DCS F-14A - RWR Upgrades & Development

[QuiGon]

hey awesome. I have a question.

it was mentioned RIOs could actually hear different radar emissions in their head sets, or maybe it was missile tones.

I might be wrong, but AFAIK this is the case for most RWR systems out there and DCS just doesn't model this (with the exception of the Viggen). It's definitely very common among older RWR systems at least.

Edited October 12, 2020 by QuiGon

[Alphabet_Ghost]

Afaik the upgrade that added the PTID added that bus allowing the integration of the AN/ALR-67.

 

The information shown on the HSD and ECMD are the same, I was referring to the display being different using the ALR-45 and -67.

 

The different types of lines on the display indicate different types of threat.

 

other question about ALR-45 and -67,in

,you could see Threat Symbology is moving while stab pitch,still working in game? I tried it on the ground and airborn,threat symbology isn't moved.

[TLTeo]

I might be wrong, but AFAIK this is the case for most RWR systems out there and DCS just doesn't model this (with the exception of the Viggen). It's definitely very common among older RWR systems at least.

 

 

The Mig-21 kinda does it too I think.

[sublime]

I might be wrong, but AFAIK this is the case for most RWR systems out there and DCS just doesn't model this (with the exception of the Viggen). It's definitely very common among older RWR systems at least.

 

yes but Ive never seen it mentioned so much or at all in the in game manual or text for other planes. also rereading the first post one could interpret what he wrote as there will be audio tones..

[sublime]

The Mig-21 kinda does it too I think.

 

Maybe IRL not in game.. Well wait I know what you mean, you mean the different beeps on the RWR.

what Im talking about is different.

the RIOs apparently could hear a continous noise that sounded different per radar when being tracked

[sublime]

Oh, so the information from the RWR is displayed on the HSI, without needing to switch to the ECM page? That's neat actually.

 

 

edit: oh, and the -A vastly outnumbered the -B for most of the Tomcat's service life. It's not even remotely close. There were 712 Tomcats built, of which 633 served in the US Navy. 37 were newly built -Ds, and 38 were newly built -Bs, and 66 A's were upgraded to either B or D.

 

Thanks for the info.

So realistically, if a server wanted to be realish, theyd have a bunch of A slots and a couple of Bs thats it no?

[Naquaii]

Oh, so the information from the RWR is displayed on the HSI, without needing to switch to the ECM page? That's neat actually.

 

 

edit: oh, and the -A vastly outnumbered the -B for most of the Tomcat's service life. It's not even remotely close. There were 712 Tomcats built, of which 633 served in the US Navy. 37 were newly built -Ds, and 38 were newly built -Bs, and 66 A's were upgraded to either B or D.

 

The ECM page is still a thing. HSD is the name for that display itself. There is a setting allowing the ECM to automatically appear if the system get a missile alert or missile launch state though.

 

other question about ALR-45 and -67,in

,you could see Threat Symbology is moving while stab pitch,still working in game? I tried it on the ground and airborn,threat symbology isn't moved.

 

Yes, this is still in and working. It depends greatly on where the contacts are though.

[Quid]

Oh, so the information from the RWR is displayed on the HSI, without needing to switch to the ECM page? That's neat actually.

 

edit: oh, and the -A vastly outnumbered the -B for most of the Tomcat's service life. It's not even remotely close. There were 712 Tomcats built, of which 633 served in the US Navy. 37 were newly built -Ds, and 38 were newly built -Bs, and 66 A's were upgraded to either B or D.

 

If you look at the right knee panel, you can see for the HSD settings "NAV, TID, ECM" under MODE and "ORIDE, OFF" under ECM. In the F-14B, you can't select ECM under MODE (I'm guessing this is because of the separate ALR-67 display), but per NATOPS for the F-14A, the "ECM" mode repeats the RIO's ECMD on the HSD, while "ORIDE" will display the ECMD for missile launches or airborne intercept signals automatically even if ECM mode is not selected.

 

Thanks for the info.

So realistically, if a server wanted to be realish, theyd have a bunch of A slots and a couple of Bs thats it no?

 

Not necessarily. Depending on your scenario, all of the BLUFOR Tomcats in the area might be F-14Bs. If you were running a crisis scenario in early 1992 and had both the Saratoga and the Eisenhower in the area, you'd have more than 40 F-14B slots (VF-74, 103, 142 and 143), and no F-14As.

Edited October 12, 2020 by Quid
Grammar

[DoorMouse]

Some years ago you showed a preview of the ALR-45 that used a different type of display which is more advanced than this one you are presenting here but still not as good as the fully digital ALR-67 in the F-14B:

 

 

Will this one still be available as an option or has it been rolled back in favour of the earlier spec? I would like to know more about these and how they were employed (if this later type was a later retrofit but only present in low numbers for example).

 

Thanks.

 

What the What..... How the hell do you get the HSD to display that. Has how long has this been in the game. I feel like I've been living under a rock?!? How did I miss this.

 

 

(You're implying it's available in the B?)

[draconus]

What the What..... How the hell do you get the HSD to display that. Has how long has this been in the game. I feel like I've been living under a rock?!? How did I miss this.

 

(You're implying it's available in the B?)

 

Partial reading much?

https://forums.eagle.ru/forum/english/licensed-third-party-projects/heatblur-simulations/dcs-f-14a-b/291238-dcs-f-14a-rwr-upgrades-development?p=6463175#post6463175

[TailPipe ͡ ͜ʖ ͡]

This is really cool! is there any set release date for the A?

[draconus]

This is really cool! is there any set release date for the A?

 

There's never set date but it might come in next month update.

[Top Jockey]

 

There's never set date but it might come in next month update.

 

Thought I read somewhere, they were trying to give us the Tomcat A version this October...

[TLTeo]

 

Thought I read somewhere, they were trying to give us the Tomcat A version this October...

 

There was no update in October, so no chance of releasing the -A. The next patch is scheduled to be on the 4th, we'll see then.

[Slant]

Don't get hung up on dates. It's close, maybe it's this patch, maybe the one after, but we can see it on the horizon already, that's for sure. And after that we can expect some serious bug fixing and finalizing of both models. It'll be a good time to get your input in! :)

[Beamscanner]

The ALR-45 should have PRF (sometimes called 'raw') audio fed from the crystal video receivers... I hope HB use wav/ogg files instead of their hex code approach in the viggen RWR. That way I could share some of the awesome radar audio I've made. 

 

Loop play for best effect:

 

SA-6 target acquisition radar:

 

 

SA-6 target tracking radar:

 

 

[SgtPappy]

On 7/22/2021 at 11:07 PM, Beamscanner said:

The ALR-45 should have PRF (sometimes called 'raw') audio fed from the crystal video receivers... I hope HB use wav/ogg files instead of their hex code approach in the viggen RWR. That way I could share some of the awesome radar audio I've made. 

 

Loop play for best effect:

 

SA-6 target acquisition radar:

 

 

 

SA-6 target tracking radar:

 

 

 

This is epic! It actually makes me even more excited for the old school stuff coming out on the earlier F-14A's. How the heck did you find/come up with this audio?

 

In other discussions, we've heard that you needed off-the-shelf fuzz busters to get the SA-6 launch signal as the ALR-45/50 either couldn't give launch warning  or would give spurious false alarms and so was often in filtered mode which removed the ability to hear/see the SA-6 launch. Some crews even mentioned the system was useless. If in filtered mode, I guess you'd have to pay attention to the track signal and then look in that direction for a launch?

Edited September 22, 2021 by SgtPappy

[Beamscanner]

RF Theory knowledge + Youtube video with a real SA-6 tone + approximated main beam and sidelobes based on RF and antenna size. 

 

I threw together a python script in GNU radio that will make complex PRI trains with square waves and the correct pulse duration. Normal online tone generators will make a square wave at a given prf, but they wont do complex PRIs (ie a jitter, stagger, dwell and switch, etc), they also wont alter the duty cycle/pulse duration. My script does all of this. 

 

 

After i enter the parameters into my script, generating my desired complex PRI and PDs, I open the audio file in audacity and apply the main beam and side lobes effects into the appropriate scan time.

The locked on tone doesn't have the scan applied to it.

 

I think anyone who's heard a real radar tone will be satisfied.

 

Here's another post with my F-5 (APQ-159) radar tone. 

 

 

Edited September 22, 2021 by Beamscanner

[SgtPappy]

Wow, this is wild stuff! Super excited to hear something like this in the F-14A. Thanks for the link. Good stuff to study.