Jump to content

Recommended Posts

There is a work around for refueling the jet on the ground with empty external tanks. Open the refueling door, and ask for refuel. The tanks will start to take on fuel. I don’t know if it works for other jets. I was told this by a squadron mate, and it works. Give it a try. Hope it helps.  

  • Like 4
  • Thanks 3

[sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]

MSI MPG X570 Gaming Plus MOBO||Ryzen 9 3900X 12 Core, 24 Thread Processor || MSI GTX 1070Ti 8GB GPU OverClocked || 32GB GSKILL DDR4 RAM @3600 || Samsung 1TB SSD || Samsung 250GB SSD || WD Caviar Black 2TB HDD || WD Caviar Black 1TB HDD || Thermaltake ToughPower GF1 850W PS || Thermaltake Tower || Windows 10 Pro 64bit || Thrustmaster Warthog and Cougar sticks, throttles and MFDs || Saitek Rudder Pedals || Trackir 5 ||

Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Creature_1stVFW said:

There is a work around for refueling the jet on the ground with empty external tanks. Open the refueling door, and ask for refuel. The tanks will start to take on fuel. I don’t know if it works for other jets. I was told this by a squadron mate, and it works. Give it a try. Hope it helps.  

With the engine running both the internal and external fuel tanks are pressurized to aid in fuel feeding. To be able to refuel you will need to dump this pressure. With the engine off the pressure will be lost via valves, however with the engine on the pressure won't be lost and can only be dumped by opening the AR door. For that reason you have to open the AR door before doing hot pit refueling.

  • Thanks 3
Link to post
Share on other sites

That’s kinda what I said....

[sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]

MSI MPG X570 Gaming Plus MOBO||Ryzen 9 3900X 12 Core, 24 Thread Processor || MSI GTX 1070Ti 8GB GPU OverClocked || 32GB GSKILL DDR4 RAM @3600 || Samsung 1TB SSD || Samsung 250GB SSD || WD Caviar Black 2TB HDD || WD Caviar Black 1TB HDD || Thermaltake ToughPower GF1 850W PS || Thermaltake Tower || Windows 10 Pro 64bit || Thrustmaster Warthog and Cougar sticks, throttles and MFDs || Saitek Rudder Pedals || Trackir 5 ||

Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, Creature_1stVFW said:

There is a work around for refueling the jet on the ground with empty external tanks. Open the refueling door, and ask for refuel. The tanks will start to take on fuel. I don’t know if it works for other jets. I was told this by a squadron mate, and it works. Give it a try. Hope it helps.  


As in the AAR refueling door? 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Both terms are correct

AR = Air Refueling

AAR = Airborne Air Refueling

Same Thing

USAF loves acronyms

Happy Flying


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]

LUCKY:pilotfly::joystick:

Computer Specs

CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 2600 6-Core 3.4 GHz| GPU: Nvidia GeForce GTX 1660 6Gb | RAM: 32 GB DDR4 @ 3000 MHz | OS: Win 10 64 bit | HD: 500 Gb SSD

Link to post
Share on other sites

IRL both terms are the same thing

AAR is more precise but a real viper instructor can answer that I flew tankers and the KC-10A


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]

LUCKY:pilotfly::joystick:

Computer Specs

CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 2600 6-Core 3.4 GHz| GPU: Nvidia GeForce GTX 1660 6Gb | RAM: 32 GB DDR4 @ 3000 MHz | OS: Win 10 64 bit | HD: 500 Gb SSD

Link to post
Share on other sites

In real life you have to move the AAR switch to OPEN if refueling a viper with centerline tank. Otherwise you build up air pressure in the tanks and will eventually cause fuel to overflow from the vent port in the left wing.

It would almost always happen to rookie ground crews. Would be a pain to clean-up afterwards. 🥵

Link to post
Share on other sites

Current DCS behaviour:

With the AR door open the external and internal tanks refill simultaneously but the refueling stops when the internal tanks are full. To be able to get a full external tank you first need to sufficiently empty the internals.

  • Thanks 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

The next thing is knowing why it works

Long story short and someone explained it beautifully on this thread is because opening the door to outside air means the fuel system is not pressurized and you can do it.

You have to remember to close the door when done


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]

LUCKY:pilotfly::joystick:

Computer Specs

CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 2600 6-Core 3.4 GHz| GPU: Nvidia GeForce GTX 1660 6Gb | RAM: 32 GB DDR4 @ 3000 MHz | OS: Win 10 64 bit | HD: 500 Gb SSD

Link to post
Share on other sites

Maybe one day someone at ED will google  a picture of an aircraft drop tank....and see the cap at the front that you can open, place a refuelling nozzel in, pull the trigger and the tank fills up with jet fuel.

 

In know...I know - black magic.

  • Like 1

Asus Maximus VIII Hero Alpha| i7-6700K @ 4.60GHz | nVidia GTX 1080ti Strix OC 11GB @ 2075MHz| 16GB G.Skill Trident Z RGB 3200Mhz DDR4 CL14 |

Samsung 950 PRO 512GB M.2 SSD | Corsair Force LE 480GB SSD | Windows 10 64-Bit | TM Warthog with FSSB R3 Lighting Base | VKB Gunfighter Pro + MCG | TM MFD's | Oculus Rift S | Jetseat FSE

 

[sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]

Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, VampireNZ said:

Maybe one day someone at ED will google  a picture of an aircraft drop tank....and see the cap at the front that you can open, place a refuelling nozzel in, pull the trigger and the tank fills up with jet fuel.

 

In know...I know - black magic.

Only problem is that you will not have fuel going to all three sections of the external tank that way. The nose spill over tube is too high for an over the wing refuel of all 370 gallons. You would need to fill each section individually. Otherwise you will be bathing in JET-A. 

 

Just open the aerial refueling door if the engine is on. It's normal operation and that is what the procedure is during HOT REFUELING

Twitch Channel

 

[sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]

Virtual Thunderbirds, LLC | Sponsored by Thrustmaster

 

Z390 Aorus Xtreme, i9 9900k, G.SKILL TridentZ Series 32GB, 1080ti 11GB, Obutto R3Volution, Thrustmaster HOTAS Warthog, TPR, Cougar MFDs, FSSB R3L, JetSeat, Oculus Rift S, Buddy-Fox A-10C UFC, F/A-18C UFC, Tek Creations F-16 ICP

 

Link to post
Share on other sites




Just open the aerial refueling door if the engine is on. It's normal operation and that is what the procedure is during HOT REFUELING

Yeah, but as I wrote above, it's not working properly at the moment.

So the proper procedure right now is "First empty internal tanks and then open AR door and refuel."
Link to post
Share on other sites
11 hours ago, Katj said:


 


Yeah, but as I wrote above, it's not working properly at the moment.

So the proper procedure right now is "First empty internal tanks and then open AR door and refuel."

It is working just like the real jet. If there isn't enough room in the internal system, the internal will fill and shut off the refuel before the externals take on a full load. Since the internal and externals takes on fuel at the same time, the internal needs to be low enough that externals fill before internal.

 

My comment was an assumption that one is attempting to refuel a nearly empty jet after a flight on a hot refueling scenario. 

Twitch Channel

 

[sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]

Virtual Thunderbirds, LLC | Sponsored by Thrustmaster

 

Z390 Aorus Xtreme, i9 9900k, G.SKILL TridentZ Series 32GB, 1080ti 11GB, Obutto R3Volution, Thrustmaster HOTAS Warthog, TPR, Cougar MFDs, FSSB R3L, JetSeat, Oculus Rift S, Buddy-Fox A-10C UFC, F/A-18C UFC, Tek Creations F-16 ICP

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
It is working just like the real jet. If there isn't enough room in the internal system, the internal will fill and shut off the refuel before the externals take on a full load. Since the internal and externals takes on fuel at the same time, the internal needs to be low enough that externals fill before internal.
 
My comment was an assumption that one is attempting to refuel a nearly empty jet after a flight on a hot refueling scenario. 
Really? It honestly sounds like bad design.

How is AR different? Why doesn't it shut off when internals are full?
  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

Hi,
i do not understand the general sense of this thread. Let me clarify:

Op found that if the refuel switch is open, it allows ground crew to fill also the external tanks. Without doing so, we incur in what is flagged as a bug (external tanks are not "exchanged" and thus we need to remove them and have them mounted again)

I've said "exchanged" because it is my understanding that in DCS whenever you call ground crew for refuel, they also rearm you with the loadout shown in the ground crew tooltip, effectively "overwriting" the loadout you had before asking for refuel & rearm.

Am I wrong/missing something? Is there a separate function for "refuel only"?

Regards

Sent from my MI 10 Lite 5G using Tapatalk

Link to post
Share on other sites

No, there is no separate option to refuel only, I've asked somewhere before for an option to change skin without the need to refuel or rearm,

 

I it would be a very good idea if we could do that stuff separately and independent of each other,

 

 


Edited by Furiz
  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites
No, there is no separate option to refuel only, I've asked somewhere before for an option to change skin without the need to refuel or rearm,
 
I it would be a very good idea if we could do that stuff separately and independent of each other,
 
 
Thanks, i thought I missed a basic feature of DCS!

That said, the consistent (all modules) behavior in game is that upon refuel & rearm, internal fuel is refilled and external stores (including tanks) are exchanged with new ones (full ones, but a bug prevents this and they remain empty) , however if you open the refuel valve in the Viper you actually refill the external tanks instead of exchanging them, unless:
Also when your internal tanks are full, refueling stops, so if you didn't burn out enough fuel in internal tanks the external tanks may end up partially filled.
So it's either a case of a new feature mitigating a bug or a "bug in a bug"?

Sent from my MI 10 Lite 5G using Tapatalk

Link to post
Share on other sites
So it's either a case of a new feature mitigating a bug or a "bug in a bug"?

Sent from my MI 10 Lite 5G using Tapatalk

I don't think external tanks are exchanged in any module I own. Which module exhibit that behaviour?

I need to rearm twice to fill them. First to remove them, and then to load them again.
Link to post
Share on other sites
1 minute ago, Katj said:

I don't think external tanks are exchanged in any module I own. Which module exhibit that behaviour?

I need to rearm twice to fill them. First to remove them, and then to load them again.

 

Only need one re-arm process - Just EMERG JETT the empty tanks on the flight line then re-arm for some full ones. You would never swap drop tanks during a hot refuel, but that is where we are at.

 

The point I was trying to make above is, ED need to stop trying to be so clever and 'fully modelling the internal workings of the fuel system' when they just end up introducing bugs, which in this case results in the inability to have full drop tanks following a hot refuel (unless your internals are nearly empty, you punch off your old tanks and fit new ones etc etc).

Bottom line I park up and politely ask for a jet full of fuel including full drops - I don't care how, if you need to remove the old ones and fit new ones, over wing fuel them by hand (and take a 'Jet-A' bath apparently because you don't know how to regulate a refuel nozzle trigger. Over-wing re-fuelled jets for 15 years and never had that problem, but I digress..), or any other method.

 

  • Haha 1

Asus Maximus VIII Hero Alpha| i7-6700K @ 4.60GHz | nVidia GTX 1080ti Strix OC 11GB @ 2075MHz| 16GB G.Skill Trident Z RGB 3200Mhz DDR4 CL14 |

Samsung 950 PRO 512GB M.2 SSD | Corsair Force LE 480GB SSD | Windows 10 64-Bit | TM Warthog with FSSB R3 Lighting Base | VKB Gunfighter Pro + MCG | TM MFD's | Oculus Rift S | Jetseat FSE

 

[sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]

Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, VampireNZ said:

 

Only need one re-arm process - Just EMERG JETT the empty tanks on the flight line then re-arm for some full ones. You would never swap drop tanks during a hot refuel, but that is where we are at.

 

The point I was trying to make above is, ED need to stop trying to be so clever and 'fully modelling the internal workings of the fuel system' when they just end up introducing bugs, which in this case results in the inability to have full drop tanks following a hot refuel (unless your internals are nearly empty, you punch off your old tanks and fit new ones etc etc).

Bottom line I park up and politely ask for a jet full of fuel including full drops - I don't care how, if you need to remove the old ones and fit new ones, over wing fuel them by hand (and take a 'Jet-A' bath apparently because you don't know how to regulate a refuel nozzle trigger. Over-wing re-fuelled jets for 15 years and never had that problem, but I digress..), or any other method.

 

 

In our mission, every store is limited (including external tanks and even racks for weapons) - so jettisoning the eternal tanks when empty isn't an option for any of us, unless you are in danger of losing the aircraft (i.e. engagement/IFE).

 

With that being said, I can confirm that opening the AAR 'door' or extending the fuel probe (depending on aircraft) while on the ground, prior to rearm/refuel ground crew interaction, does indeed fill the external and internal tanks.

 

Tested with the Hornet, Tomcat, Viper and A10C (the latter was just for inclusion - in the mission, I never actually use externals on the A10C).

 

Landed with 10% to 50% internal fuel remaining, and each time, successfully had the internal and external tanks filled.

 

Better than removing them via ground crew, then asking them to put them back on the aircraft again (for me at least).

 

Cheers,

 

Ziptie

  • Like 1

i7 6700 @4ghz, 32GB HyperX Fury ddr4-2133 ram, GTX980, Oculus Rift CV1, 2x1TB SSD drives (one solely for DCS OpenBeta standalone) Thrustmaster Warthog HOTAS, Thrustmaster Cougar MFDs

 

Airframes: A10C, A10CII, F/A-18C, F-14B, F-16C, UH=1H, FC3. Modules: Combined Arms, Supercarrier. Terrains: Persian Gulf, Nevada NTTR, Syria

Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, VampireNZ said:

- I don't care how, if you need to remove the old ones and fit new ones, over wing fuel them by hand (and take a 'Jet-A' bath apparently because you don't know how to regulate a refuel nozzle trigger. Over-wing re-fuelled jets for 15 years and never had that problem, but I digress..), or any other method.

 

I love when someone taunt their years of working the jets. So since we went there, I have over 20 years on the F-16. It is not possible to over wing the 370 gallon fuel tanks from just the nose cap point. That was the point I was trying to make. The 370 gallon tank is sectioned off in three parts. The spill over tube which allows fuel from the nose to go to the aft section sits above the lowest point of the cap opening. So no matter how gingerly you operate the refueling nozzle, you will not fill the entire external tank via the nose cap. In order to accomplish an over the wing one must use all the points and fill each one individually. 
 

  • Like 2

Twitch Channel

 

[sIGPIC][/sIGPIC]

Virtual Thunderbirds, LLC | Sponsored by Thrustmaster

 

Z390 Aorus Xtreme, i9 9900k, G.SKILL TridentZ Series 32GB, 1080ti 11GB, Obutto R3Volution, Thrustmaster HOTAS Warthog, TPR, Cougar MFDs, FSSB R3L, JetSeat, Oculus Rift S, Buddy-Fox A-10C UFC, F/A-18C UFC, Tek Creations F-16 ICP

 

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...