Which AAA/SAM unit is able to intercept AGM-88 HARMs?

[VTJS17_Fire]

I searched the forums and youtube and only found the SA-10 is capable of intercepting a AGM-88 in DCS. The video was made in June 2019, so my question is, is this still the only SAM system, which can intercept the ARM?

[Tippis]

On land, the Patriot, SA-10, and SA-15 have sensors good enough to detect the missiles. Technically, all IR systems can too, but they rarely have the range and reaction speed needed for it to do any good.

 

At sea, the HHQ-9, HQ-16, Phalanx, RAMs, Sea Sparrows, SA-N-6 (navalised S-300F), SA-N-9 (navalised Tor-M1), SA-N-12 (navalised Buk-M3), and SA-N-20 (navalised S-300FM) can do it, but the way ships work, they're pretty useless to waste ARMs on even in cases where it really should work.

[RavenFrost]

I experienced two SA-19 as group don't intercept an ARM. Two SA-19 combined with a SA-11 (CC,SR, 4xLN) intercept ARM. So it depends how the network is build. I like to build my ADS with several EWR ,long and short-range SAMs, plus some AAA.

[Tippis]

Yes, on its own, the SA-19 isn't terribly capable as far as detection goes. It has optical (which takes ages to do a full sweep) and its search radar (which is not very long range and not the best against small targets), but if it gets help to detect anything using other sensor units, it will happily fire at just about anything it now knows about.

 

This makes it an even bigger surprise-bleep-you unit than the SA-13: it doesn't really use its own radar (because it doesn't have to) and thus doesn't get targeted, and suddenly when everything should be dead already, you get an optically guided, un-spoofable missile up your tailpipe.

[WinterH]

Just now, Tippis said:

Yes, on its own, the SA-19 isn't terribly capable as far as detection goes. It has optical (which takes ages to do a full sweep) and its search radar (which is not very long range and not the best against small targets), but if it gets help to detect anything using other sensor units, it will happily fire at just about anything it now knows about.

 

This makes it an even bigger surprise-bleep-you unit than the SA-13: it doesn't really use its own radar (because it doesn't have to) and thus doesn't get targeted, and suddenly when everything should be dead already, you get an optically guided, un-spoofable missile up your tailpipe.

Does it work like this in DCS though? I mean, if we put a Sborka in same group with Tunguska for example, will it engage without emitting once Sborka detects a target for it? Sounds plausible, but I've never tried it on mission editor.

[Tippis]

52 minutes ago, WinterH said:

Does it work like this in DCS though? I mean, if we put a Sborka in same group with Tunguska for example, will it engage without emitting once Sborka detects a target for it? Sounds plausible, but I've never tried it on mission editor.

It still has its own missile parameters that it will rely on for firing, and I'm not sure the Sborka really offers any benefit other than early detection, as opposed to whatever degree of actual location the Tunguska needs to fire. That said, I have seen Tunguskas fire without any threat indication so it is possible for it to just go on some internal “I know the target is here, so I can look there, so I can now fire and guide the missile” logic. For missile defence in particular, the Sborka is… less than helpful regardless, due to its relatively high target size limit: it simply won't detect anything much smaller than an anit-ship or cruise missile.

 

Just in general, how “target knowledge” is really handled and shared in groups is almost entirely opaque — it's easy to say what the individual unit does; much harder what they do  as a matched set; almost impossible once you start mixing things up.

[WinterH]

Yeah I was thinking of engaging aircraft rather than incoming missiles so used Sborka as an example of external data source. I have seen lonely Tunguskas fire without lock/launch warning, but search warning was tripped in those cases, but that was some years ago now.

[lcabc888]

The SA-24 can intercept too

(if you have HighDigitSams mod)

[VTJS17_Fire]

I wonder, how a  shoulder launched IR missile and its operator could see and track a high speed ARM, like the HARM.

[PoorOldSpike]

On 2/17/2021 at 9:59 AM, VTJS17_Fire said:

I searched the forums and youtube and only found the SA-10 is capable of intercepting a AGM-88 in DCS. The video was made in June 2019, so my question is, is this still the only SAM system, which can intercept the ARM?

 

No, the SA-15 Tor can also intercept it..:)

I just spent 4 hours testing every Russian AAA/SAM unit currently in the game (March 2nd 2021) and found that only the SA-10 and Tor would engage the AGM-88C HARM.

Below- A Hornet lets one fly-

 

 

 

And up comes an SA-10 to take it out-

 

 

 

And in this next test up comes a Tor with the same result..

 

 

 

All the units below (including IR missiles) did NOT engage the HARMs-

 

ZSU-23-4 Shilka, SA-2, SA-3, SA-6 Kub,

all 4 AAA guns, SA-8 Osa, SA-9 Strela 1,

SA-13 Strela, SA-11 Buk

 SA-18 Igla, SA-18 Igla-S, SA-19 Tunguska.

Edited March 3, 2021 by PoorOldSpike

[VTJS17_Fire]

Yeah, in further tests, the TORs are good in defending other SAM systems.

[=Mac=]

SA-5 will intercept a HARM.

[Shadow KT]

On 1/4/2023 at 2:56 PM, =Mac= said:

SA-5 will intercept a HARM.

Do you have a video of that happening? Was surprised by your comment and decided to test. No luck, SA-5 does not react at all to HARMs flying towards it from 50nm.

[fnslayeroc]

So far I have been able to get the SA-10 (and all the modded S300 variants), Roland, Patriot, SA-15, SA-22,  and NASAMS to engage harms. The Rolands suck at it, but totally can, they are nice for point defense if you have ALOT of Telars around and spread out in order for them to react properly.

Might try the SA-24, I have all the sam mods, didn't know about that one, I have heard the HQ-7 can but have had absolutely 0 luck trying to get it to work...

[Shadow KT]

On 2/17/2021 at 1:51 PM, RavenFrost said:

I experienced two SA-19 as group don't intercept an ARM. Two SA-19 combined with a SA-11 (CC,SR, 4xLN) intercept ARM. So it depends how the network is build. I like to build my ADS with several EWR ,long and short-range SAMs, plus some AAA.

I was surprised I've missed this in the past.... Tried it out of curiosity, but unfortunately, it does not seem to work anymore. 2x SA-19 combined with a functional SA-11 group did not yield any success.

The Tunguska got buffed and nerfed a couple of times in the past couple of years... Unfortunately, it does not seem to be able to stop HARMs anymore. That said, it can still engage bigger cruise missiles, such as the Harpoon/SLAM-ER