New Aircraft Spotting Enhancement

[wilbur81]

From this full 4K user: THANK YOU!

[Blackhawk NC]

It does appear that enemy aircraft are easier to spot at reasonable distances and overall appearance is significantly better. I didnt see anything mentioned in the update notes but i am sure all 4k users appreciate these improvements.

[wilbur81]

5 hours ago, chucknellie said:

It does appear that enemy aircraft are easier to spot at reasonable distances and overall appearance is significantly better. I didnt see anything mentioned in the update notes but i am sure all 4k users appreciate these improvements.

Indeed. This was quite a positive patch from my perspective...not perfect, but ambitious and comprehensive in several key areas for me.

[Joni]

What changed?

[greco.bernardi]

I have problem with a VR... I only can see a plane if it is on close distance.

I fly all time on SOW server and now i can´t see a big objects like ships! I need to be over coast line to see a ship..how can i see a little plane? 

Its good to know that its working to someone. I hope that ED make something to keep working for VR users Too.

 

[Bowie]

I'm gettin' about 1.4 miles on a warbird w/ 4K.

 

Should be 2-5 miles.

 

 

 

 

Bowie

[Priest]

Did something change? Nothing about it in patch notes.

[Volator]

On 12/20/2020 at 3:05 PM, chucknellie said:

It does appear that enemy aircraft are easier to spot at reasonable distances and overall appearance is significantly better. I didnt see anything mentioned in the update notes but i am sure all 4k users appreciate these improvements.

I love it. For the first time in DCS I'm able to see what's going on around me as a non-VR, non-4k user.

[KittyVCAW-1]

planes at night time are too easy to see now. They are lit up like a parking lot even with their lights off

[Volator]

5 hours ago, KittyVCAW-1 said:

planes at night time are too easy to see now. They are lit up like a parking lot even with their lights off

Ok, that's definitely not good.

[evilnate]

Does anyone have a screenshot of the visibility effect to share?

[Bizzle]

Was this visibility enhancement removed in the latest update this week?

 

A week or two ago I noticed the lighter colored dot that greatly improved the ability to spot aircraft, especially at a distance. It also appeared to help at medium distances, before being able to make out the outline of the aircraft. This medium range is often where I loose sight of aircraft, even when I know where they are. I'm using a 4k screen, like many others, and there are times where the bogie just disappears into the background. Adjusting the anti-aliasing and anisotropic filtering settings only helps so much. I was a big fan of the lighter colored dot (it did make it more difficult to spot aircraft in the sky, especially along the horizon), but it appeared more realistic to me. I thought the white dot more closely depicted light reflections off aircraft, which are often more visible than the outline of the aircraft itself at certain distances. 

 

One vote for bringing back the white dot, or some similar enhancement. I fully appreciate the efforts to make spotting as realistic as possible and understand that spotting is difficult in real-life, but I think some rendering enhancement is necessary to account for the fact that most of us are using a single regular size 27-34" screen with relatively high resolution. Magnifying the view to resemble actual size is one option, but a poor one, since it restricts the angle of view so significantly that all situational awareness is lost. 

 

Just my 2 cents. I appreciate all the efforts of the DCS team that makes this sim so fantastic. 

[greco.bernardi]

I prefer the white dots too... It´s not a perfect solution but now i can´t spot anything in my VR.

[SharpeXB]

6 hours ago, Bizzle said:

Magnifying the view to resemble actual size is one option, but a poor one, since it restricts the angle of view so significantly that all situational awareness is lost. 

Use the zoom view to constantly vary your FOV depending on the situation. That’s how visibility in a flight sim is supposed to be handled. No screen technology is able to show you lifelike resolution so magnification is the only solution. Zoom view is not unique to DCS. All flight simulators have this feature for the same reason. 

[Ziptie]

On 12/21/2020 at 4:25 AM, greco.bernardi said:

I have problem with a VR... I only can see a plane if it is on close distance.

I fly all time on SOW server and now i can´t see a big objects like ships! I need to be over coast line to see a ship..how can i see a little plane? 

Its good to know that its working to someone. I hope that ED make something to keep working for VR users Too.

 

 

 

Very odd.  I am able to get a tally at over 15 miles (without them conning).  Using VR zoom or VR spy zoom, can get the tally from well in excess of 25 miles.

 

VR, CV1, 20/13 vision(not sure if that part really makes a difference in VR).

 

Cheers,

 

Ziptie

Edited December 27, 2020 by Ziptie

[Volator]

On 12/22/2020 at 11:06 AM, Pilot Ike said:

I love it. For the first time in DCS I'm able to see what's going on around me as a non-VR, non-4k user.

Turns out that, being a helicopter pilot mainly, I actually hate it, because visual detection ranges are extremely exaggerated. Spotting fighter sized aircraft or helicopters at 10+ nautical miles seems unrealistic, especially against the ground, and I do get intercepted and shot down much more often now in MP in my Huey, as hiding is much more difficult now. 

Edited December 31, 2020 by Pilot Ike

[NeMoGas]

Yeah, and it's not just aircraft but ground units also. While in a KA50 I can now see a tank from 20+nm away. If they are on top of a hill, even if on the back side from my position I can still see them. They appear floating above the ridge at long range since the LOD of terrain is not very accurate.

 

It seems pretty ridiculous that you can spot tanks and even infantry at these ranges now.

[Phantom_Mark]

On 12/26/2020 at 9:38 PM, greco.bernardi said:

I prefer the white dots too... It´s not a perfect solution but now i can´t spot anything in my VR.

Be nice to have the option to enable or disable this feature for sure, I share your sentiments.......BigNewy said something was coming in its place in the future to deal with the situation tho, fingers crossed.

[LTRMcrew]

I think their intent was sun glint for distant targets which would be insanely awesome; however, the white dots may have had the glint on ALL the time instead of just certain angles from viewer and Sun. Hopefully they are refining it. 

[[DBS]TH0R]

What changed?

[Phantom_Mark]

2 hours ago, LTRMcrew said:

I think their intent was sun glint for distant targets which would be insanely awesome; however, the white dots may have had the glint on ALL the time instead of just certain angles from viewer and Sun. Hopefully they are refining it. 

I did see the glint effect "occasionally", but yes, most of the time it meant the picture was more just a bright dot.

[Lurker]

I hope that us VR users get some love with regards to spotting. I liked the "bright spot" mechanic, even though it was unrealistic. 

[Hawkeye_UK]

Apologies in advance for the longer post - but this is important as its about the Integrity of the product.

 

Well you guys that want white dots or any dots for that matter to "help you spot" have totally missed the point of the game, it is meant to be a simulator.  With respect and no offence meant you have come to play the wrong product, there are other less realistic sims for you without naming names or equally on servers within DCS that have labels or just enable them in SP.  That functionality for a dot label is already in the game!  Do not keep begging for things that ruin, and i mean literally ruin gameplay for those that play this product a little more seriously.

 

Many like myself desire a more realistic experience and i can assure you that spotting things in real life is not easy.  You are not visually going to be easily spotting attack aircraft and choppers from circa 7+ miles especially if they are below you, are camouflaged and your also being bounced around especially in choppers over mountainous terrain and their thermal systems it's just not that easy.  Add to this heat and climatic conditions especially in hot theatres its extremely, extremely hard.  You'll often hear a chopper before you see it, its that simple and in valleys that's also deceptive as it bounces off the peaks above you so its not as easy to locate direction.  Its like if you lose someone in the water, what's the golden rule you don't take your eyes of that person.  Same thing applies here if its a threat.  Spotting past 7 mile is really hard for small targets and if you turn your head away and look back 50%+ of times you will lose the object and precious time to reacquire.  If they change azimuth, speed and direction then that probability start's dropping like a stone.

 

For those that want to see ground forces from 15/20 miles away its time for a reality check.  Good luck if your against experienced operators finding a FSG vehicle even from a few miles away if its in a slight depression or wadi, with appropriate nets and placement re shape and backdrop.  Again especially in hot theatres with the Mk 1 eyeball your just not going to pick up on it, unless they make an error and show signs of movement etc which is what your brain will react to.    

 

Only time when you might get a white light, its generally a flash of a reflection.  So from a ground perspective this may be a glass in a vehicle (IF its not been taken out) or some idiot using bino's or optics without ARD's.  But, again you'd have to time it right to be looking and also they would have to be stupid and on a deathwish.  With trained professional's its just not going to happen, they also want to go home at some point in the future and not in a box.

 

All you guys wanting a dot, so that you can put your dot on it so to speak and blow it up are just not living in the real world.  You need to ask yourself do you just want to play a game or do you want to play something that you have to look and search for, not be put on a plate for you.  Having these dots - which i note have from the ridiculous white dot are now black dots is not right.  It ruins gameplay, it is just not realistic in anyway shape or form.  I have not had chance to play much since the update however note that the black dots now appear on all units and was seeing them from 15+ miles away in VR.  I need to test this weekend but i think it's actually probably further.  It is not good especially for virtual chopper guys or tac commander's that have ground forces.  It's also frustrating flying CAS because its Insta kill time.

 

I mean yes alot of DCS is like a game, i mean take JTAC smoke on all multiplayers, just roll in and drop on the laser.  No specific attack corridors required (which in the real world have a very restrictive optimum attack heading either side of the JTAC heading towards the target with a central no attack zone around the JTAC and pretty much anything opposite) so you don't lock and kill the people that either need help or there to support the mission.  But we accept that for what it is and can get around this in game if we so wish.  Hard coding dots for objects is game breaking, its that simple.

 

Please for those of you wanting these back on or to continue, either enable the existing setting so you have dot labels (as do not kid yourself your wanting the same thing) but do not ruin this game for those of us that play the game with a bit more realism.  I would, as with many others that have already spent over $1000 on software over the years for this game to have it ruined by inexperienced players.

 

Also last point - it takes years to learn to spot units in real life and what to look for, you have to train how you look, how you sweep your eyes, the focus point and the speed of that, the pattern that you use, was that shape their yesterday etc.  Do not make it easier than it already is.  Yes it's a game but some degree of making it more of a challenge should be welcomed not seeking way to meta the product to make it easier for you.

 

As I said not meant to cause offense, but is meant as a reality check.

 

PS - Also I only play VR so those of you with monitors that already zoom to the max when airborne in a  loaded G turn ask yourself could you do that in real life?  We do not need dots. 

 

 

Edited January 5, 2021 by Hawkeye_UK
Add the ps!

[GunSlingerAUS]

Definitely noticed an improvement when using a 4K display, so thank you very much ED! I can't say for sure exactly how much it's improved, but it does seem like fighter sized targets appear as a clear black dot at around 10nm. It might be a little too strong now, but it's better than it was. 

[alphagamer4]

I am going to share my perspective in a brief post. I believe there is room to compromise when it comes to realism and accessibility in DCS. 

 

I believe the realism can be maintained via the detailed cockpits / study-sim aspects of DCS while still allowing greater accessibility to gamers by making targets easier to see.

 

While I do not mind playing DCS in a singleplayer format, I think making DCS more accessible to gamers in a reasonable manner via making targets easier to see (especially in VR) is a good thing from a multiplayer perspective. It welcomes more gamers to the fold, increases the number of customers for ED, etc.

 

Just to be clear, I am not suggesting that we make DCS "call of duty" friendly. Simply stating that DCS is a game, not real life.

Edited January 8, 2021 by alphagamer4