Mi-8 Realistic Cold Start Procedure

[Rudel_chw]

Hello,

 

I've read ED's Manual on this bird, watched the @vsTerminus Cold Start Tutorial and read the Mi-17 real Flight Manual; and tried to come up with a Cold Start Procedure that attempts to follow the real procedure, minus those items that don't apply on the Sim and minus the external and internal pre-flight checks.

 

Please, I would love if Mi-8 users more experienced than myself can give it a look and tell me if I've got something wrong, or anything important is missing. This Checklist is geared towards users of the English Cockpit and so all the switch and light names are in english.

 

Once I'm sure that the Procedure is correct, I will use it as the basis for a Cold Start Training mission, as the one currently on the Sim is incomplete, has no voiceovers and has some triggers problems that make it pause too long at some steps.

 

Thanks a lot for any input on this

 

Eduardo

 

Mi-8 - Normal Procedures v3.pdf

Edited July 3, 2021 by Rudel_chw
Updated the attached document

[admiki]

Only thing I saw that is wrong is that APU is not affected by rotor brake status. Main engines- yes.

[Rudel_chw]

5 minutes ago, admiki said:

Only thing I saw that is wrong is that APU is not affected by rotor brake status. Main engines- yes.

 

OK, but my document never states that the APU is affected .. it just says "If the rotor brake is not in the full down position a micro switch will not allow engine start."  

 

Edit ... ok, sorry I just saw the text that you mention. will correct ... thanks alot, good catch 

Edited February 5, 2021 by Rudel_chw

[sLYFa]

If you want to go full hardcore, the following things are missing:

-Generator automatic switchover test before APU start (turn on one generator, observe red warning light and wait 5s until the warning light for the other generator turns on, meaning the switchover took place but since both generators are off the red light for the other generator illuminates too).

- Vibrometer and EGT gauge test prior to battery check

- Hydraulic system test under idle power

-EGT limiter test (both channels)

-RPM adjustment test and adjusting rotor rpm to 95% with 3° collective pitch

-SPUU test

-Autopilot test

 

Some more remarks:

-All circuit breakers are turned on before turning on the batteries except: Fuel pumps, hydraulic pumps, RIO-3. This is done to prevent bitching betty from bitching about it during RI-65 test. These CBs are turned on after RI-65 test.

-The inverters are only turned on after APU start, not before

-Lights test is performed in flasher mode (turn flasher off after lights test)

-Lights need to be put in flasher mode after getting the generators online

-never heard that the radio needs to be off for PPS test

-Cockpit voice recorded needs to be turned on before APU start

-Engines need to run at least 1min in idle and until engine oil temperature exceeds at least 30°, main transmission -5° (or -15° cant remember that exactly)

-likewise APU cooldown is 60s in idle (no backup generator running

-Engine dust protection is turned on after starting the engines and before throttling up

[Rudel_chw]

23 minutes ago, sLYFa said:

If you want to go full hardcore, the following things are missing:

...

 

Some more remarks:

...

 

Hi,

 

Thanks a lot for this list, I will check each item and correlate with the TM-1-1520-Mi-17-10 - Operator Manual, to decide if to include it or not.

 

I love realism, but don't want to inadvertently put on the procedure tests and checks that are only performed during maintenances or special check rides. 

 

Also, DCS is a game and I want to make certain concesions to playability, like ommiting the warm-up times for some steps. That's why I also omitted the pree-flight exterior and cockpit checks.

 

Best regards,

 

Eduardo

[sLYFa]

The stuff I mentioned are standard preflight procedures made by the crew, not maintanance (except the rpm adjustment, which is only done on the first flight of the day) and all of it actually works in DCS. Keep in mind that the Mi-8 is essentially a 60s aircraft and preflight checks are extensive on those. 

Most if that is not needed in DCS of course but then again why bother with clickable cockpits and full fidelity systems if you don't use them

[msalama]

What sLYFa said there. Haven't flown the bird in ages, but used to operate her full hardcore as per the U.S. Army POH for the Mi-17 (applicable to our bird as well), and what seems to be missing (IIRC) is that you should let the APU run on idle for 1 minute before starting the first engine, and then let her idle for a minute again before the other engine startup as well.

 

Just off the top of my head though, so please verify.

Edited February 6, 2021 by msalama

[zerO_crash]

On 2/6/2021 at 7:53 PM, msalama said:

What sLYFa said there. Haven't flown the bird in ages, but used to operate her full hardcore as per the U.S. Army POH for the Mi-17 (applicable to our bird as well), and what seems to be missing (IIRC) is that you should let the APU run on idle for 1 minute before starting the first engine, and then let her idle for a minute again before the other engine startup as well.

 

Just off the top of my head though, so please verify.

 

You are correct. Page 250 in DCS manual just for reference.

 

@Rudel_chw Aside from what sLYFa stated, I cannot spot any inconsistencies. Nice! )

Edited February 7, 2021 by zerO_crash

[Rudel_chw]

On 2/6/2021 at 7:20 AM, sLYFa said:

The stuff I mentioned are standard preflight procedures made by the crew, not maintanance ...

 

On 2/6/2021 at 3:53 PM, msalama said:

... what seems to be missing (IIRC) is that you should let the APU run on idle for 1 minute before starting the first engine, and then let her idle for a minute again before the other engine startup as well.

 

2 hours ago, zerO_crash said:

@Rudel_chw Aside from what sLYFa stated, I cannot spot any inconsistencies. Nice! )

 

 

Thanks a lot for all the help, I will correct my Procedure to take into account your information. Most likely, I will ignore the warm-up times if they don't cause trouble in DCS, in order to have a playable Procedure, tough I will probably mention the omission of these warm-up times on the appropiate places.

 

Greetings,

 

Eduardo

 

edit: interesting video

 

Edited February 8, 2021 by Rudel_chw

[admiki]

Regarding APU warm up. When I tried to find lowest temperature for successfull start, it would fail if I dind't let APU warm up first. Everything above -40 would work just fine with immediate start.

[lukynoo92]

On 2/6/2021 at 2:15 AM, sLYFa said:

never heard that the radio needs to be off for PPS test

For pps (fire protection system in english) is necessary to turn the comm1 off, because natasha is connected with it. In case of fire it transmits on selected frequency via comm1 message about fire. So prior to the pps check, you have to turn the comm1 radio off and also 4 cb switches (1 ocered and 2 ocered).

On 2/6/2021 at 2:15 AM, sLYFa said:

Engines need to run at least 1min in idle and until engine oil temperature exceeds at least 30°, main transmission -5° (or -15° cant remember that exactly)

Main transmission min temp from idle is -15

[Rudel_chw]

31 minutes ago, lukynoo92 said:

For pps (fire protection system in english) is necessary to turn the comm1 off, because natasha is connected with it. In case of fire it transmits on selected frequency via comm1 message about fire. So prior to the pps check, you have to turn the comm1 radio off and also 4 cb switches (1 ocered and 2 ocered).

 

Thanks a lot, didn't knew that fact 

[Hiob]

Hi Rudel,

 

any Updates on your Checklist? Is the Download in the first post linked to the most recent version?

 

Thank You!

[Rudel_chw]

2 minutes ago, Hiob said:

... any Updates on your Checklist? Is the Download in the first post linked to the most recent version?

 

hello, yes, that is still the latest version. I’ve left the Mi-8 aside until the Virpil rudders that I purchased a month ago arrive .. in the meantime I’m now engaged on editing training missions for the A-4E and the A-29B 

[Hiob]

equally welcome! Thank you!

[vsTerminus]

I'd be interested in doing a cold start video with the more realistic checklist once it's complete. Less of a tutorial and more of an "in case you're interested..." kind of thing.

 

With full credits to everyone in this thread of course.

[Hiob]

11 minutes ago, vsTerminus said:

...

I‘m pretty stunned that you‘re making those awesome tutorial videos, yet seem to be quite new/inactive in this forum.... 

[Rudel_chw]

On 4/8/2021 at 2:58 PM, vsTerminus said:

I'd be interested in doing a cold start video with the more realistic checklist once it's complete. Less of a tutorial and more of an "in case you're interested..." kind of thing.

 

I'd feel honored  .. I had left the Mi-8 aside while I waited for my new Virpil rudder pedals to arrive, but it seems that they are still on backorder  

 

I'm currently on the middle of editing a series of Training missions for the A-29B user mod, I will try to hurry up and finish a couple more missions and then I will update the Mi-8 Procedure and get back here .. promise

 

If you are curious, this is a sample of how the missions I'm editing are turning out .. I'm having a blast editing these:

 

 

 

Cheers,

 

 

Eduardo

 

Edited January 7 by Rudel_chw

[Hiob]

4 minutes ago, Rudel_chw said:

 

If you are curious, this is a sample of how the missions I'm editing are turning out .. I'm having a blast editing these:

 

 

Where/when are you planning on releasing them?

2  up btw

Edited April 8, 2021 by Hiob

[Rudel_chw]

10 minutes ago, Hiob said:

Where/when are you planning on releasing them?

2  up btw

 

 

They are being released inside each new version of the A-29B Mod, the 1st Mission (Cold Start) was released on version Version 0.1.7b, the next two (Navigation & Landing) were added on the current Version 0.1.8b and this one will surely go into the next version 

[Rudel_chw]

2 hours ago, Hiob said:

I‘m pretty stunned that you‘re making those awesome tutorial videos, yet seem to be quite new/inactive in this forum.... 

 

Actually, his Tutorial videos are what convinced me to try the Hip   they are actually superb 

[Hiob]

yep, same with me...

[ftmch]

10 hours ago, Rudel_chw said:

 

Actually, his Tutorial videos are what convinced me to try the Hip   they are actually superb 

I had already convinced myself to try the Hip but I certainly wouldn't have gotten very far without the tutorial series. Some of the best tutorial videos for, well, anything that I've seen.

[Hiob]

@vsTerminus

measured by the amount of love you receive for your work in this thread alone, you should be more active here in the forum!

[AlpineGTA]

Yes, I've just recently started flying the Hip a lot after discovering @vsTerminus videos and really enjoying it, after too much neglect. The tutorials and mission videos are brilliant to watch and have really helped me to understand how better to fly not only the Hip but all the helicopter modules.