The Legit Discussion for PTID on the F-14B and late F-14A

[SkyhawkDriver]

Heatblur should seriously consider adding PTID into the RIO Stations onto the later model F-14s. PTID didnt really add anything new (All it did is literally just repeat a TID onto a bigger screen), all it is just a big screen with a memory card slot. Biggest benefit would be the LANTRIN Clarity. PLEASE HEATLBUR. Lets make it happen! 

[TLTeo]

Not happening, stop asking for it

 

[SkyhawkDriver]

Just now, TLTeo said:

Not happening, stop asking for it

 

There is documentation for PTID Though!.......... And plenty of SMEs that will help too! 

I think you seriously dont understand what PTID is especially on the A Model and B Models (Not BU)

[TLTeo]

And you don't understand that HB have stated multiple times very clearly that lack of documentation on the PTID is why they didn't make a more modern version of the Tomcat

[SkyhawkDriver]

Just now, TLTeo said:

And you don't understand that HB have stated multiple times very clearly that lack of documentation on the PTID is why they didn't make a more modern version of the Tomcat

I dont think you understand for what Im asking. Im not asking for the Sparrowhawk F-14 or the F-14D. I am asking for the Programmable Tactical Information Display to be added in. There is documentation for that system and like I stated, handful of SMEs who will be willing to help too. I am not asking for a F-14D, or F-14BU which I think you might be confusing PTID being associated only on the F-14BUs and F-14Ds. By '98-99 the majority of F-14s basically had PTID. And there is ample amount of documentation for PTID.

[TLTeo]

4 minutes ago, SkyhawkDriver said:

I dont think you understand for what Im asking. Im not asking for the Sparrowhawk F-14 or the F-14D. I am asking for the Programmable Tactical Information Display to be added in. There is documentation for that system and like I stated, handful of SMEs who will be willing to help too. I am not asking for a F-14D, or F-14BU which I think you might be confusing PTID being associated only on the F-14BUs and F-14Ds. By '98-99 the majority of F-14s basically had PTID. And there is ample amount of documentation for PTID.

Please read. Please.

[RaceFuel85]

With the F-14 after about 1998 the general status of upgrades was a bit of a mess. 

The F-14A's and B's initially got the PTID, which for the most part is a high definition display of the existing TID displays. There were a few special pages, namely the Navigation screen (which there is an example of in documentation) and the JDAM data screen (same, which there is an example of).   There is information missing about the entirety of the F-14BU program and the F-14D of course, however there is a reasonable enough amount of information available to model the standalone addition of a PTID to the existing F-14A and F-14B. 

Not all F-14B's got the full B Upgrade kit (GPS, Sparrowhawk, etc).  Many just got the PTID screen and  GPS systems to employ JDAM's, and some only got the PTID screen. Only VF-11, 32 and 103 got the full F-14BU kit, of which there isn't much public info. 


I suspect the reason is probably less an ability to get information in combination with SME's but more so wanting to just let the F-14 be done and move on from it. 

Edited December 17, 2020 by RaceFuel85

[SkyhawkDriver]

Just now, TLTeo said:

Please read. Please.

That is in refence of the F-14BUs. I am talking about PTID here sir. I think you need to read what I've been telling you. 

Let me be clear here folks. This is a discussion about a adding the Programable Tactical Information Display onto the existing F-14A and F-14B. I am not here to discuss about adding the BU or F-14D. Lets please keep this thread solely on PTID onto the existing F-14A and Bs. Thank you.

[SkyhawkDriver]

If Heatblur NEEDs a SME for PTID on the F-14A I can reach out to Virus from Tomcat POV. He's told me he was interested in DCS and wanting Heatblur to add the PTID screens onto the F-14As.

[Fri13]

To everyone to be clear, the request is for a upgraded TID for the RIO - a PTID upgrade that was standalone upgrade for A and B variants - separate from the other upgrades that newer variants of F-14 received.

 

So if there becomes information available for it to Heatblur to model and simulate it, it should be doable.

[Quid]

TLTeo posted it, but apparently no one actually read it, so here's the quote that was already posted explicitly regarding the PTID:  Naquaii: "we don't have complete info on matters relating to primarily the PTID menus and combat oriented symbology. And even if we did get a hold of that information it would not be a 100% sure thing as it would entail remodelling the RIO pit extensively."

 

So, yes, you are clear, you are talking about the PTID.  It is not the SparrowHawk, or GPS, or whatever.  It's the PTID.  Naquaii, from Heatblur, has explained that they do not have the requisite documentation for the PTID, and if they did get it, it would take significant work to implement so even then it's not 100% that they'd do it.  While I'd love to see it, I wouldn't hold my breath.

 

Edited December 17, 2020 by Quid

[SkyhawkDriver]

1 hour ago, Quid said:

TLTeo posted it, but apparently no one actually read it, so here's the quote that was already posted explicitly regarding the PTID:  Naquaii: "we don't have complete info on matters relating to primarily the PTID menus and combat oriented symbology. And even if we did get a hold of that information it would not be a 100% sure thing as it would entail remodelling the RIO pit extensively."

 

So, yes, you are clear, you are talking about the PTID.  It is not the SparrowHawk, or GPS, or whatever.  It's the PTID.  Naquaii, from Heatblur, has explained that they do not have the requisite documentation for the PTID, and if they did get it, it would take significant work to implement so even then it's not 100% that they'd do it.  While I'd love to see it, I wouldn't hold my breath.

 

In reference to that post they posted about PTID with the BUs, its the pages associated with the BU's we do not have access to (I.E The GPS pages, BIT pages, JDAM Page, etc). With F-14Bs that were not upgraded to BU standards, basically from everyone I have talked to a couple of RIOs and read documentation, it really didnt anything new besides the 12X12 Power display for the LANTRIN. So I believe it would be reasonably realistic for Heatblur to do. I'm really being vocal about this because I feel its like necessary to give us a 9/11 era F-14A. F-14As with PTID Truly did a lot of the work during the late 90s. I know im being picky but heatblur did say F-14A Late. And F-14A Lates majority of them had PTID. If they dont want to add it in the B I can understand. But I think its reasonable on the F-14A. And If Im not mistaken I think they did some 3D Scans of the cockpit of F-14s with PTID.

 

[fat creason]

This is super unlikely to ever happen for the reasons stated above. There's not enough info out there to make it, we're delivering what we said we would deliver, we can't just keep continuously adding additional features that were never planned just because "it would be cool". Even if enough info did exist, you have to understand that HB is a business and not a bottomless extra features money-pit, we planned the deliverable feature set you're getting (and have already paid for) for a reason and we're sticking to it.

Edited December 17, 2020 by fat creason

[SkyhawkDriver]

7 minutes ago, fat creason said:

This is super unlikely to ever happen for the reasons stated above. There's not enough info out there to make it, we're delivering what we said we would deliver, we can't just keep continuously adding additional features that were never planned just because "it would be cool". You have to understand that HB is a business and not a bottomless extra features money-pit, we planned the deliverable feature set you're getting for a reason and we're sticking to it.

Well why wouldn't you guys just make it a purchasable upgrade for us that want the screen? If its regarding information about PTID on the F-14A, I could get in contact with Virus (the RIO from the Youtube channel Tomcat POV) and get him in touch with you guys. Also regarding to Information in particular to the PTID of the F-14A, there is a handful of documents out there that outlies everything the PTID did with the F-14A. I dont think thats unreasonable as a consumer to be asking for. I understand you guys have a business model but I kind of feel bamboozled when you guys say F-14A-GR-135 Late. Late implying Late 1990s. 

Edited December 17, 2020 by SkyhawkDriver

[fat creason]

There are plenty of F-14As without the PTID, not sure how you can be bamboozled regarding a feature we never promised to be included? This is similar to the guy who tried to tell us that we're not delivering a legitimate A model without glove vanes (another feature which we never promised). All I can say is that we currently don't plan to include anything like the PTID into the base F-14 package. 

Edited December 17, 2020 by Cobra847

[SkyhawkDriver]

1 minute ago, fat creason said:

There are plenty of F-14As without the PTID, not sure how you can be bamboozled regarding a feature we never promised to be included?

Then why did you guys have to mention Late? in F-14A-GR-135 "Late"? Like any human being I'd imagine late being the later F-14As from the late 90s. Which basically all did get PTID.

[TLTeo]

If only they had made a post detailing exactly what features would be included in the Late (which, amazingly, appears to be defined as "from the same timeframe as the -B we have") and Early models, say, a couple weeks before the -A was released...

[DD_Fenrir]

Good lord, some people just can't take no for an answer.

 

And if your feverish hard-on for PTID let you convince yourself that Heatblur had committed to a PTID model (which they never had, and said 99% likely never will because all the information on that system is still classified) then that's your the fault of your own overactive and over-entitled imagination.

 

Get over yourselves, seriously. It's downright undignified.

Edited December 17, 2020 by DD_Fenrir

[SkyhawkDriver]

10 minutes ago, DD_Fenrir said:

Good lord, some people just can't take no for an answer.

 

And if your feverish hard-on for PTID let you convince yourself that Heatblur had committed to a PTID model (which they never had, and said 99% likely never will because all the information on that system is still classified) then that's your the fault of your own overactive and over-entitled imagination.

 

Get over yourselves, seriously. It's downright undignified.

 

Lets keep this discussion civilized please. 

[Jackjack171]

All this chub over the F-14D and the PTID alike is laughable. A few years from now, some are going to think that these F-14D and PTID guys had some kind of freaky relationship going on lol. 

[QuiGon]

25 minutes ago, SkyhawkDriver said:

Lets keep this discussion civilized please. 

Then give it a rest. You got your answer.

[Naquaii]

3 hours ago, SkyhawkDriver said:

Then why did you guys have to mention Late? in F-14A-GR-135 "Late"? Like any human being I'd imagine late being the later F-14As from the late 90s. Which basically all did get PTID.

 

The simple fact is that there were still bog standard F-14As around until the end. Saying that an F-14A is a late F-14A doesn't equal PTID. Heck, there were even F-14D with fishbowl TIDs.

 

Like I've stated before, the missing parts in regards to information is all the different menus for the PTID as well as the Sparrowhawk HUD weapons implementation afaik.

Afaik the PMDIG upgrade included stuff other than the PTID, as it also affected other things in the aircraft apart from the display itself. The introduction of the 1553 bus amongst others.

 

That said, even if we did get that information it does still entail a lot of additional work and is not something we're commited to as of this time.

 

We do hear you and I wouldn't mind having a PTID F-14 or even a F-14D myself but it's not currently in the cards.

Edited December 17, 2020 by Naquaii

[Southernbear]

Yeah I want my early 135 and 95 tomcats as well as the AI A-6 and maybe flyable at some point A-6 before they think of touching this kinda stuff. 

[Bananabrai]

We got two F-14s. They are awesome. There is so much more to want for the aircraft we already have.

I would love a F-16C Block 40 N/A, as a two seater, and the Hornet we have as D model two seater, a T-38/F-5F for training, and so on...

 

The fact is, we already got more from HB than we would normally get from other developers.

Two different F-14 models, which will eventually be 3, even if they seem very similar for many people.

 

I would rather see another aircraft from HB tbh. There is still work to do on the planes like they are now and at some point they will move on to the next plane.

Edited December 18, 2020 by Bananabrai

[draconus]

1 hour ago, Bananabrai said:

I would rather see another aircraft from HB tbh.

What?! Who would want to fly anything other than Tomcat?