Better Understanding RWR wanted

[ilikepie]

had a mission where  there there was 2 f16 NOE ingress to a target with an SA10 site protecting it, RWR in the viper picks up the radar system, the lock and the missile launch warning. both vipers go defensive and into a notch and managed break lock.....however...trackview file shows that the SA10 system was tracking and launching on entirely separate target/s in the opposite direction....I'm trying to understand if the RWR differentiates between a launch on ownship (for lack of a better term) or just locks and launches in general.  

 

insights appreciated 

 

[Bunny Clark]

There is directionality to it. It's entirely likely that two aircraft close together will get a launch warning when only one has been fired on. It shouldn't happen for targets with significant azimuth separation though. 

[Wdigman]

When Flying the A10 I get Missile launch warnings all the time when friendlies fire mavericks or even when enemy artillery fire Rockets.

 

Usually fire off Countermeasures just in case unless its visually obvious whats shooting and where.

 

Can be unnerving when trying to clear SAM sites and too much is going on.

 

Situational awareness is key. Knowing whats in the air and on the ground and the capabilities is what will keep you alive. That's what makes Instant Action missions so hard.

[ilikepie]

4 hours ago, Bunny Clark said:

 It shouldn't happen for targets with significant azimuth separation though. 

which is what i thought, this is the confusing part. 

 

 

[kengou]

As others have said, the RWR can detect the change in frequency when an enemy radar goes into STT mode, even if it's not directly at your own jet, as long as you're within the radar cone. Real life SOP, as I understand it, is when such a signal is detected everyone in the flight tries to get eyes on the missile quickly so they can determine who it's tracking on. Read lots of accounts of this in various memoirs. Without eyes on missile, everyone should assume they're the ones being locked and go defensive immediately.

[Bunny Clark]

9 hours ago, Wdigman said:

When Flying the A10 I get Missile launch warnings all the time when friendlies fire mavericks or even when enemy artillery fire Rockets.

Yup, but that's not the RWR though. The A-10C has a Missile Approach Warning System (MAWS), which consists of several IR cameras around the aircraft to detect the heat from a missile launch.  MAWS will detect almost any kind of missile launch in proximity to the aircraft, the RWR will not detect things like Mavericks as they're not radar guided. 

 

This is one reason why it's good practice to call out missile shots in multiplayer. If I get a MAWS warning at the exact moment my wingman calls "rifle" in my ear I know I can safely ignore it. 

[probad]

the rwr tells you which direction to look out the window

the smoke tells you where the missile is headed

problem solved

Edited Monday at 09:06 PM by probad

[ilikepie]

14 hours ago, kengou said:

 Real life SOP, as I understand it, is when such a signal is detected everyone in the flight tries to get eyes on the missile quickly so they can determine who it's tracking on. Read lots of accounts of this in various memoirs. Without eyes on missile, everyone should assume they're the ones being locked and go defensive immediately.

 

I can understand that this is relevant to a flight approaching from the same azimuth or general direction> This particular instance the noe flight was on the SA battery's 3 o'clock and the launch was on a flight from the 6 oclock aspect with over 40 miles of separation.

 

The manual seems to  confuse rather than clarify (EA i know)

 

: If a symbol has a flashing circle around it, it indicates that the radar is supporting a missile that has been launched at you. When being launched on by a radar-guided missile, you will hear a missile launch tone and the LAUNCH light to the left will illuminate.

 

hence the question, is the RWR only picking up the general energy state change (radar wavelength iguess) or is it A/C specific. 

 

 

[kengou]

9 hours ago, ilikepie said:

 

I can understand that this is relevant to a flight approaching from the same azimuth or general direction> This particular instance the noe flight was on the SA battery's 3 o'clock and the launch was on a flight from the 6 oclock aspect with over 40 miles of separation.

 

The manual seems to  confuse rather than clarify (EA i know)

 

: If a symbol has a flashing circle around it, it indicates that the radar is supporting a missile that has been launched at you. When being launched on by a radar-guided missile, you will hear a missile launch tone and the LAUNCH light to the left will illuminate.

 

hence the question, is the RWR only picking up the general energy state change (radar wavelength iguess) or is it A/C specific. 

 

 

 

This is worth testing but I've definitely seen the RWR in multiple aircraft light up when my wingman was STT locked many times over the years. I don't know the azimuth limits to how this is modeled in DCS, but it sounds like you were within 90 degrees of the other flight which may have been within the cone of the tracking radar.

[Florence201]

Irl SA10 is a nasty beast due to the AESA flaplid radar. It can engage and track multiple targets simultaneously. Not sure how ED have modeled though. 

[TobiasA]

The most weird thing is that you get a launch warning in an track-via-missile system which doesn't change its signature at all during tracking

[Bunny Clark]

On 2/22/2021 at 8:38 PM, ilikepie said:

hence the question, is the RWR only picking up the general energy state change (radar wavelength iguess) or is it A/C specific. 

It is picking up the change in energy state of the radar, but that energy is directional when it is illuminating a target for fire control. It's realistic, as far as we know, for your RWR to alert you when another aircraft within a few degrees of you relative to the launcher is illuminated. But it should not happen when you're 180° from the target, that sounds like a bug. Your RWR should not pick up any change in state for a radar pointing away from you, it shouldn't pick up the radar at all.  

 

On 2/23/2021 at 12:11 PM, TobiasA said:

The most weird thing is that you get a launch warning in an track-via-missile system which doesn't change its signature at all during tracking

TVM definitely changes it's signature on a missile launch, it's just a variation on SARH. From the target's point of view it's identical to SARH.