi all

I'm new to the DCS-World and want to give a helicopter-module a try.

I'm kinda sorting out what type of plane I want to full dive in first in DCS. I own FC3 and the FW-190 D9 as of right now. So I took babysteps in the Su-25 T and the Dora nine. I kind of liked both even when the FW-190 is quite difficult to handle for me. It took me numerous attempts to my first successful take-off and didn't manage to survive a landing yet. 😉

Now I want to see how a helicopter feels like in DCS.

I narrowed it down to the Ka-50 or the Mi-8.
What would you reccomend and why? 

Initially I  would have chosen the Gazelle but then I read that something is wrong with the FM of it.

Thanks for your reccomendations in advance!

greetings
Loopan


Edited by Loopan
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Ka50 is easier and more deadly.
Mi8 is much harder and more useful.
 

With a Ka50 you can dismantle an enemy base from the comfort of your seat miles away.

After the Ka50's dismantled the base, an Mi8 can rebuild it.

You cant do it the other way around (I mean its possible- but youll have a tough time).

I have both, I love both.

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As StevanJ pointed out the two helicopters differ significantly in their roles. So if you enjoy guided missiles cracking tanks, state of the art systems and getting into the thick of the fight, the Ka-50 is your bet. If you enjoy hauling cargo or passengers and getting into hair-raising fights with comparably easy enemies, the Mi-8 is the ticket.

I'd also like to point out that between these two the style of flying them is very, very different indeed. The Mi-8 flies like a helicopter with all the little troubles that come from it. The Ka-50 on the other hand is highly automated and between the trim system and the coax rotors you have to worry less about helicopter dynamics and more about operating these systems correctly.

 

Not in the running but honorary mention: the Huey is - in role - comparable to the Mi-8, but being much smaller and nimbler it is much easier to learn, although the principles of operation are the same.

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The Ka-50 with its coaxial rotor system is quiete unique. As StevanJ said, it is "easier" because it is relatively stable when compared to single rotor helicopters as the Mi-8. You will learn much faster how to hover in a Ka-50 than in any other DCS helicopter since there is basically one axis less (yaw) you need to care about.

 

So for a beginner, it might be the right module. Just make sure that you watch some tutorials about the auto pilot before you start flying. Otherwise, you will always fight it and wonder why your helicopter keeps turning "randomly".

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If you want to learn choppers, go with the Mi-8. Shes quite some challenge to learn, raw, stubborn, but also very rewarding and a joy to fly. Guess when you learned to tame the Hip, you're good with flying any other chopper. The Hip also shares a lot with the upcoming Hind i terms of avionics and flight characteristics, so transitioning will be way easier having experience in the Hip.

 

The Ka-50 behaves quite different to all the other choppers and i personally don't like or recommend it at all.

The avionics in the Black Shark are a mess. You've got the ABRIS (moving map with search function, waypoint display, datalink and more) but for some reason the engineers thought it would be a stupid idea to couple it with the navigation system. So both are independent systems and changes to the waypoints on the ABRIS need to be manually typed in the nav computer too. Same for when you manually switch from WP 3 to 4 in the nav system, you've got to change it on the ABRIS manually or both are desynced.

With the flight director channels, you hold the damn trim button each time you change heading, bank angle, pitch... WHEN i fly the Ka-50, i simply deactivate them all and fly raw.

Overall to me, the Ka-50 feels like a prototype that wasn't well thought through. Having the countermeasures panel on the upper right is another prime example someone didn't have his head on a swivel when planning that chopper and it feels like that in general. To activate flare ejection, the pilot would (while trying to evade a missle!) have to either take his hand from the stick or reach with his left hand over to the upper right, blocking vision with his arm in front of his head. A lot of things i this bird just make no sense. I think its a mess engineering wise and i have not much joy flying it. Its "capable" in terms of weaponry and sensors but that's it really.

 

So, like said, if you are really interested in learning a chopper, go with the Hip. Super nice tutorials by vsTerminus, that also give a good overview of how the Hip is:

 

 

Edit: yeah, the FM of the Gazelle is pretty messy. Polychop is working on the OH-58 Kiowa right now and promised to overhaul the Gazelles' FM (once the Kiowa is out) with the experience they gathered doing the Kiowa. Hope this happens since the Gazelle really is a cool whirlybird.

There is also RAZBAM working on the Bo-105PAH1 currently and from how it sounds, it could be released in 2021 too (not sure if EA or full release).

Mi-24 Hind is coming somewhere Q2 this year planned but i don't think early access modules are good for starters since they, due to their nature, are relatively buggy, have ever incomplete manuals, things are constantly in the works and change a lot... nothing a starter would have fun with i think since it makes learning way harder.


Edited by Desert Fox
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If you want to “feel” how a helicopter flies then I would recommend the Mi-8 or Huey. The Ka-50 doesn’t have the same “feel” due to it’s highly augmented flight systems. I am pleased I came to the Ka-50 last in my list of helicopters because the others gave me a better experience of what a more “normal” helicopter feels like to fly. It also helped me appreciate what the flight assists in the Ka-50 are actually doing.

 

As other say if you prefer to blow lots of stuff up the the Ka-50 is the obvious choice.

 

I own and enjoy them all so don’t worry - you will be happy whatever you choose.

 

 

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vor 9 Minuten schrieb Loopan:

Thank you all so much for your help and recommendations!

I considered all you were saying very carefully and.....

 

 



bought both 😉

i know that feeling, startet with the A 10  a long time ago, then the KA 50. Back in the days where DCS World didnt exist 🙂

Now i have every Helo, most of the Warbirds and a big lot of Jets.......

Once you start to fall in love with DCS it never will let you go 🙂

 

So will not be disapiontet, i like to fly all Helos. Everyone is differnt and has it plus an minus points 🙂

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16 minutes ago, Loopan said:

bought both 😉

 

Well played, Sir. Well played 😄

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Hardware: MSI B450 Gaming Plus MAX | Ryzen 5 3600X (6*3.8 Ghz) | 32 GB RAM | MSI Radeon RX5700 | Samsung SSD 860 QVO 1TB | DCS dedicated @ WD Blue 500 GB SSD | Win 10 (64-bit) | TM Warthog HOTAS, MFD and rudder pedals, TrackIR5

 

Wishlist:  Northern Germany/Baltic Sea theater | Full Fidelity Su-25A | Asset packs (80s Iran, Lebanon 1982, Syria 2011+ factions)

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4 ore fa, Desert Fox ha scritto:

 

 

The Ka-50 behaves quite different to all the other choppers and i personally don't like or recommend it at all.

The avionics in the Black Shark are a mess. You've got the ABRIS (moving map with search function, waypoint display, datalink and more) but for some reason the engineers thought it would be a stupid idea to couple it with the navigation system. So both are independent systems and changes to the waypoints on the ABRIS need to be manually typed in the nav computer too. Same for when you manually switch from WP 3 to 4 in the nav system, you've got to change it on the ABRIS manually or both are desynced.

With the flight director channels, you hold the damn trim button each time you change heading, bank angle, pitch... WHEN i fly the Ka-50, i simply deactivate them all and fly raw.

Overall to me, the Ka-50 feels like a prototype that wasn't well thought through. Having the countermeasures panel on the upper right is another prime example someone didn't have his head on a swivel when planning that chopper and it feels like that in general. To activate flare ejection, the pilot would (while trying to evade a missle!) have to either take his hand from the stick or reach with his left hand over to the upper right, blocking vision with his arm in front of his head. A lot of things i this bird just make no sense. I think its a mess engineering wise and i have not much joy flying it. Its "capable" in terms of weaponry and sensors but that's it really

 

 

That's a really wrong way to use the ka-50. If you learn to use it as intended, the logic of the trim and the autopilot makes sense and makes it a lot easier to fly than a traditional helicopter. For what the countermeasures is concerned, the simulator is easier than real life since you can use voiceattack and set voice commands to operate the panel. That said, I have both ka-50 and mi-8 and I enjoy both.


Edited by nessuno0505
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Should have just got the huey and had fun with the steerable miniguns and approximately 17,000 rounds of 7.62 diplomacy


Edited by Hammer1-1

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vor 5 Stunden schrieb Hammer1-1:

Should have just got the huey and had fun with the steerable miniguns and approximately 17,000 rounds of 7.62 diplomacy

 

I guess we all know, that in the end I'll own all the helos (meaning in about 2-3 months) ;)

vor 22 Minuten schrieb BranchPrediction:

.....

Dont forget that ED does a lot sales, ussually a 50% sale on helis!

Yes, I was hoping, there will be an easter sale but it seems that wont be the case.
My problem is, that patience isn't my strong suit so it could well be, that I'll buy the most content before the next sale ;-o

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On 4/3/2021 at 8:11 PM, Desert Fox said:

With the flight director channels, you hold the damn trim button each time you change heading, bank angle, pitch... WHEN i fly the Ka-50, i simply deactivate them all and fly raw.

Well, if you don't like the full autopilot style, you can use the button to the right of autopilot channel selection which moves it to the director/dampener mode. Then you can pilot the robocopter as you would with a usual coaxial rotor helicopter, but with all the benefits of assisted piloting. 

They are not vulching... they are STRAFING!!! :smartass::thumbup:

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1 hour ago, Черный Дракул said:

Well, if you don't like the full autopilot style, you can use the button to the right of autopilot channel selection which moves it to the director/dampener mode. Then you can pilot the robocopter as you would with a usual coaxial rotor helicopter, but with all the benefits of assisted piloting. 

the flight director button?

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