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Is the Viper's TGP LSS function ... working? It's driving me nuts.


XCNuse

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I've now tried I don't know how many times to get the TGP on the F16 to find a buddy laze via LSS, and I've had no luck.

 

A10 and Harrier will find a buddy laze no issue very fast; but no matter what with the F16, no matter my range, I cannot get the LSS function to find a buddy laze.

 

I'll admit I have not tried finding a JTAC laze, but I imagine it would have similar results.

 

Last night alone I was looking within 0.1 degrees of a target, and the TGP after uncage and LSS search mode it still wouldn't find the target that I could see on the screen before going into LSS mode.

 

Am I crazy, or am I somehow missing something.

I feel like pressing the uncage button is a bit difficult to end up with "user error" if that's all there is to it.

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Have you messed with the laser codes at all? Make sure your LSS code matches your buddy's laser LTD code. I think all the defaults are 1688.

 

Make sure your buddy is within lasing range of the target and is lasing from a direction in which you have a line of sight to the laser reflection. I have read on these forums (but not verified) that the Hornet's laser has a max range of about 8 nmi. Not sure if there is a similar limit on the Viper. 

 

I was able to successfully LSS from a buddy Viper the last time I tried, which I think was one or two patches ago. 


Edited by Machalot

"Subsonic is below Mach 1, supersonic is up to Mach 5. Above Mach 5 is hypersonic. And reentry from space, well, that's like Mach a lot."

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Lasers in DCS extend to a maximum range of 8 miles. If the target is further away, the laser spot will float in the air. This affects all aircraft with a TGP, not just the Hornet.

 

Equally you need to be within X miles to pick up the laser spot, but I don't have an accurate number on that.

I recall spawning with empty TGP settings (online), so it's worth double checking the codes.

The LSS FOV seems a bit narrow to me, but other than that I never had any major problems with it.

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I was able to do this a couple of days ago.  You need to set the LSS laser code on the ICP (List then 0 then 5).  Then point the TGP in the general direction of the lased target and hit uncage on your throttle.  If it finds it, the TGP will lock on.

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1 hour ago, Datajack said:

I was able to do this a couple of days ago.  You need to set the LSS laser code on the ICP (List then 0 then 5).  Then point the TGP in the general direction of the lased target and hit uncage on your throttle.  If it finds it, the TGP will lock on.

It might be this; but isn't it by default set to 1688?

 

Definitely know for a fact I was in range, but if it's not set to LSS same code as laze code by default then it's possible; I've probably gone in there and noticed LSS code before in the DED but haven't bothered to check it since I realized the viper COULD LSS.

 

I suppose it would make sense that you wouldn't want to LSS for 1688 and then laze with 1688, but it also seems equally as weird that literally everything in the game defaults to 1688 and it wouldn't.


Edited by XCNuse
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Not sure if a default is set in the background, but the first time I go into the ICP Laser page both values are blank.  I think even if its 1688, I think you still need to go and set it.  I had a buddy lasing in a harrier for me when we tried it.  I entered the laser code he provided and it worked like a charm.

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Tried again last night; buddy in JF17.

Set the codes in UFC, DED confirmed 1688 across the board, TGP on MFD showed 1688 LSS

 

.... no dice.

 

Even pointing TGP right near the target, it failed to find anything at any point in time.
LSS was pointed on flat ground in middle of desert, no trees or objects in the way.

 

Really would like ED to respond how this is meant to function, because I can't get it to work.

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32 minutes ago, XCNuse said:

Tried again last night; buddy in JF17.

Set the codes in UFC, DED confirmed 1688 across the board, TGP on MFD showed 1688 LSS

 

.... no dice.

 

Even pointing TGP right near the target, it failed to find anything at any point in time.
LSS was pointed on flat ground in middle of desert, no trees or objects in the way.

 

Really would like ED to respond how this is meant to function, because I can't get it to work.

Can you post a track of this latest attempt?

"Subsonic is below Mach 1, supersonic is up to Mach 5. Above Mach 5 is hypersonic. And reentry from space, well, that's like Mach a lot."

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1 minute ago, Machalot said:

Can you post a track of this latest attempt?

Would be like 30 minutes in, and file is too large to do it from where I am

 

I'll attempt to set up a quick mission to test it tonight though; but unless everyone can prove me I'm wrong and that it works, I'd love to see it or give me details beyond what I could possibly be doing wrong.

 

DED-misc-lasr both show 1688

TGP shows 1688 below LSS

buddy or jtac lazes

uncage

TGP goes gray and wiggles dot around forever.

 

I've had TGP zoomed in, zoomed out, EXP mode, no EXP mode, next to targets; viewing targets... etc

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So I've managed to get it to work in SP, still have yet to get it work in multiplayer.

 

Not altering what I'm doing.

 

Interesting difference I'm seeing though; in SP the LSS will search a MUCH larger range, I can see it sweeping around quite a lot.

 

in MP, it won't sweep but 2-3 degrees, it barely moves anywhere


Edited by XCNuse
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3 hours ago, XCNuse said:

So I've managed to get it to work in SP, still have yet to get it work in multiplayer.

 

Not altering what I'm doing.

 

Interesting difference I'm seeing though; in SP the LSS will search a MUCH larger range, I can see it sweeping around quite a lot.

 

in MP, it won't sweep but 2-3 degrees, it barely moves anywhere

 

Are you trying wide and narrow FOV? Just a guess. 

"Subsonic is below Mach 1, supersonic is up to Mach 5. Above Mach 5 is hypersonic. And reentry from space, well, that's like Mach a lot."

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7 minutes ago, Machalot said:

Are you trying wide and narrow FOV? Just a guess. 

Yes, I've tried everything.

 

I would really love to see someone else prove to me it works in multiplayer with other aircraft because I'm beginning to think it doesn't.

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2 hours ago, XCNuse said:

Yes, I've tried everything.

 

I would really love to see someone else prove to me it works in multiplayer with other aircraft because I'm beginning to think it doesn't.

I have only ever done it in multiplayer and it worked for me.  I don't know how to prove it to you.

"Subsonic is below Mach 1, supersonic is up to Mach 5. Above Mach 5 is hypersonic. And reentry from space, well, that's like Mach a lot."

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19 hours ago, =52d= Skip said:

 

Made a quick Test yesterday and it worked fine for my Buddy and me. 

He was in an A-10C II, me in the F-16; Airstart, Open Beta. He started firing his Laser shortly after passing the 10nm mark and supported the bomb all the way in. 

 

Also tested SP CTLD JTAC - worked as well.

 

 

So that's great and all but; is it not a big deal that it took the Viper literally 40+ seconds in that video to actually go to where the laser was pointed; aka the target?

 

Clearly this is incorrect behavior.

 

In SinglePlayer it went to the location instantly as it should.

 

This video only kind of proves further to me that there is definitely... absolutely something wrong in multiplayer with LSS on the Viper.

 

Don't get me wrong Skip, I hugely appreciate it, but ED needs to see this; because there's DEFINITELY something up; this behavior is 100% incorrect!


Edited by XCNuse
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1 hour ago, XCNuse said:

So that's great and all but; is it not a big deal that it took the Viper literally 40+ seconds in that video to actually go to where the laser was pointed; aka the target?

 

Clearly this is incorrect behavior.

 

In SinglePlayer it went to the location instantly as it should.

 

This video only kind of proves further to me that there is definitely... absolutely something wrong in multiplayer with LSS on the Viper.

 

Don't get me wrong Skip, I hugely appreciate it, but ED needs to see this; because there's DEFINITELY something up; this behavior is 100% incorrect!

 

What took 40 sec?  I saw around the 1:00 mark, he activates LSS, and about 1 sec later it found the laser spot.

"Subsonic is below Mach 1, supersonic is up to Mach 5. Above Mach 5 is hypersonic. And reentry from space, well, that's like Mach a lot."

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4 hours ago, XCNuse said:

So that's great and all but; is it not a big deal that it took the Viper literally 40+ seconds in that video to actually go to where the laser was pointed; aka the target?

 

Clearly this is incorrect behavior.

 

In SinglePlayer it went to the location instantly as it should.

 

This video only kind of proves further to me that there is definitely... absolutely something wrong in multiplayer with LSS on the Viper.

 

Don't get me wrong Skip, I hugely appreciate it, but ED needs to see this; because there's DEFINITELY something up; this behavior is 100% incorrect!

 

 

What you`re seeing there (the jerky move to the left) is the 8nm Laser Beam Range Limit at work - which I assumed everyone knows about already. As I said, my Buddy started lasing shortly after the 10nm mark with me even further behind.

 

How realistic the Range limit is is up for discussion, but as far as the original question "Is the Viper's TGP LSS function ... working?" goes the answer is "Yes, it works" (within the constraints of the game engine; which is the same for all modules).

52d_Sig_Pic3.png

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41 minutes ago, =52d= Skip said:

What you`re seeing there (the jerky move to the left) is the 8nm Laser Beam Range Limit at work - which I assumed everyone knows about already. As I said, my Buddy started lasing shortly after the 10nm mark with me even further behind.

Does the TGP continue to track the laser spot even after it initially finds it an focuses the image on it?  I didn't realize that.

"Subsonic is below Mach 1, supersonic is up to Mach 5. Above Mach 5 is hypersonic. And reentry from space, well, that's like Mach a lot."

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4 hours ago, =52d= Skip said:

 

What you`re seeing there (the jerky move to the left) is the 8nm Laser Beam Range Limit at work - which I assumed everyone knows about already. As I said, my Buddy started lasing shortly after the 10nm mark with me even further behind.

 

If that's what that is, then I've had it work once or twice, but it was doing that mess.

 

No other module acts that like nor does that, and I swear I've had other modules with LSS be able to find a laser MUCH farther away, and find the spots instantly.

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4 hours ago, XCNuse said:

 

If that's what that is, then I've had it work once or twice, but it was doing that mess.

 

No other module acts that like nor does that, and I swear I've had other modules with LSS be able to find a laser MUCH farther away, and find the spots instantly.

I think the laser itself has an 8nmi limit from the lasing aircraft. I don't think it limits the LSS range. I could be wrong. 

"Subsonic is below Mach 1, supersonic is up to Mach 5. Above Mach 5 is hypersonic. And reentry from space, well, that's like Mach a lot."

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On 2/19/2021 at 10:01 AM, Machalot said:

Does the TGP continue to track the laser spot even after it initially finds it an focuses the image on it?  I didn't realize that.

 

Yes, else you wouldn´t be able to track moving Targets.

 

On 2/19/2021 at 7:02 PM, Machalot said:

I think the laser itself has an 8nmi limit from the lasing aircraft. I don't think it limits the LSS range. I could be wrong. 

 

Yes again. What we have currently is basicly a 8nm "Laser Stick" and the LST is looking for the end of that stick. If it hasn´t reached the intended Target yet you see the jerky creeping motion (as in my first video) until the designator moves close enough to hit the target.

 

If your Designator is inside 8nm then you´ll get the instant Snap-On XCNuse is referring to. We did some more testing over the weekend and it seems the magic number here is 15-16nm with both, a FAC (A) and a (human) JTAC lasing at ground level.

 

 

52d_Sig_Pic3.png

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4 hours ago, =52d= Skip said:

Yes, else you wouldn´t be able to track moving Targets.

I thought the TGP might use the laser to find the target and then switch to Point track for moving targets. But that's nice that tracks a moving laser spot. 

"Subsonic is below Mach 1, supersonic is up to Mach 5. Above Mach 5 is hypersonic. And reentry from space, well, that's like Mach a lot."

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