How to fight a Hornet, in a Hornet?

[Angel_Scott]

I'm okay as a pilot can usually maintain a 1:1 kill ratio or close to against every other fighter, but when fighting the 18 in the 18 I get consistently shut down. Can't make anything work. Suggestions? It's kinda embarrassing...

[Vortex225]

I'm okay as a pilot can usually maintain a 1:1 kill ratio or close to against every other fighter, but when fighting the 18 in the 18 I get consistently shut down. Can't make anything work. Suggestions? It's kinda embarrassing...

BVR or WVR? Need more data about the type of fight and your typical flows.

[Angel_Scott]

Sorry ACM dogfighting.

[Stearmandriver]

Well, you don't have the nose-pointing or alpha advantages that the Hornet seems to have against other fighters, so I feel like it's gotta come down to playing energy management and geometry better than the other guy. 

 

When I'm able to actually *win* a fight against another Hornet (vs just getting lucky because the other guy lost sight or something), it seems to come down to me (more through luck than skill I'm sure) properly employing maneuvers like yo-yos and displacement rolls; maneuvers designed to use geometry to your advantage, and manage your energy state. 

 

Check out the old "Art of the Kill" video on YouTube for Falcon; it's cheesy but there's good info.  The true bible on this stuff (that's publicly available, anyway) is probably Shaw's "Fighter Combat: Tactics and Maneuvering".  Electronic formats can be found online for cheap. 

 

Note that I'm no expert at any of this; those are hopefully just a couple thoughts that get you pointed in the right direction. 

[G.J.S]

I’d dump as much fuel as possible prior to the merge, give yourself (hopefully) an advantage by being lighter. With similar platforms, it’s going to be a game of who’s lighter, as well as pilot skill. If you can dump and only go in with the bare minimum in fuel, plus maybe a 1000lb contingency, you may have a better prepped aircraft than your opponent.

Advantages being quicker acceleration, slower minimum airspeed, better vertical performance.

 

As a start it’s worth a try.

[Vortex225]

Sorry ACM dogfighting.

In that case, I highly recommend the DCS Debrief BFM Guides (now with the Air Warfare Group).

As the author of that series indicates, there's no magic formula for winning BFM contests. However, the videos do a great job of introducing the terminology and concepts needed to maneuver relative to the bandit, identify turning circles and align/misalign them when needed, find and pursue the bandit's control zone, manage your energy state, avoid the bandit's weapon employment zone, and use lag/pure/lead pursuit geometries to pull the bandit into your HUD.

Bottom line: against a bandit flying the same (outstanding) aircraft in BFM, the pilot that can best exploit geometry and physics will win (most of the time).

Watch the videos. The author did an outstanding job; truly high quality content.

[ruddy122]

You got a lot of good dogfighters in this thread

Like they said there is no magic code but good energy management and seeing your opponent wins the fight

The Hornet fights well down in the weeds but not so well up high

Best is to force your opponent down low and when you have the shot take it


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[bkthunder]

Might seems like a small thing, but if you are flying realistically while your opponent pulls the paddle and turns at 9G, you have no chance whatever you try. 

So agree on the rules, if he/she uses the paddle, then you will have to use it too or find someone less arcadey. 

 

Also, due to the unrealistically slow engine response in the Hornet, if you don't use the paddle you have a big risk of going too fast: e.g. you are turning at 370 kts in full A/B, as soon as you drop the nose a bit it'll start to speed up, and by the time you pull back on the throttles and the engines react, you'll be well after 400. 

Now, if you use the paddle, you can easily increase the g and actually use the extra speed for more g and turn rate, but if you don't use it, your turn rate and radius become much bigger and the only thing you can to is to slow down (you are already pulling max g of about 7.5).

Unfortunately, again due to long spool-up times, when you throttle back you risk bleeding all your energy and finding yourself near idle with speed brake out at 200kts, and it'll be about 10 seconds before you're in full A/B again. This bug makes it extra-tricky.

 

 

Edited February 15, 2021 by bkthunder

[RodBorza]

On 2/14/2021 at 9:49 AM, Echo225 said:

In that case, I highly recommend the DCS Debrief BFM Guides (now with the Air Warfare Group).
 

 

As the author of that series indicates, there's no magic formula for winning BFM contests. However, the videos do a great job of introducing the terminology and concepts needed to maneuver relative to the bandit, identify turning circles and align/misalign them when needed, find and pursue the bandit's control zone, manage your energy state, avoid the bandit's weapon employment zone, and use lag/pure/lead pursuit geometries to pull the bandit into your HUD.

Bottom line: against a bandit flying the same (outstanding) aircraft in BFM, the pilot that can best exploit geometry and physics will win (most of the time).

Watch the videos. The author did an outstanding job; truly high quality content.





 

 

Thanks man, I didn't know this channel. Quality content.