Castello Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 The F + W Values for both Wet and Dry (displayed in the respective VREST Sub-Meus), for both VTO and VL do not change with any changes to: Altitude Stores Adjusting BAW to match OWT Adjusting BAW/OWT above actual values Changes to onboard fuel The VL and VTO F+W Weights displayed seem to be swapped. As the VTO Fuel restriction is greater, and therefore the allowed maximum F+W calculated should be a lower value. What actually appears to be happening is that the VTO F+W Displayed is consistently higher than the VL F+W Displayed. I will try and attach a Track as soon as I can. For example: BAW and OWT are 14200lbs Maximum Dry VTO F+W is displayed as 4400lbs This would imply that the maximum GWT for Dry VTO is 18600lbs Dry VTO was actually achieved at 22500lbs GWT 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derfritz Posted November 2, 2020 Share Posted November 2, 2020 Can replicate. I was confused about this as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RAZBAM_ELMO Posted November 4, 2020 Share Posted November 4, 2020 I need a trk. I dont seem to have an issue with it. Know and use all the capabilities in your airplane. If you don't, sooner or later, some guy who does use them all will kick your ass. — Dave 'Preacher' Pace, USN. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Castello Posted November 27, 2020 Author Share Posted November 27, 2020 Here's the Tracks.Razbam2.trkRazbam.trk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RAZBAM_ELMO Posted November 27, 2020 Share Posted November 27, 2020 Thankyou. I will look into this further. Know and use all the capabilities in your airplane. If you don't, sooner or later, some guy who does use them all will kick your ass. — Dave 'Preacher' Pace, USN. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derfritz Posted December 1, 2020 Share Posted December 1, 2020 In this track file you can see that even after adding stores the calculated F+W never changes. It stays at its value. Also you can see that you are able to perform a vertical takeoff while being massively over the weight limit: Fuel set to F+W and 4 GBU-38+litening+gun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RAZBAM_ELMO Posted January 13, 2021 Share Posted January 13, 2021 bump Know and use all the capabilities in your airplane. If you don't, sooner or later, some guy who does use them all will kick your ass. — Dave 'Preacher' Pace, USN. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
derfritz Posted January 16, 2021 Share Posted January 16, 2021 Any news yet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kappa Posted June 18, 2021 Share Posted June 18, 2021 is VREST OK now? Haven't test it in depth but it does not seems to be ok... -- [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] 36° Stormo Virtuale - Italian Virtual Flight Community www.36stormovirtuale.net Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myHelljumper Posted June 22, 2021 Share Posted June 22, 2021 Hi, I'll move this into the resolved section, if you find that the bug is still there, post it here and I'll reopen the report. Helljumper - M2000C Guru Helljumper's Youtube https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCK3rTjezLUxPbWHvJJ3W2fA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kappa Posted June 26, 2021 Share Posted June 26, 2021 Il 22/6/2021 at 14:18, myHelljumper ha scritto: Hi, I'll move this into the resolved section, if you find that the bug is still there, post it here and I'll reopen the report. I did some tests and i think the way F+W is calculated is not correct, please read the following and tell me what do you think about this. From NFM-000 (2-77) Cita The maximum F+W is calculated as follows: first the hover weight is calculated. This is done by calculating the maximum rpm limited by ambient temperature, then calculating the maximum rpm limited by jet pipe temperature limiter settings. Since either of these parameters may limit the maximum rpm, the smaller of the two is used in the equations to calculate the hover weight. The hover weight is then adjusted for either the takeoff or landing calculations. For a vertical takeoff 97 percent of the hover weight is used. For a vertical landing approximately 95 percent of the hover weight is used. The adjusted hover weight is used along with the aircraft gross weight, fuel weight, and water weight to calculate the maximum fuel plus water weight at which a vertical operation can be executed. As far as i can understand, the mission computer should consider current GWT to calculate the F+W. Right now, it would seem that the mission computer is limited to determining the hover weight and then subtracting the BAW (basic aircraft weight) from it to get F+W. Instead I think it should do someting like this: 1) Determine hover Weight , i've decided it is 18500lbs in our case 2) Break Down GWT BAW = 14804 lbs Stores = 1000 lsb Fuel = 3000 lbs Water = 500 lbs GWT = 19304 lbs The MC should break down the GWT as shown above, excluding from the calculation the current fuel and water but considering stores and BAW. The difference between Hover weight and GWT without current fuel and water should be the calculated F+W. 3) Calculate F+W HoverWeight - (GWT - CurrentF+W) = CalculatedF+W so, considering 18500 lbs of calculated hover weight: 18500 - (19304 - 3000 - 500) = 2696 Of course I'm not sure about all this stuff, just asking for your opinion. Thanks -- [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] 36° Stormo Virtuale - Italian Virtual Flight Community www.36stormovirtuale.net Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lukeXIII Posted June 26, 2021 Share Posted June 26, 2021 Those calculations look right. To add on to this there should also be separate calculations for take off and landing. At the moment one calculation is done for both, and both VTO and VL are boxed at the same time on the VREST page (should only be one boxed at a time). The individual calculations would then be: VTO page: Max F+W = (0.97 * Max Hover Weight) - (Gross Weight - Fuel - Water) VL page: Max F+W = (0.95 * Max Hover Weight) - (Gross Weight - Fuel - Water) @myHelljumper 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kappa Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 @myHelljumper ? -- [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] 36° Stormo Virtuale - Italian Virtual Flight Community www.36stormovirtuale.net Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myHelljumper Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 Hi, I'll move this in the bug report section so our testers can take a look. Helljumper - M2000C Guru Helljumper's Youtube https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCK3rTjezLUxPbWHvJJ3W2fA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kappa Posted June 30, 2021 Share Posted June 30, 2021 (edited) 9 minuti fa, myHelljumper ha scritto: Hi, I'll move this in the bug report section so our testers can take a look. Thanks Edited June 30, 2021 by Kappa -- [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] 36° Stormo Virtuale - Italian Virtual Flight Community www.36stormovirtuale.net Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kappa Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 @myHelljumper Any update on this? -- [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] 36° Stormo Virtuale - Italian Virtual Flight Community www.36stormovirtuale.net Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hornet81 Posted July 25, 2021 Share Posted July 25, 2021 (edited) @Kappa, @lukeXIII Your calculations look right. Edited July 26, 2021 by Hornet81 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kappa Posted November 25, 2021 Share Posted November 25, 2021 @AlphaJuliet @Hornet81 Resuming this topic since i've noticed that in VREST - BNGO Page, Drag Index is not updated. In CRUS page DI is updated correctly when stores are loaded, in BNGO DI is not. 1 -- [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] 36° Stormo Virtuale - Italian Virtual Flight Community www.36stormovirtuale.net Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shiroka Posted November 25, 2021 Share Posted November 25, 2021 8 hours ago, Kappa said: @AlphaJuliet @Hornet81 Resuming this topic since i've noticed that in VREST - BNGO Page, Drag Index is not updated. In CRUS page DI is updated correctly when stores are loaded, in BNGO DI is not. I think that’s correct as is. The bingo calculations assume that the aircraft is clean (NFM 2.20.1.4 is the ref) whereas the cruise page accounts for stores. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kappa Posted November 26, 2021 Share Posted November 26, 2021 15 ore fa, Shiroka ha scritto: I think that’s correct as is. The bingo calculations assume that the aircraft is clean (NFM 2.20.1.4 is the ref) whereas the cruise page accounts for stores. It makes sense, TY -- [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] 36° Stormo Virtuale - Italian Virtual Flight Community www.36stormovirtuale.net Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lukeXIII Posted August 5, 2022 Share Posted August 5, 2022 @AlphaJuliet Looks like this isn't fully fixed as consuming water is currently causing the Max F+W to increase. To show this the above calculations can also be written as: Max F+W = Max hover weight - base aircraft weight - stores/pylons vrest_water.trk 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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