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Would you pay for an additional Version Pack for a module?


Mig Fulcrum
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Would you pay for an addictional Version Pack for a module?  

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  1. 1. Would you pay for an addictional Version Pack for a module?

    • Yes, I think the work deserves a price equal the module
      15
    • Yes, but I think half the price of the module is enough
      29
    • No, I think this should be free with the module itself
      8
    • No because it's a silly idea
      5


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I found a very nice trend in the latest DCS modules: not only introducing a single aircraft but a whole selection of variants, i’m thinking of:

Heatblur F-14

-        F-14A-95-GR

-        F-14A-135-GR Early

-        F-14A-135-GR Late

-        F-14B

Aerges Mirage F-1

-        F-1 BE

-        F-1 CE

-        F-1 EE

-        F-1 M

Aviodev C-101

-        C-101 EB

-        C-101CC

ED warbirds

-        P-51D-25-NA

-        P-51D-30-NA

-        P-47D-30

-        P-47D-30 Early

-        P-47D-40

-        Spitfire Mk.IX

-        Spitfire Mk.IX CW

-        (if i’m not mistaken FW-190F-8 is planned with A-8)

With this idea in mind I was wondering if the community would appreciate the idea of expanding DCS big modules to the whole aircraft experience other than the single plane/heli to have a wider timespan to recreate mission or scenarios in the game.

I understand that ED cannot work for free so i’m thinking about a, for example, DCS F/A-18 Version Pack that can be bought AFTER or WITH (not standalone) DCS F/A-18C module which includes:

-        F/A-18C 90s:

-        -  Basically a downgraded version of the current one, without AIM-9X, JHMCS, ATFLIR, LITENING, SLAM-ER and other post 2000 wapons

-        -  Introduction of AN/AAS-38 Nite Hawk pod and ASQ-173 pod

-        -  Pilot model equipped with HGU-55 helmet and MBU-14 mask

-        F/A-18D:

-        -  Two seat variant fully combat capable and with a 6% reduction in internal fuel

-        -  With multicrew

-        F/A-18A:

-        -  Pre 1987 variant without AMRAAM, Maverick, JDAM, JSOW

-        -  F404-GE-400 instead of F404-GE-402 (71.17kN, not 78.83 kN)

-        -  AN/APG-65 radar instead of AN/APG-73

-        -  80s pilot model with HGU-33 helmet and MBU-14 mask (Heatblur Pilot)

In the same way F-16 and A-10 modules can benefit of this idea as well, for example:

-        F-16C Block 40 (GE F110-GE-100 engine)

-        F-16A Block 15 ADF, Sparrow capable and equipped with PW F100-PW-200 engine

-        F-16D Block 50, two-seat varian of the current in-game version

-        A-10C (basically the old Warthog module with some visual upgrade)

-        A-10A with a clickable cockpit

 

I know this is a pretty big thing and some flight models should be reveisit so take this poll as an market survey.

I would be 100% happy to pay another 80$ for this, just want to know what do you guys think.

 

Edit: sorry for the typo in the title, i'm not an english native speaker. 


Edited by Mig Fulcrum
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The price should depend on how much content it actually adds. If it's something like F-16A or F/A-18A "cold war expansion", or a modernized F-14B/F-14D it would be way more than a half, with how big the difference in systems is it would almost have to be made from scratch. The planned RN Harriers from RAZBAM would probably fall into this category too, it would be less of an expansion and more of a separate module, with optional discount for owners of the original. Conversely something like a Mi-24V on top of P where the only big difference is the turret in place of fixed gun, it would probably be worth much less than half the price of the original module. Same with e.g. different export variants of F-16C Block 50/52. The only time it could be full price however IMO is if the variant is made by a different dev that has no access to original tech and assets, having to redo everything from scratch, or if the differences between the airframes go so far that despite being categorised as variants of the same aircraft they barely have anything in common.


Edited by m4ti140
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M4ti pretty much nailed it. Developing another version definitely deserves a pay, since it's not just about adding or removing something but it's also an additional product that needs to be maintained with bugfixes etc. The price should reflect the amount of additional work needed, some might justify a full price, some half price, i could even imagine something like a micro-payment (5-10 bucks) for variants that are just too much work to be free but enough work to justify a payment.

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Surely, once you have paid circa $80 for a module of which may be just one variant, paying the same again for what could be a minimum change - let’s say systems - would be a bit silly?
Wouldn’t it be better for the amount charged to be reflected in just how much of a “sex change” has taken place? Otherwise you are paying the maximum for what would in effect be a small change.

Take the discussions on the F-4, if you started out with an initial module of an F-4C for instance, then it’s only really systems differences and minor model changes up until you get to the long noses, or the British Phantoms, which would require a more in depth model change as well as system differences. 
Then the amount charged over and above the initial model would be greater for a maximum change (F-4E, F, G, K (FG1), M (FGR2)) versus a minimum change like the B, D, N, J & S.

Or would paying $80 for each variant be more appealing? $800 for the variants I have listed not including the initial model, or something around $25 for subsequent variants which means the variants cost $250 on top of the initial model, should you wish to own all?

 

Havent answered your poll as it needs a selection to reflect “would you pay an amount depending on change” for another variant to be added.


Edited by G.J.S
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  • Mig Fulcrum changed the title to Would you pay for an additional Version Pack for a module?

I was mainly talking about the Hornet so my reasoning and priceing applies to it. F-16, A-10, F-4, F-5 ecc... are the same idea but i don't know enough about the single variants to be accurate, i simply want to know if you like the idea.

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M4ti140's idea is pretty much the same as mine and it was also the general consensus when a similar thread was discussed not that long ago pertaining to F-4 Phantom variants. 

I suggest you read through it to get a better understanding. https://forums.eagle.ru/topic/263742-would-you-be-willing-to-buy-multiple-f-4-modules/

I also did not vote because the options did not include this option.


Edited by Evoman
rewording better
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I voted the 2nd option, but I’d actually prefer to spend $$$ on totally new aircraft, rather than just a new version. The only aircraft I would consider purchasing a variant, is the Viggen .. I’d love to have the JA37 interceptor. 😇

 

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17 minutes ago, musolo said:

i`d pay for Flanker or Fulcrum multirole variants

How much? Full price for each?

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And then there is the subscription model - any fixed wing plane (perhaps per era: warbirds, cold war, modern) for a regular fee, same with helos, and mapsI'd be willing to pay 100/year for all modern aircraft, another 100 for all modern helos, and a final 50 for access to all maps and special modules (Supercarrier, CA). Steady income stream, more incentive to maintain existing models.

 

 

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5 minutes ago, cfrag said:

And then there is the subscription model ....

 

No thanks .. I'd rather pay once for an aircraft and then fly it for as long as I want.  If I lose my job, I can still play while searching for another job .. on a subscription you lose access to all if you stop paying the installments.

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1 hour ago, cfrag said:

And then there is the subscription model - any fixed wing plane (perhaps per era: warbirds, cold war, modern) for a regular fee, same with helos, and mapsI'd be willing to pay 100/year for all modern aircraft, another 100 for all modern helos, and a final 50 for access to all maps and special modules (Supercarrier, CA). Steady income stream, more incentive to maintain existing models.

 

With respect that's a horrible idea. Pay once and a module is essentially free to use forever. Games-as-a-service is a terrible idea that needs to die. Yes, subscriptions would provide a steady source of income for a dev team but if anything happened to that dev team then every player would potentially instantly lose access to everything they "own" which I think is unacceptable for a game than can 100% be played in single player. The subscription model can work for 100% on-line only games such as iRacing but for anything that has an SP component, no.

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I voted for the 2nd option, but my real answer is that it would depend on the work involved. m4ti140, Desert Fox and G.J.S have all essentially nailed here and I'm in perfect agreement.

 

I think when it comes to variants, if they were to be paid ideally you'd have your first variant be full price and then subsequent variants be discounted based on the amount of work required.

 

For instance I'd happily pay for a Mi-24V circa 70s/80s (which is basically identical to the current P, with a different pilot-gunner cockpit and YakB turret instead of the fixed GSh-30-2K). Here the difference isn't that much, so I'd expect to pay around 10-15USD for it, provided I own the P (which I do).

 

For aircraft like the F-16A Block 15 circa 80s, I'd expect to pay a lot more for it, as that aircraft would almost mandate starting all over again as we're basically unable to recycle anything. Something more along the lines of ~50 USD.

 

On 3/26/2021 at 11:32 PM, cfrag said:

And then there is the subscription model - any fixed wing plane (perhaps per era: warbirds, cold war, modern) for a regular fee, same with helos, and mapsI'd be willing to pay 100/year for all modern aircraft, another 100 for all modern helos, and a final 50 for access to all maps and special modules (Supercarrier, CA). Steady income stream, more incentive to maintain existing models.

 

Yeah, no thanks. No way, absolutely out of the question, Jose. Fully with DarkFire here.


Edited by Northstar98
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Modules I own: F-14A/B, Mi-24P, AJS 37, F-5E-3, MiG-21bis, F-16CM, F/A-18C, Supercarrier, Mi-8MTV-2, UH-1H, Mirage 2000C, FC3, MiG-15bis, Ka-50, A-10C (+ A-10C II), P-47D, P-51D, C-101, Yak-52, CA, NS430, Hawk

Terrains I own: Syria, The Channel, SoH/PG, Marianas

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12 hours ago, G.J.S said:

How much? Full price for each?

By full price i mean price of the nonclickable FC3 module be it noncklickable? coz i it won`t be anything more detailed than it is wright now. I mean be it multirole) And infact  we won`t have even that. Ever.

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Edited by musolo

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1 hour ago, Northstar98 said:

I voted for the 2nd option, but my real answer is that it would depend on the work involved.

 

 

m4ti140, Desert Fox and G.J.S have all essentially nailed here and I'm in perfect agreement.

 

 

Yeah, no thanks. No way, absolutely out of the question, Jose. Fully with DarkFire here.

 

My mistake - my apologies for not being clear. Most importantly, I'm looking at subscription in addition to - not as a replacement for - the current system. This means that there are different kind of subscriptions to explore:

  • No subscription: purchase models and updates (as today, e.g. Tank Killer)
  • subscribed access to models. Access all subscribed models while subscribed. Subscription lapses -> model is no longer available to fly or access (maps)
  • subscribed updates - requires fully owning a model/map first. Your models/maps update for free while subscribed and you "own" the update even after the subscription lapses. 

In other words: there are different kinds of subscriptions, and if none is attractive to you, you can still purchase your models like you do today. 

 

Also, it would of course only cover ED modules and maps (unless ED works out deals with their partners). It supplements the 'paid update' model (which I support) for those of us who are highly invested into DCS. I want DCS to be more flexible and to attract different players - those who are scared off by high module cost, those who don't know what plane to invest into, and those who own a veritable stable of models and need to be kept engaged. I currently own 22 modules plus all maps; initially subscription may not be something for me. But 22 paid upgrades on a regular schedule may shift many of us to that model of having a subscription of updates. I'm not entirely convinced that this could work, but I think the current rigid payment structure should be enhanced to attract more people to DCS. Subscriptions certainly don't sound attractive, I know, but they are a useful refinancing tool for many developers that can provide added security.

 

 

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Yes its a good idea.

 

However, the devil is in the detail both in terms of variation and pricing.

 

IMHO there would need to be a sufficient degree of differences between variants for it to be interesting - either technical ones or at least in terms of timeframe(for mission potential).....preferably both.

 

As for pricing, I agree  with M4ti that it should depend on the work involved.

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I didn't vote because: It depends on the module, and the version of the upgrade. 

 

I hate these kinds of polls. No disrespect to the author intended, but why post a poll if you won't include all the possible answers for it? 


Edited by Lurker

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6 hours ago, Lurker said:

I didn't vote because: It depends on the module, and the version of the upgrade. 

 

I hate these kinds of polls. No disrespect to the author intended, but why post a poll if you won't include all the possible answers for it? 

 

I think if there is any aircraft you would buy two versions of the answer would be yes.

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19 hours ago, upyr1 said:

I think if there is any aircraft you would buy two versions of the answer would be yes.

 

Exactly.

Modules I own: F-14A/B, Mi-24P, AJS 37, F-5E-3, MiG-21bis, F-16CM, F/A-18C, Supercarrier, Mi-8MTV-2, UH-1H, Mirage 2000C, FC3, MiG-15bis, Ka-50, A-10C (+ A-10C II), P-47D, P-51D, C-101, Yak-52, CA, NS430, Hawk

Terrains I own: Syria, The Channel, SoH/PG, Marianas

System (RIP my old PC): Dell XPS 15 9570 w/ Intel i7-8750H, NVIDIA GTX 1050Ti Max-Q, 16GB DDR4, 500GB Samsung PM871 SSD (upgraded with 1TB Samsung 970 EVO Plus SSD)

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19 hours ago, upyr1 said:

I think if there is any aircraft you would buy two versions of the answer would be yes.

 

If the version I'm not interested in is not being made, or I already have the one I want, then my answer will still be: No. 


Edited by Lurker

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5 hours ago, Lurker said:

 

If the version I'm not interested in is not being made, or I already have the one I want, then my answer will still be: No. 

 

The question is a general question, not about a specific aircraft. 

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I agree with the notion that these polls tend to be a little odd. On one hand a whole lot of options are not included, on the other hand the options that are seem to be awfully precise.

 

Anyways, yes, in general I could imagine something like that, but it's hard to give it a definite yes. There is just a whole lot of variables for me:

- What module are we even talking about? (I know the poll is meant to gauge general interest, but for a lot of modules I own I don't feel need for more versions)

- What alternate version would be on the table? Is it that one I love for some reason, or just one for the sake of completeness?

- Is it something that gives me an actual new experience? Is it a subtle change?

My general answer is yes, good idea. But the pricing question has way too many variables going on.

 

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