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TrackIR - Mmm...


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Okay - great example of a product designed in the early 2000s. Who the hell has a monitor bezel this thick? The sensor unit won’t sit on top properly. Bit rubbish really.

 

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Edited by C3PO

Now: Water-cooled Ryzen 5800X + 32GB DDR 4 3200 RAM + EVGA 3090 FTW3 Ultra 24 GB + Reverb G2 + Add-on PCI-e 3.1 card + 2x1TB Corsair M.2 4900/4200 + TM HOTAS Warthog + TM TPR Pendular Rudder  'Engaged Defensive' YouTube Channel

Modules: F/A-18C / AV-8B / F-16 / F-15E / F-4E (when it lands) / Persian Gulf / Syria / Nevada / Sinai / South Atlantic

Backup: Water-cooled i7 6700K @ 4.5GHz + 32GB DDR4 3200MHz + GTX 1080 8GB + 1TB M.2 1k drive & 250GB SSD drive 500MBps 4K 40" monitor + TrackIR 5

 

 

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FIXED IT!

 

Idiot User error, sorry 😣 


Edited by C3PO

Now: Water-cooled Ryzen 5800X + 32GB DDR 4 3200 RAM + EVGA 3090 FTW3 Ultra 24 GB + Reverb G2 + Add-on PCI-e 3.1 card + 2x1TB Corsair M.2 4900/4200 + TM HOTAS Warthog + TM TPR Pendular Rudder  'Engaged Defensive' YouTube Channel

Modules: F/A-18C / AV-8B / F-16 / F-15E / F-4E (when it lands) / Persian Gulf / Syria / Nevada / Sinai / South Atlantic

Backup: Water-cooled i7 6700K @ 4.5GHz + 32GB DDR4 3200MHz + GTX 1080 8GB + 1TB M.2 1k drive & 250GB SSD drive 500MBps 4K 40" monitor + TrackIR 5

 

 

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HOLY CRA9!!!

 

TrackIR is AMAZING! No more hat switch moves ❤️😎😎

Now: Water-cooled Ryzen 5800X + 32GB DDR 4 3200 RAM + EVGA 3090 FTW3 Ultra 24 GB + Reverb G2 + Add-on PCI-e 3.1 card + 2x1TB Corsair M.2 4900/4200 + TM HOTAS Warthog + TM TPR Pendular Rudder  'Engaged Defensive' YouTube Channel

Modules: F/A-18C / AV-8B / F-16 / F-15E / F-4E (when it lands) / Persian Gulf / Syria / Nevada / Sinai / South Atlantic

Backup: Water-cooled i7 6700K @ 4.5GHz + 32GB DDR4 3200MHz + GTX 1080 8GB + 1TB M.2 1k drive & 250GB SSD drive 500MBps 4K 40" monitor + TrackIR 5

 

 

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For any others wondering, the clip is adjustable in multiple ways and I've never had issues getting it to fit newer monitors, as I'm sure OP has found out.

Virpil WarBRD | Thrustmaster Hornet Grip | Foxx Mount | Thrustmaster TWCS Throttle | Logitech G Throttle Quadrant | VKB T-Rudder IV | TrackIR 5

 

 

AMD Ryzen 5 3600 | Nvidia GTX 1060 6GB | 32GB DDR4 3200 | SSD

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Track IR was a game changer for me. As you use it more and more, don't be afraid to make adjustments to the curves etc. I have mine set up where I have about 7-8 deg of head movement in both directions in roll, pitch, and yaw before the screen picture moves. This keeps the screen steady around the center even w/ slight head movement. Then I have fairly steep angles. I can easily look straight backwards in yaw for example. I also find it's a good idea to check for proper pitch travel every time I put the sensor on. Seems I don't get my hat on at exactly the correct angle every time, and that is even more of a problem w/ the sensor on my headphone.

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early 2000s so I guess the price has drop... oh wait!!

i5 8400 | 32 Gb RAM | RTX 2080Ti | Virpil Mongoose T-50 base w/ Warthog & Hornet sticks | Warthog throttle | Cougar throttle USB | DIY Collective | Virpil desk mount | VKB T-Rudder Mk IV | Oculus Rift S | Buddy-Fox A-10 UFC | 3x TM MFDs | 2x bass shakers pedal plate| SIMple SIMpit chair | WinWing TakeOff panel | PointCTRL v2 | Andre JetSeat | Winwing Hornet UFC | Winwing Viper ICP

FC3 - Warthog - F-5E - Harrier - NTTR - Hornet - Tomcat - Huey - Viper - C-101 - PG - Hip - SuperCarrier - Syria - Warthog II - Hind - South Atlantic - Sinai - Strike Eagle

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I'd not used mine for years before FS2020 was released with no VR support. Quite enjoyed the nostalgia, and definitely has advantages over VR when using a second monitor or tablet. Not to mention performance, although that's less of an issue in DCS.

 

Personally I hated any deadzone and got rid of them completely. To me it always felt much more natural for every head movement to be conveyed on-screen.

Asus Z690 Hero | 12900K | 64GB G.Skill 6000 | 4090FE | Reverb G2 | VPC MongoosT-50CM2 + TM Grips  | Winwing Orion2 Throttle | MFG Crosswind Pedals

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I love the maxed out image quality and stable vsync frame rates of the flat panel vs VR, but after using 1:1 head tracking with stereo vision, TrackIR doesn't cut it for dogfighting, helo flying, formation flying, or carrier landings any more.

 

One problem I have always had on a flat panel is the canopy frames. Somehow, AI always gets on the frame and disappears during the time I can't see him. TrackIR makes it easy to shift your view, but I still frequently lost track of contacts that crossed the canopy frame. Whereas stereo vision makes it much easier to see around or "through" the canopy frame with little or no head movement.

 

Even after years of flying with TrackIR, I could get disoriented. I might not be sure which way I was really looking with a clear bubble canopy and amplified head movements, especially at the fringes of the TrackIR's tracking ability. With VR, the 1:1 head movement guarantees I know exactly what my view angle is relative to my aircraft's nose, which is a good thing.

 

The one strong advantage of TrackIR's amplified head movement is checking your six. Aside from the aforementioned disorientation issues, you can quickly and easily look behind you, which is really useful when trying to shake someone off your tail in an aircraft that doesn't have mirrors. But I don't have any issues with physically turning my body/shoulder/head to look behind me in VR despite being over 50 years old, so I enjoy the realism in having to move so much in a close-in dogfight. Of course, pulling high-g's in the game doesn't impair my head/body mobility, so it isn't that much harder than using TrackIR's amplified head movements. But after a long series of desperate rolling scissors with enemies near my six, I can be pretty tired and maybe even my neck is a little sore.

 

When I had the Rift CV1, the resolution in VR was so poor that I spent about 50/50 time between TrackIR/flat panel and VR. I bought the Rift S as soon as it was available and that was a huge step up. I flew about 80% VR, 20% TrackIR/flat panel. Now that I have a G2, resolution almost isn't an issue, just the lower quality settings I have to use to struggle to try to keep 45 fps, so I am flying nearly 100% VR.

 

But I am not giving up my TrackIR. I have enjoyed three generations of TrackIR: TIR3 with vector, TIR4, and TIR5. My only real complaints after years of use are:

1. Insane price for what you get (a Rift 2 or Quest 2 isn't that much more expensive and is a much better choice if your PC is strong enough for VR).

2. Relatively poor quality of the Track Clip Pro. You can find countless posts about how delicate it is with both the plastic construction and wiring causing various problems.

3. Over the years, I have had some issues with light sources and reflections blinding the sensor, particularly at certain times during the day when bright sunlight would come in through windows and reflect off white walls or glossy posters and confuse the sensor. While using the LED Track Clip Pro or a 3rd party equivalent minimizes that problem, I still had issues in on really bright sunny days. So much so, that I put cardboard behind the blinds in the offending window to block out the sun (inadvertently lowering my electric bill due to air conditioning).

 

I would presume that if you have the money to have a PC that can handle VR, you would pretty much have the money to buy hardware as needed/wanted. But for someone new to flight sims and on a budget, I would prioritize hardware purchases as follows:

1. Stick.

2. Throttle (of course a complete HOTAS is the most cost effective way to get both a stick and throttle if you have enough money to do so).

3. TrackIR.

4. Rudder pedals.

5. MFDs and/or aux control panels.

 

You would thing with all the competition from VR, Natural Point would lower the cost of TrackIR to try to grab a larger market share. But the fact that they haven't tells me they are still selling decent enough numbers to keep the price where it has been, which is effectively a lower price when you account for inflation.

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2 hours ago, streakeagle said:

You would thing with all the competition from VR, Natural Point would lower the cost of TrackIR to try to grab a larger market share. But the fact that they haven't tells me they are still selling decent enough numbers to keep the price where it has been, which is effectively a lower price when you account for inflation.

VR is only being used by a constant 11-12% of flight sim players over the last 3 years and isn’t really growing, according to the Navigraph Survey. So it’s not much competition. 

i9-13900K @ 6.2GHz oc | ASUS ROG MAXIMUS Z790 HERO | 64GB DDR5 5600MHz | iCUE H150i Liquid CPU Cooler | 24GB GeForce RTX 4090 | Windows 11 Home | 2TB Samsung 980 PRO NVMe | Corsair RM1000x | LG 48GQ900-B 4K OLED Monitor | CH Fighterstick | Ch Pro Throttle | CH Pro Pedals | TrackIR 5

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What percentage of flight sim players use TrackIR? What percentage use some third party alternative to TrackIR? What percentage have have any form of head tracking and just use a HOTAS or keyboard/mouse?

 

To go from 0% to 12% of the flight sim market is a big chunk. Most of those probably used TrackIR previously. So, say TrackIR was in use by about 30% of the market, which is probably a reasonable number, 12 of 30 is the same as losing 40% of your long-term customer base. 

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2 hours ago, streakeagle said:

To go from 0% to 12% of the flight sim market is a big chunk. 

Flight sims have not really been a big market... and the rate has remained at a constant 11-12% from 2018-2020 ie it’s not growing. VR is basically stalled in the gaming market. Now it will be interesting to see what effect MSFS has because it represents a giant growth in the flight sim genre. It’s the 4th top selling PC game right now. But TrackIR has nothing to worry about. 

2 hours ago, streakeagle said:

What percentage of flight sim players use TrackIR? What percentage use some third party alternative to TrackIR? What percentage have have any form of head tracking and just use a HOTAS or keyboard/mouse? 

My guess would be a very high % of players in combat flight sims use head tracking. Since the game is nearly unplayable without it. Plus you can DIY it for free. 
 

The Navigraph survey is 80% civ sim players who I suspect don’t need head tracking as much, (just guessing from videos) perhaps they don’t use VR much either. Navigraph doesn’t have stats for head tracking. 


Edited by SharpeXB

i9-13900K @ 6.2GHz oc | ASUS ROG MAXIMUS Z790 HERO | 64GB DDR5 5600MHz | iCUE H150i Liquid CPU Cooler | 24GB GeForce RTX 4090 | Windows 11 Home | 2TB Samsung 980 PRO NVMe | Corsair RM1000x | LG 48GQ900-B 4K OLED Monitor | CH Fighterstick | Ch Pro Throttle | CH Pro Pedals | TrackIR 5

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