BonerCat Posted January 22, 2021 Share Posted January 22, 2021 The AIM-120 and AIM-7 got their new guidance, improving energy conversation and extending their effective range a -lot- Should we expect similar updates for the Phoenix sometime soon? It would be really nice to not have a missile loose a fourth of it's speed in long TWS shots because it has to pitch down some 30ish degrees to hit the target some 20nm form the target Modules: F-14, F-15C, F-16C, F/A-18C, M-2000C, A-10C, A-10C II, AV-8B N/A, MiG-29, Su-33, MiG-21 Bis, F-5E, P-51D, Ka-50, Mi-8, Sa 342, UH-1H, Combined Arms Maps and others: Persian Gulf, Syria, Normandy, WWII Assets, NS 430 + Mi-8 NS 430 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
captain_dalan Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 6 hours ago, BonerCat said: The AIM-120 and AIM-7 got their new guidance, improving energy conversation and extending their effective range a -lot- Should we expect similar updates for the Phoenix sometime soon? It would be really nice to not have a missile loose a fourth of it's speed in long TWS shots because it has to pitch down some 30ish degrees to hit the target some 20nm form the target That's a question probably best aimed at ED, as they are the ones that control missile behavior now. Even on 3rd party ordnance. Modules: FC3, Mirage 2000C, Harrier AV-8B NA, F-5, AJS-37 Viggen, F-14B, F-14A, Combined Arms, F/A-18C, F-16C, MiG-19P, F-86, MiG-15, FW-190A, Spitfire Mk IX, UH-1 Huey, Su-25, P-51PD, Caucasus map, Nevada map, Persian Gulf map, Marianas map, Syria Map, Super Carrier, Sinai map, Mosquito, P-51, AH-64 Apache Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dundun92 Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 15 hours ago, captain_dalan said: That's a question probably best aimed at ED, as they are the ones that control missile behavior now. Even on 3rd party ordnance. on the specific loft issue, it appears that the AIM-54 isnt using the new loft code that the AMRAAM/SD-10/Sparrow does. The new loft code on those missiles smoothly transitions unlike on the old loft that the AIM054 uses. As for why the AIM-54 isnt using it, I have no clue. 3 Eagle Enthusiast, Fresco Fan. Patiently waiting for the F-15E. Clicky F-15C when? HP Z400 Workstation Intel Xeon W3680 (i7-980X) OC'd to 4.0 GHz, EVGA GTX 1060 6GB SSC Gaming, 24 GB DDR3 RAM, 500GB Crucial MX500 SSD. Thrustmaster T16000M FCS HOTAS, DIY opentrack head-tracking. I upload DCS videos here https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC0-7L3Z5nJ-QUX5M7Dh1pGg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sideburns Posted January 23, 2021 Share Posted January 23, 2021 It would be nice to see, atm the Aim54 can lose 400-700 knots in the correction turn and a lesser amount in go active. The transitions are very jerky. 1 Ryzen 5800x@5Ghz | 96gb DDR4 3200Mhz | Asus Rx6800xt TUF OC | 500Gb OS SSD + 1TB Gaming SSD | Asus VG27AQ | Trackhat clip | VPC WarBRD base | Thrustmaster stick and throttle (Deltasim minijoystick mod). F14 | F16 | AJS37 | F5 | Av8b | FC3 | Mig21 | FW190D9 | Huey Been playing DCS from Flanker 2.0 to present Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
captain_dalan Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 8 hours ago, dundun92 said: on the specific loft issue, it appears that the AIM-54 isnt using the new loft code that the AMRAAM/SD-10/Sparrow does. The new loft code on those missiles smoothly transitions unlike on the old loft that the AIM054 uses. As for why the AIM-54 isnt using it, I have no clue. Weren't ED in complete control of weapon systems now? Modules: FC3, Mirage 2000C, Harrier AV-8B NA, F-5, AJS-37 Viggen, F-14B, F-14A, Combined Arms, F/A-18C, F-16C, MiG-19P, F-86, MiG-15, FW-190A, Spitfire Mk IX, UH-1 Huey, Su-25, P-51PD, Caucasus map, Nevada map, Persian Gulf map, Marianas map, Syria Map, Super Carrier, Sinai map, Mosquito, P-51, AH-64 Apache Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dundun92 Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 1 hour ago, captain_dalan said: Weren't ED in complete control of weapon systems now? afaik not yet, but its planned Eagle Enthusiast, Fresco Fan. Patiently waiting for the F-15E. Clicky F-15C when? HP Z400 Workstation Intel Xeon W3680 (i7-980X) OC'd to 4.0 GHz, EVGA GTX 1060 6GB SSC Gaming, 24 GB DDR3 RAM, 500GB Crucial MX500 SSD. Thrustmaster T16000M FCS HOTAS, DIY opentrack head-tracking. I upload DCS videos here https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC0-7L3Z5nJ-QUX5M7Dh1pGg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katsu Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 I have already posted about this, but in several cases that I launch the missile (tws mode, keeping the target illuminated on the radar throughout the course) Phoenix does not even LOFT, I believe that this behavior should not be correct, I hope that Heatblur together with ED take a look at Phoenix. https://streamable.com/l75452 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naquaii Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 4 hours ago, Katsu said: I have already posted about this, but in several cases that I launch the missile (tws mode, keeping the target illuminated on the radar throughout the course) Phoenix does not even LOFT, I believe that this behavior should not be correct, I hope that Heatblur together with ED take a look at Phoenix. https://streamable.com/l75452 In that video you're launching at 26nm, that's not a long range shot for an AIM-54, that's probably why it's not lofting. 26nm at a closing target is short to medium range for a Phoenix. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katsu Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 (edited) 2 hours ago, Naquaii said: In that video you're launching at 26nm, that's not a long range shot for an AIM-54, that's probably why it's not lofting. 26nm at a closing target is short to medium range for a Phoenix. Thank you for your Reply Naquali. I really remember before the AIM-54 just made trajectories without LOFT over much shorter distances (below 15nm), I really don't have a technical material to support what would be the correct distance and the type of trajectory but looking around I found a video where a shot from Phoenix is made at 22 miles (can be heard by radio communication) and the missile seems to make a trajectory in LOFT to the target, I will leave the video below in the correct time if it can help in any way in the research , I know it’s not an easy job and you’re guys are doing your best. Edited January 24, 2021 by Katsu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naquaii Posted January 24, 2021 Share Posted January 24, 2021 Thanks! The problem is that it's not purely based on range but rather estimated range to target impact. In the situation in your linked tacview replay you shot at a closing target meaning that the calculated impact point would be much closer. That means that even if that video say it's lofting at 22nm that could be against a beaming target or a target running away which would mean an impact point further away and thus maybe a loft. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BonerCat Posted January 26, 2021 Author Share Posted January 26, 2021 (edited) This should picture what i had in mind better I did a quick test firing an AIM-54A Mk60 from angels 40 mach 1, on a hot AI Tu-95 85 miles away, and this was the result The AWG-9 was operated by jester. in TWS-A, no other settings changed. It illuminated the target all the way until impact. The missile lofted high, like it's suppose to, but it waited with pulling down to the target for a long time, and had to nose down aggresively (3 to 4g for a few seconds) loosing 1 mach of speed (mach 4 to mach 3) There is a 2nd shot in the tacview (not recorded on the vid above), where the missile pulls 11 G on a 45 mile shot, again roughly 20nm from the target I find it hard to belive that a missile is suppose to pull such a manouver so far from the target and loose a fourth of it's speed The Tu-95's were just set to go to a waypoint somwhere around sukhumi, with default difficulty and settings. Tacview was played at 5x speed I've attached the recorded tacview file Tacview-20210119-184547-DCS-F-14 Testing.zip.acmi Edited January 26, 2021 by BonerCat Adding more info Modules: F-14, F-15C, F-16C, F/A-18C, M-2000C, A-10C, A-10C II, AV-8B N/A, MiG-29, Su-33, MiG-21 Bis, F-5E, P-51D, Ka-50, Mi-8, Sa 342, UH-1H, Combined Arms Maps and others: Persian Gulf, Syria, Normandy, WWII Assets, NS 430 + Mi-8 NS 430 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Naquaii Posted January 26, 2021 Share Posted January 26, 2021 That is unfortunately not something we can control, that's on EDs side of things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BonerCat Posted January 26, 2021 Author Share Posted January 26, 2021 21 minutes ago, Naquaii said: That is unfortunately not something we can control, that's on EDs side of things. Thanks, i'll bring it up in another forums section Keep up the great work on the 14 guys! Modules: F-14, F-15C, F-16C, F/A-18C, M-2000C, A-10C, A-10C II, AV-8B N/A, MiG-29, Su-33, MiG-21 Bis, F-5E, P-51D, Ka-50, Mi-8, Sa 342, UH-1H, Combined Arms Maps and others: Persian Gulf, Syria, Normandy, WWII Assets, NS 430 + Mi-8 NS 430 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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