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Always try to keep my system clean, uncluttered and up to date..,

 

but everything moves on, including the forms of attack


Win 10 seems better protected than previous - but wondered what users use?

 

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I don't run anything, either, beyond only the most rudimentary firewalling, etc. 99.9% of infections are self inflicted, messing around on sites you shouldn't be on, clicking on stuff you shouldn't click on, or installing obvious crap you shouldn't install.

 

Once in a great while I'll install something to verify I'm still clean, then remove it and move on. I haven't had anything in years, and the last time I *did* get infected, it was after clicking on something that I LITERALLY thought to myself ''I shouldn't click on this'' and then did it anyway.

 

The internet is a dangerous place for the unwary or foolish, but a little common sense goes a loooooong way.

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The troll formerly known as Zhukov

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Thanks all, and agreed...👍

 

I’ve had AVG free for years, and now with Win 10.
Occasionally resorted to Malwarebytes freeware where I’ve tried to download a free utility app and you get all the associated spamware 

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Can just agree to whats in the thread already: anti-virus software really is a plague since its 99% false-positive anyways - just check all the "virus in DCS update" threads. They also give a false impression of being safe and entice to click on every link you see since "im safe YOLO!!!!". AV software needs to know a virus before it can detect it, which takes time. And malware designers are busy folks, not much old stuff out there in the wild.

 

Win 10 defender really is good enough + use your brain and common sense. Most important is keeping regular (at best several) backups of what is important to you on a physically separate disk you only plug in for backup and keeping Win up to date all the time (immediately when an update is released, a week later does not help much 😉 )

.

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Win10 Defender and multiple Backups in various cloud services and HDD

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1 minute ago, BitMaster said:

multiple Backups in various cloud services and HDD

This. That way, worse comes to worse, you always have the nuclear option and can always start over. Multiple copies (I have valuables on my PC, on a portable drive, and in the cloud) means you can NEVER lose ''everything''.

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The troll formerly known as Zhukov

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Windows 10 comes with Windows Defender, and it's a pretty decent AV on its own, as is the built-in Firewall.

 

Today it's more about personal preferences, IMO.

I prefer using for myself something that I've known in the past as legit AV and Firewall.

Since a few years back I settled with Kaspersky AV, TinyWall (Free Firewall), and a monthly cleaning also with Malware-Bytes and/or SuperAntiSpyware. 

 

PCMag does indepth reviews and even comparos of AV for many years now, I'd suggest a reading later:
https://www.pcmag.com/picks/the-best-free-antivirus-protection
https://www.pcmag.com/picks/the-best-antivirus-protection
 


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"We heard you don't like root kits so we got you to download this root kit to avoid downloading root kits."

Windows Defender is as far as I'm willing to go.

 

I only use Windows for games - personal life/data is on Linux so my use case is not typical.


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  • 2 weeks later...

TotalAV.

 

Windows 10 is a joke when it comes to "protection", any botmaker knows first thing how to go through it like a hot needle through butter.

 

My system have been hacked several times while using this O.S, so you're far better off disabling everything for the stake of your memory management and install a proper and optimized antivirus package, at least there is a proper threat update coming with them, it's their job, not that of Microsoft.


Edited by Thinder

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On 1/18/2021 at 1:55 PM, zhukov032186 said:

I don't run anything, either, beyond only the most rudimentary firewalling, etc. 99.9% of infections are self inflicted, messing around on sites you shouldn't be on, clicking on stuff you shouldn't click on, or installing obvious crap you shouldn't install.

 

Once in a great while I'll install something to verify I'm still clean, then remove it and move on. I haven't had anything in years, and the last time I *did* get infected, it was after clicking on something that I LITERALLY thought to myself ''I shouldn't click on this'' and then did it anyway.

 

The internet is a dangerous place for the unwary or foolish, but a little common sense goes a loooooong way.

 

QFT

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On 1/18/2021 at 6:44 AM, Rainer_B. said:

The Onboard Windows Defender and a don't click on anything attitude.


same 👍

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2 hours ago, Thinder said:

TotalAV.

 

Windows 10 is a joke when it comes to "protection", any botmaker knows first thing how to go through it like a hot needle through butter.

 

My system have been hacked several times while using this O.S, so you're far better off disabling everything for the stake of your memory management and install a proper and optimized antivirus package, at least there is a proper threat update coming with them, it's their job, not that of Microsoft.

 

 

Thinder,

 

thing is, you won't know what will hit you next and which AV will be the right choice to protect you. You only know AFTER it has happened.

 

My job is to protect networks and the best way to do that is block everything folllowed by a white list which contains a finite listing of sites which are allowed and for email, the best approach is multiple layers of mail scanners from different vendors, I like 3+ layers tbh. One at the MX-Hoster, one in the UTM Firewall and another one on the mail server followed by a 4th one on the client's machine. Avira and Kaspersky are the ones I choose for professional circumstances and they haven't let me or a client down in 2 decades. I have seen/ been informed about infections on partner sites of my customers and I have to say, some had bad luck, some where too easy with Threat Management and some others didnt really care until it hit them hard and locked their data, big companies btw. When you have a muliple 10k revenue each day one should not hesitate to throw 25k$ at that problem cause it will cost you more if you take the hit. This is still not 100% safe but it is max what you can do with a REASONABLE amount of money and effort, coupled with multiple backups ( Ransomware-safe to the maximum extend one can forsee ). 

 

For a private person....well, most lack the knowlwedge, then the money it takes to deploy UTM Firewalls, also accepting the downsides of such a setup, very very user unfriendly for a private person's belonging, constant monitoring and adjusting, reading logs and what not else. Making decisions in any safety regard will take months and not minutes ( going through that right now with a major US company, OMG...how complicated it can be, you wouldnt believe ). It is WAY above a private persons head to do all this.

 

Be aware of what you do ( biggest hurdle ! ), have M U L T I P L E  BACKUPs on systems that are OFFLINE ( ext. HDD, disconnected Cloud Services ) to fight ransomware attacks, deploy a decent scanner and refrain from sites you kbnow you shouldnt be at. If you need to visit such sites, do it in a "throw away" VMware, Vbox, Hyper-V...anyone will allow you to do that.

Here again, the knowlwedge how to do things if you need to is the biggest gap from what's needed and what can you do/understand.

 

Be aware, no scanner can usually catch zero day attacks, that's when you need one of those many backups and time.

 

BTW, MS Defender has been tested by many many sites and I cant recall any of them saying it is a bad scanner in the recent years. Actually, in my understanding, it is quite good and serves great. Either one works but it remains a gamble to some extend. A gap you can never close.

 

If you have been infected and hacked multiple times in the recent years, rethink your strategy. Something was wrong.

 

 

One more thing. Many sales people in the security business are black painters. The try to make money with your fear. It is hard to distinguish between bloated fear and real threat.

They try to sell you everything and make you feel safe. The underline is on "feel". It is not neccessarily real what you feel.

 

A very complicated matter indeed.

 

 

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2 hours ago, BitMaster said:

 

One more thing. Many sales people in the security business are black painters. The try to make money with your fear. It is hard to distinguish between bloated fear and real threat.

They try to sell you everything and make you feel safe. The underline is on "feel". It is not neccessarily real what you feel.

 

A very complicated matter indeed.

 

 

 

You want me to trust more a multi-billion trust who is more concerned about controlling how I use a product I pay for than making it better? One of the most advanced guys I worked with, head of my 3D dpt keep telling us, "Windows is designed to screw you", too true, and it's getting worse at every update.

 

The same can be said about Microsoft than any croock trying to sell "protection", at least, among small, companies, some of them depends on the quality of their work, something Microsoft forgot long ago, and one more thing, the reason I gave up on trusting them is precisely because when it comes to serious threat, their gizmos doesn't work.


Edited by Thinder
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Oh well, we seem to have different approaches to trust, expense and expectations.

 

Don't think Total AV, Avira, Norton, any AV, is not interested in making the most money out of your fear.

 

At least, in this regard, MS offers something for free, totally integrated, not trying to sell you more modules and generating Popups trying to sell.

 

Dealing with fear does pay, ask any insurance guy after 2 beers...

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5 hours ago, Thinder said:

Windows 10 is a joke when it comes to "protection", any botmaker knows first thing how to go through it like a hot needle through butter.

  As mentioned previously, most, nearly all, infections require a certain amount of ''help'' from the victim's side. That's just a reality. Nobody's hamfistedly ''hacking'' into anything, they're being LET IN.

 

5 hours ago, Thinder said:

My system have been hacked several times while using this O.S, so you're far better off disabling everything for the stake of your memory management and install a proper and optimized antivirus package, at least there is a proper threat update coming with them, it's their job, not that of Microsoft.

  OR you could change your browsing habits and clicking on popups, installing risky ''free software'', clicking on links you receive in your email, etc etc etc. Again, virtually all ''hacks'' require your tacit assistance. If you're ''getting hacked all the time'' the problem is definitely, 100% *YOU*. Change your habits and you'll quit having that problem, AV or no AV, Windows, Linux, or Etch-A-Sketch. *YOU* are your best ''anti-virus'' and your worst ''security risk''.

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3 hours ago, zhukov032186 said:

  As mentioned previously, most, nearly all, infections require a certain amount of ''help'' from the victim's side. That's just a reality. Nobody's hamfistedly ''hacking'' into anything, they're being LET IN.

 

  OR you could change your browsing habits and clicking on popups, installing risky ''free software'', clicking on links you receive in your email, etc etc etc. Again, virtually all ''hacks'' require your tacit assistance. If you're ''getting hacked all the time'' the problem is definitely, 100% *YOU*. Change your habits and you'll quit having that problem, AV or no AV, Windows, Linux, or Etch-A-Sketch. *YOU* are your best ''anti-virus'' and your worst ''security risk''.

 

You could READ before replying with a lecture... Which part of hacking didn't you comprehend?

 

It's not a virus, it was a hack starting with a security alert from Yahoo (several over the years actually), thousand of account have been hacked, nothing to do with people browsing habits but the complete lack of effisiency of Windows 10 "protection".

 

That's reality for you, you can try to do their promotional work for them, it won't make Microsoft better, the last time they released a GOOD update was with Windows 95, last time they released a good O.S was Win Professional.

 

Since they've been concerned about adding home wifes and secretaries multimedia applications completely useless to professionals or players and controlling the way everyone, includinh pros, uses their O.S.

 

If you want to use Windows 10 Pro efficiently for the 3D indutry you have to spend hours getting their little gizmos to stop messing with your memory management, if they had sp[ent half this time doing a proper firewall and antivirus job, we would know, just saying.

 

The problem is 100% with geezers like you who give them undue credit and don't learn anytrhing from professionals who had to use Windows for a living, I'll stick with Alan Marques opinion, he transitioned the movie and gaming industry from Silicon Valley £35.000/seat licence to the PC platform, opened several 3D studios and help CINETIX develop 3 DS Max from release 4, since we were building our own PCs, I think we know very well the true value of Windows O.S and it's not the Disneylandish picture you guys are painting.

 

As for the guilt culture, sorry, but I don't subscribe....


Edited by Thinder

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Geezer? I'm 34 and grew up with computers. Windows 95 is your idea of a ''good OS''? Literally their crappiest and most unstable in their entire history? Ok, well, that pretty much places you out lol

 

And again, virtually every ''hack'' requires user input, regardless of what you want to call it. There is no guy sitting in front of a wall of monitors while green Matrix ''coding'' rains down in front of him as he deftly evades ''cyber security''.

 

It's almost ALWAYS self inflicted. The Israelis destroyed Iranian centrifuges with a virus, despite them being physically isolated from external networks. How? By spear phishing idiots on the outside who then conveniently carried the virus in on a USB stick.

 

If it makes you feel better imagining Neo and Cypher ''jacking into your system'', great. But that's almost never how it happens lol

 

Oh, ''somebody famous said it so it must be true'' @@


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2 hours ago, zhukov032186 said:

Geezer? I'm 34 and grew up with computers. Windows 95 is your idea of a ''good OS''? Literally their crappiest and most unstable in their entire history? Ok, well, that pretty much places you out lol

 

And again, virtually every ''hack'' requires user input, regardless of what you want to call it. There is no guy sitting in front of a wall of monitors while green Matrix ''coding'' rains down in front of him as he deftly evades ''cyber security''.

 

It's almost ALWAYS self inflicted. The Israelis destroyed Iranian centrifuges with a virus, despite them being physically isolated from external networks. How? By spear phishing idiots on the outside who then conveniently carried the virus in on a USB stick.

 

If it makes you feel better imagining Neo and Cypher ''jacking into your system'', great. But that's almost never how it happens lol

 

Oh, ''somebody famous said it so it must be true'' @@

 

 

Let me guess, you were already building your P.C when 95 update made it stable and are 34 today?  Enuff said.

 

Stop talking about what you don't know, hackers doesn't need any help from users, if banks, browsers and internet providers can be hacked, a simple home user has little chance to do anything about it with even the most conservative use and Windows Defender doesn't stop them doing just that.

 

FACT: The more convoluted and complex Windows became, the less user friendly for the professionals and gamers, if there are access to low-level settings such as registry editor in Windows 10 Pro and wasn't with early Home edition it is because Microsoft didn't bother making it good themselves, reason why there are so many alternatives ways to counter Microsoft freak control compulsions.

 

The Israelis blah... Politics has nothing to do with email providers being hacked and having to publish security alert to their users, money does, you're the one living in kukuland here, starting with pretending to know about Windows 95 when you were 8 years old, funy at the time I was two years from building my first P.C.

 

I'm done with geezers like you, I saw entire 3D depatments having to waste time setting O.S because of bad memory management and crapy updates, having to plan which machine to update every 6 month because they don't have the time to get this cr@p going when the machines are never turned off, either being used for 3D or or network-rendering.

 

Professionals like gamers don't need that, the only reason why we use Windows is because it is the cheapest and most flexible available platform but if one other existed, Microsoft would be dead by today, they sure made sure there is none of it in the market.

 

We need conttrolable, stable O.S that doesn't do what it wants when Microsoft decides it has to, and Microsoft Windows 10 isn't that.

 

 

 

 


Edited by Thinder

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1 minute ago, Thinder said:

Stop talking about what you don't know, hackers doesn't need any help from users, if banks, browsers and internet providers can be hacked, a simple home user has little chance to do anything about it with even the most conservative use and Windows Defender doesn't stop them doing just that.

 

Your big company examples all have hundreds or thousands of employees. It only takes one guy being a moron to compromise the whole system. As a result, no matter their security they will 100% get ''hacked'' from time to time, it's unavoidable.

 

But what do I knw? You're probably right, you got ''attacked'' by a totally a 1337 cyberpunk hacker, almost definitely dressed in black. You never stood a chance and in no way contributed to the situation.

 

 

 

For the record, I was last infected probably about 12 years ago? Something like that, OS def XP at the time. I could actually see my PC bogging down as whatever it was did its thing. Cleared up with MalwareBytes.

 

Infection route : me clicking a suspicious pop up.

 

Would AV have prevented it? Possibly, even better is not clicking suspicious pop ups. I have never run AV even after that. Must be my mad bullet dodging skills protecting me in the Matrix.

 

AV exist for the same reason they hang signs at the zoo saying ''do not climb fence'' : some people just need the obvious pointed out to them.

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1 hour ago, zhukov032186 said:

 

Your big company examples all have hundreds or thousands of employees. It only takes one guy being a moron to compromise the whole system. As a result, no matter their security they will 100% get ''hacked'' from time to time, it's unavoidable.

 

But what do I knw? You're probably right, you got ''attacked'' by a totally a 1337 cyberpunk hacker, almost definitely dressed in black. You never stood a chance and in no way contributed to the situation.

 

 

 

For the record, I was last infected probably about 12 years ago? Something like that, OS def XP at the time. I could actually see my PC bogging down as whatever it was did its thing. Cleared up with MalwareBytes.

 

Infection route : me clicking a suspicious pop up.

 

Would AV have prevented it? Possibly, even better is not clicking suspicious pop ups. I have never run AV even after that. Must be my mad bullet dodging skills protecting me in the Matrix.

 

AV exist for the same reason they hang signs at the zoo saying ''do not climb fence'' : some people just need the obvious pointed out to them.

 

Yeah sure, when it's not the user it's one isolated moron....

 

How do you want people to take you seriously? According to you, people in charge of the security at Yahoo knows less than you do about it, since you can't even figure the difference bewteen a virus infection and hacking into people email through their providers, I have doubts about you being a genius at 8 years old and able to tell us how crapy Win 95 was.

 

For the record I did all my  ECDL training on Windows 95 and saw the update and its effects, reason why I mentioned it as being the best Microsoft had ever released because it worked for us, made the O.S stable and since it was simple and didn't try to make our coffee and tell us what to do, it was a pleasure to work with once updated.

 

Between what Microsoft think we need and what we as gamers or professional need, there is a much of a gap as between hearth and the asteroid belt, if it wasn't the case, internet service providers wouldn't get hacked in the first place and the internet wouldn't be full of people proposing ways to go around Microsoft Windows 10 issues with optimisation for gaming.

 

I saw crappy as O.S but this one takes the myckey, so people can trust Windows Defender all they want, I wouldn't advise them to disable it, but pretending it does a better job at protecting your PC than a good dedicated Antivirus package is just not true.


Edited by Thinder
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5 hours ago, Thinder said:

pretending it does a better job at protecting your PC than a good dedicated Antivirus package is just not true.

 

 

  That's not what anybody said. What has been said (most vocally by me) is good browsing habits and common sense work EVEN BETTER.

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6 hours ago, zhukov032186 said:

 

  That's not what anybody said. What has been said (most vocally by me) is good browsing habits and common sense work EVEN BETTER.

 

Nothing to do with hacking, hackers doesn't need help.

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M-2000C. F/A-18C Hornet. F-15C. MiG-29 "Fulcrum". 

Avatar: Escadron de Chasse 3/3 Ardennes.

 

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