F-16 or Syria Map

[rfxcasey]

I'm debating between the Syria map and the F-16. I currently own F/A-18, F-14, Super Carrier, Persian Gulf, FC3 and Blackshark. Played a lot of Falcon back in the day and even some BMS Falcon in more recent years so I'm fairly familiar with the Viper. The new Syria map does look amazing though, it's just that Falcons in Syria is like bread and butter. I really don't wanna cough up the money for both right now, I haven't even touched the Tomcat yet, I'm just debating on which to get. Hornets in Syria could work, I did however just get an Oculus Quest 2 and I'm thinking the bubble canopy would be amazing. One leaning I have, I feel the Syria map would probably seem like a more complete product though I'm not exactly sure what the current state of the falcon is. It would have been nice if DCS did a package deal like they did for Person Gulf and the Hornet but as I understand it is Syria kind of 3rd party? Could probably get away with just Caucuses and Persian Gulf, but the Syria map does look amazing. 

Edited January 4, 2021 by rfxcasey

[Zoomer]

Syria map, as you can use all your current assets on it giving you another sandbox to utilise.

 

....... and its superior to the PG map in the eye candy department, plus its very extensive and will be expanded to include Cyprus et al. A no brainer at the price. 

 

Get both if you can stretch of course.

Edited January 4, 2021 by Zoomer

[ebabil]

both

[Qiou87]

I own both, I play in VR, and although yes, the viper pit in VR is great, the module itself needs to cook a little while longer. I love flying it but I have set it aside for now. It is not as much a problem of capabilities as it is a problem of polish for me right now, so I haven’t checked the latest update to make sure my problems with Mavericks were finally solved.

 

The Syria map is amazing, although if you only play in SP you might not get to see it’s full potential unless you use Liberation that can generate lovely dynamic campaigns on this map. But there aren’t many SP campaigns available for this map just yet since it is new and will be expanded in the future. Baltic dragon, arguably one of the best dlc campaign makers, plans a Syria campaign in the Viper for 2021.

 

I’d still recommend the map now and wait until the summer for the Viper to be more feature complete.

 

Also if you play in VR, try a helicopter (a real one not the Ka50). I found them boring and difficult in pancake, but once I jumped in VR the helos became natural and soooo much fun. Add the Huey to your basket.

Edited January 5, 2021 by Qiou87

[1987kess]

I would say Syria.

Best theatre for now by far (seriously I have them all except The Channel, and although I like PG and NTTR, this is another level), and with incoming improvements like Cyprus. And you can use it with all your modules.

 

I have the Viper and I love it but I have parked it in the hangar for a year or so, right now still have the feeling of unfinished and unpolished.

I would recommend to learn the F-14 if you haven't touched it yet. I love this plane even when flying solo. 

And you can get the Viper on the Summer sale or so.

[Beirut]

Syria.

 

The F-16 is gorgeous but if you already have the F-18 it's kind of more of the same. On the other hand, the Syria map will give new life to every module you already have.

 

More maps is good maps!

[lmp]

Syria. It's a great map.

 

The Viper needs a lot more work to even come close to being complete. I want to like it, but at least for now the Hornet is just so much more fun.

 

If you want a new modern aircraft, consider the A-10C maybe?

[Fri13]

Syria map.

 

We will soon receive the new weather engine with new clouds, so all maps will receive a major graphical upgrade for visuals, that means new tactics to learn to engage ground and air units as it is not anymore just few buffy clouds or full cloud cover.

 

This as well means you likely enjoy more from Syria map as it is like Beirut said, benefiting for all your modules like Super Carrier.

 

The Viper is nice, it started well and has offered plenty already. And it has benefiting Hornet status but Viper will not be as capable like Hornet is when it is ready. But you know your viper, so you could buy it and enjoy it with Caucasus new graphics.

 

But considering that Viper is not ready and Syria is mostly done (ready to be flown in) then likely it is that what makes better get Syria.

 

Later on we get the free map, with almost only water so your carrier operations becomes critical. So that map doesn't replace Syria or offer same things and Viper would be almost useless there as the land base is so small.

 

 

[alphagamer4]

I thought the Syria map was nice but could use some improvement.

 

The same could be said for the F-16 module.

 

So, I would recommend going with the F-16 module since it's on sale and the Syria map is not.

[Ziptie]

Syria map > F16C (at this time).

 

 

As others have said, the F16C needs to develop more before it really is worth it, in my opinion.  I bought the Viper on Day 1, and wish I wouldn't have bothered.  Sure, it's the Viper and it's very different to the Hornet (and certainly the Tomcat) - sure, they are working on it and in my opinion dong the best they can to get it closer to complete - but it's going to be a lot longer until it's complete.

 

Syria is absolutely beautiful, a massive map, that has true elevation changes, some epic canyons to carve, some amazing architecture / landmarks, allows for sea and land based operations, looks terrific night or day - along with having the incoming Cyprus addition (in the future).

 

Plus, come fly in our MP server - you'll the most unique DCS experience possible - true dynamic mission.

 

Considering the price reduction of Syria currently - for sure best bang for your buck.

Enjoy it!

Oh, another member mentioned adding the UH-1H to your basket while you were at it - completely agree.  Tried it during the free to play event and purchased it after 5 flights.  Also a VR user here, and it truly is something special to do low levels flights, pop the doors open and have the door gunners employ a bunch of freedom on targets below (then add the newly introduced multi crew and it's even better to be able to fly with your friends).

 

 

Cheers,

 

Ziptie

[Qiou87]

4 hours ago, alphagamer4 said:

So, I would recommend going with the F-16 module since it's on sale and the Syria map is not.

 Why do you say that when the Syria map also has a 10$ discount? 

 

I wouldn't buy something just because its on sale. But terrains benefit all your modules, the Viper in its current state, well... it is a potent A2A platform for sure. For A2G or SEAD, it is missing some stuff. I mean the Hornet in A2G with the new HMCS is just killer. Most stuff will come over to the Viper for sure, but it still feels like you are taking part in an active development and it shows (stuff changes with every update). The Syria map is going to expand, but Beirut and Damascus and all the other bases will still be where they are, there is just going to be more to play with.

 

Also Syria on servers like 4YA is amazing. 

[LooseSeal]

I'm just going to say it because nobody else has... make sure you have a pretty damn good PC for the Syria map. It's the only DCS map I routinely have performance issues with, even without other units. Playing Liberation on it, even with distance culling, is crazy slow at times... haven't got that with any other map. The addition of Cyprus terrifies me!

 

That said, it is the best map for DCS in terms of beauty and detail, and my PC is nowhere near as good as others out there. But I'd keep it in mind if you don't have a pretty good GPU and at least 32GB of RAM.

[Hog_No32]

10 minutes ago, LooseSeal said:

I'm just going to say it because nobody else has... make sure you have a pretty damn good PC for the Syria map. It's the only DCS map I routinely have performance issues with, even without other units. Playing Liberation on it, even with distance culling, is crazy slow at times... haven't got that with any other map. The addition of Cyprus terrifies me!

 

That said, it is the best map for DCS in terms of beauty and detail, and my PC is nowhere near as good as others out there. But I'd keep it in mind if you don't have a pretty good GPU and at least 32GB of RAM.

 

Thanks LooseSeal for that input. I am as well on the verge of buying Syria but I hestitate mostly because of performance concerns. I have a really old rig (i7 870, 2.93GHz) which has seen only little upgrades over the years (16GB DDR3-1333, SSD and a Gainward GTX 680 with 2GB). It runs ok on PG, Caucasus and NTTR with modest settings. But I fear with all the eye-candy of the Syrian map it will be underperforming significantly...

 

2nd point for me is I will definitely wait until the expansion with Cyprus comes out. Not because of Cyprus itself but because it will allow me to place a Supercarrier at a more reasonable (i.e. realistic) distance from the shore. Since SC came out I rarely operate my Hornet out of land bases...

[Ziptie]

6 hours ago, Hog_No32 said:

 

Thanks LooseSeal for that input. I am as well on the verge of buying Syria but I hestitate mostly because of performance concerns. I have a really old rig (i7 870, 2.93GHz) which has seen only little upgrades over the years (16GB DDR3-1333, SSD and a Gainward GTX 680 with 2GB). It runs ok on PG, Caucasus and NTTR with modest settings. But I fear with all the eye-candy of the Syrian map it will be underperforming significantly...

 

2nd point for me is I will definitely wait until the expansion with Cyprus comes out. Not because of Cyprus itself but because it will allow me to place a Supercarrier at a more reasonable (i.e. realistic) distance from the shore. Since SC came out I rarely operate my Hornet out of land bases...

 

 

Yeah, your PC specs might get you into a little bit of trouble running Syria (although if you are using a monitor maybe not...?).  I use VR, and my PC specs are in my signature - and I get solid 30FPS in MP with it, however the mission in our server is highly optimized and runs just as good as SP even though it has 1,000 units (approx) and is dynamic.  Another thing to consider is the "Syria surface textures trick" - but that is for another thread most likely.  I ran it on the monitor the other day, without VR, and was in the high 90FPS in cockpit, cracking well above 150FPS external views (touched 219FPS in F3 flyby).  It's not as bad as many make it out to be.

For your 2nd point - the carrier can already be placed quite close to shore, requiring a short hop to go feet dry, so don't let the island of Cyprus not being there stop you if that was really a sticking point to "getting it close to land."

 

 

Cheers,

 

Ziptie

[alphagamer4]

17 hours ago, Qiou87 said:

 Why do you say that when the Syria map also has a 10$ discount? 

 

I wouldn't buy something just because its on sale. But terrains benefit all your modules, the Viper in its current state, well... it is a potent A2A platform for sure. For A2G or SEAD, it is missing some stuff. I mean the Hornet in A2G with the new HMCS is just killer. Most stuff will come over to the Viper for sure, but it still feels like you are taking part in an active development and it shows (stuff changes with every update). The Syria map is going to expand, but Beirut and Damascus and all the other bases will still be where they are, there is just going to be more to play with.

 

Also Syria on servers like 4YA is amazing. 

 

I bought my DCS products on Steam.

 

Just to clarify, I think the Syria map will be amazing when it's finished and optimized. Just not there yet while it's at full price (on Steam) in my opinion.

[Ziptie]

55 minutes ago, alphagamer4 said:

 

I bought my DCS products on Steam.

 

Just to clarify, I think the Syria map will be amazing when it's finished and optimized. Just not there yet while it's at full price (on Steam) in my opinion.

 

 

In Wags' most recent Hornet video update (today) - he subtly teases the island of Cyprus (along with no so subtly teasing the new clouds).  The map is optimized well enough to not wait, in my opinion.  After going back and running a few flights on PG and Syria - PG has less performance than Syria, at least on my machine.  .02

 

As for the lack of discount via Steam, that you seem to indicate - that, along with poorer performance in VR is exactly why I transitioned to stand alone.  One of the best moves I've made for DCS.  Might be worth consideration.

Cheers,

 

Ziptie

[alphagamer4]

17 hours ago, Ziptie said:

 

 

In Wags' most recent Hornet video update (today) - he subtly teases the island of Cyprus (along with no so subtly teasing the new clouds).  The map is optimized well enough to not wait, in my opinion.  After going back and running a few flights on PG and Syria - PG has less performance than Syria, at least on my machine.  .02

 

As for the lack of discount via Steam, that you seem to indicate - that, along with poorer performance in VR is exactly why I transitioned to stand alone.  One of the best moves I've made for DCS.  Might be worth consideration.

Cheers,

 

Ziptie

 

Thanks for the tip, friend. I think it's probably too late for me to leave Steam, given that I just spent $680 on Steam to acquire almost $1200 worth of DCS products (see my signature). I really do love the Steam Winter Sales.

 

I like keeping as many of my PC games in 1 place (DRM) as possible. Steam is great about refunds, especially when it comes to holding questionable game devs accountable for releasing poorly-performing products. Not too worried about Steam and VR since I'm not interested in VR at the moment (it's too blurry for my tastes).

 

Even though my PC can run the Syria map just fine (i7-8700K @5GHz CPU with 32GB RAM; EVGA RTX 3080 GPU), I still do not believe it is as optimized yet as it could be. I believe it will get better optimized in time. Maybe Steam will have it on sale at that point as well.

Edited January 7, 2021 by alphagamer4

[Sacarino111]

Hi.

   Go for Sirya, and learn the F14, for God sake!

F16 is incomplete but really a pleasure to fly, but the map is near to completition and you would be able to use all the modules you have.

Saludos, Saca111

[Hog_No32]

23 hours ago, Ziptie said:

For your 2nd point - the carrier can already be placed quite close to shore, requiring a short hop to go feet dry, so don't let the island of Cyprus not being there stop you if that was really a sticking point to "getting it close to land."

 

 

Cheers,

 

Ziptie

 

Thanks Ziptie for your extensive response. Yes, I use a 2-monitor setup   with a combined resolution of 3360x1440. I am sure VR would kill my rig...:-)

 

Re the second point, I think I could have explained this better: What I want the carrier to be is as far AWAY from the shore as possible. I think that is more realistic and I do like longer missions.

From what I could guesstimate based on screenshots of the current state of the map is that its western boundary is max 80-90nm from the Israeli/Lebanese/Syrian shore. I don’t think that a carrier group would want to be so close to Indian country and potentially within range of land-based anti-ship missiles.

So I am looking forward to „more water“ in the west of the map to place the carrier there

 

Cheers

[Ziptie]

3 hours ago, Hog_No32 said:

Re the second point, I think I could have explained this better: What I want the carrier to be is as far AWAY from the shore as possible. I think that is more realistic and I do like longer missions.

From what I could guesstimate based on screenshots of the current state of the map is that its western boundary is max 80-90nm from the Israeli/Lebanese/Syrian shore. I don’t think that a carrier group would want to be so close to Indian country and potentially within range of land-based anti-ship missiles.

So I am looking forward to „more water“ in the west of the map to place the carrier there

 

Cheers

 

Fair enough.  I can tell you that from the north bay by Incirlik, down south by Rene-Mouawad - it's well over 200nm.  So if you were to place the carrier group in the top left of the map, you'd have more than enough flight time, that you are looking for.  Regardless, it's your decision and I'm confident that once you've purchased it, you won't be disappointed with your decision - whenever that might be.  I've put my .02 in for yourself and others, time to go enjoy it in VR for myself again.

 

 

Cheers,

 

Ziptie

[Hog_No32]

1 minute ago, Ziptie said:

 

Fair enough.  I can tell you that from the north bay by Incirlik, down south by Rene-Mouawad - it's well over 200nm.  So if you were to place the carrier group in the top left of the map, you'd have more than enough flight time, that you are looking for.  Regardless, it's your decision and I'm confident that once you've purchased it, you won't be disappointed with your decision - whenever that might be.  I've put my .02 in for yourself and others, time to go enjoy it in VR for myself again.

 

 

Cheers,

 

Ziptie

Again, many thanks. You are making valid points and I‘m sure I‘d love the map. I guess at this point it is more a „when“ rather than an „if“ I will purchase it-question.

Even if it won‘t run too well on my Hornet in a demanding mission, I will take out the Gazelle and just enjoy the scenery in some low level hops.This business is so small that I am usually inclined to rather purchase modules/campaigns/terrains than not, even if it may not be a piece I expect to heavily employ. As long as I see a little bit of value or frankly fun in something or my learning curves become too flat with other modules I want to support the ED and the 3rd party devs. That is, of course, as far as my financial situation allows it. Editorial note: feel free to replace ‚financial situation‘ by ‚wife‘...

 

Happy flying Ziptie!

Cheers,

Hog No32

[wilbur81]

The Syria map is by far the most detailed map I own, but it isn't as well-optimized or polished as PG or Caucasus. I feel like ED's in-house maps (PG, NTTR, Caucasus, etc.) look more clean, sharp, and tidy. Syria looks a little rough around the edges in terms of textures, but many here have disagreed with my assessment.

 

I'd still go for the Syria map over the Viper when you already own the Hornet, but that's just me.

[Steel Jaw]

Syria map currently very poor FPS, get the Viper, unfinished but still a good ride.

[Beirut]

10 hours ago, wilbur81 said:

I'd still go for the Syria map over the Viper when you already own the Hornet, but that's just me.

 

That's me too.

 

Obviously the F-16 is really nice, but it's a couple of bucks and - I might get killed for saying this - it brings a difference of style more than substance over the F-18. Single seat, fast, modern, US, same weapons but less of them, lots of similarities. And all new systems to learn to fire those same weapons. The real thing is if it "grabs you". If it does, then it's yours. If it's questionable, wait for the next sale and get Syria. 

[mrmat01]

On 1/6/2021 at 3:00 PM, alphagamer4 said:

I thought the Syria map was nice but could use some improvement.

 

 

In what way ? 

The Syria map is a level above the rest & is soon to be expanded. The Syria map has set a new standard. why do you think we haven't got the Mariana Islands yet.