F16 G-Tolerance

[[PTF]Ali]

Just curious to know, if F16 has accurate G-Tolerance in DCS cause f16 Seat is tilted 30" which helps accommodate High G levels which can increase high G tolerance.

 

In my experience i guess it is not simulated in DCS? So if anyone knows you guys free to share.

Edited September 23, 2020 by AliPG

[deadpool]

It will come later.

It's not only the seat, you're also assisted by the overpressure mask helping you breathe ..

 

all not modelled, yet. and yeah, we all miss it.

[Creature_1stVFW]

Yeah, because hearing the pilot start straining at 4g, and g-locking at around 7-8g is annoying.

[Fri13]

Yeah, because hearing the pilot start straining at 4g, and g-locking at around 7-8g is annoying.

 

Well, it is discussed multiple times already to the death, but it is personal state how you react to G forces and in what state.

 

The F-16 seat and all helps somewhat, but it is in the end the meatsack in the cockpit that makes the difference.

 

Players should stop assuming that because they fly F-16, that they should be there pulling maximum G's all day along without any penalties, pre-actions and requirements. And this is not just about F-16, it is about ALL aircrafts overall.

[Yeti42]

 

Players should stop assuming that because they fly F-16, that they should be there pulling maximum G's all day along without any penalties, pre-actions and requirements. And this is not just about F-16, it is about ALL aircrafts overall.

 

It's not about pulling max G all day long, It's about the inception of g-lock too early. The F16 is rated for 9g, some pilot's can tolerate 9g for short periods, therefore this simulation should base modelling on 9g for short periods before the onset of of g lock, it currently doesn't. The plural of aircraft is aircraft not aircrafts by the way, appolgies if english is not your first language.

[BuzzU]

How many G's do the AI pull? We should be able to do the same.

[stormrider]

Well, it is discussed multiple times already to the death, but it is personal state how you react to G forces and in what state.

 

The F-16 seat and all helps somewhat, but it is in the end the meatsack in the cockpit that makes the difference.

 

Players should stop assuming that because they fly F-16, that they should be there pulling maximum G's all day along without any penalties, pre-actions and requirements. And this is not just about F-16, it is about ALL aircrafts overall.

 

 

It definitely has been discussed to death. But it's worth noting that it still hasn't been fixed.

[Torri]

Players should stop assuming that because they fly F-16, that they should be there pulling maximum G's all day along without any penalties, pre-actions and requirements. And this is not just about F-16, it is about ALL aircrafts overall.

 

Nobody wants infinite G-tolerance, the issue is that the current G-limits are simply way too low.

This means that we are not able to use the high G strengths of certain airframes like the F-16 and MiG-29, compared to for example the F-18 which has its strengths in low speed/high AOA.

[Stubbies2003]

Just to throw in my two cents here. I got three incentive flights during my time in the USAF and two out of the three we hit 9g. The third we didn't simply because on the G warm up the 16 broke and we had to RTB at that point. Neither of the two flights where we hit 9g did I have the PPG gear as apparently you had to do some kind of training to be qualified to use it. Guessing it could be dangerous to the lungs otherwise and, of course, some maintainer on a single incentive flight isn't getting that training.

 

With a proper G strain maneuver I never even lost color vision so I was no where near blacking out. Not exactly a pleasant experience but it comes with the job. I don't know what an average person is like I can only describe my experience on it though. I do agree that the onset is too early if they are simulating fighter pilots who do this all the time.

[Syndrome]

Yeah, because hearing the pilot start straining at 4g, and g-locking at around 7-8g is annoying.

 

Yeah, unfortunately the only way to fly the F-16 the way it was designed to be flown is to disable g-effects. But then you have to roleplay the gloc after-30 or so seconds. Hopefully this gets fixed soon.

[bkthunder]

From the AGARD AG322 OPEN ACCESS AND UNCLASSIFIED document

https://www.sto.nato.int/publications/AGARD/Forms/AllItems.aspx?FolderCTID=0x0120D5200078F9E87043356C409A0D30823AFA16F60B00B8BCE98BB37EB24A8258823D6B11F157&View=%7B7e9c814c-056a-4d31-8392-7c6752b2af2b%7D&RootFolder=%2Fpublications%2FAGARD%2FAGARD%2DAG%2D322&TreeField=Folders&TreeValue=AGARD%2DAG%2D322&ProcessQStringToCAML=1&SortField=DocIcon&SortDir=Asc

 

-The maximum G level obtainable using the anti-G suit

and AGSM has never been systematically measured in the laboratry.: The maximum G level duration attempted in an upright seat usng only an anti-G suit and AGSM was 9G for 45 seconds which was attained by 9 of 14 subjects in a

study conducted at USAFSAM in 1972

Higher G levels would have perhaps been possible for some of the subjects,

perhaps up to 10 or 11G for a few subjects with extremely

high G tolerances.

 

Although NATO Air centrifuge G training Forces do adhere to the NATO STANAG (i.e., 7 G for 15 sec) as a minimum G standard, their training goal is 9 G for 15 sec in the F-16 configured seat;

 

Goals for pilots of high

performance aircraft should be 9 G for 15 sec with an anti-G

suit. The widely accepted G training standard of 7 G for

15 sec is considered too low. Failure to achieve training

goals would prevent students from continuing pilot training

[Snake122]

Remember also DCS does model G warm up too. I feel like it helps especially in the Viper

[Creature_1stVFW]

Like you @stubbies, I had an incentive ride when I was enlisted also. We hit 9.2g after we did the warmup. I lost a little color, but never grayed out or g-loc’d. We did a 6g pull into the vertical on takeoff, and all I felt was the g suit inflate. The g tolerance in the sim is way too low.

[bkthunder]

Remember also DCS does model G warm up too. I feel like it helps especially in the Viper

 

Even with the "g-warmup" (which has nothing to do with increased g-tolerance IRL) the tolerance is that of a 95 years old granny.

[Snake122]

Even with the "g-warmup" (which has nothing to do with increased g-tolerance IRL) the tolerance is that of a 95 years old granny.

I agree, just trying to give a practical tip since it does sound the fix is not coming anytime soon

 

Sent from my LM-G850 using Tapatalk

Edited September 23, 2020 by Snake122

[SCPanda]

Yeah, I also do not think g-warmup is a valid solution (maybe a temporary one). Also it just feels strange to turn left and right before the merge while the other jet is coming at you nose hot (other jets seem to suffer less with this issue since jets like F-18, F-14, and Mirage aren't afraid of going slow, but the Viper does).

Edited September 23, 2020 by SCPanda
spelling

[Snake122]

Yeah, I also do not think g-warmup is a valid solution (maybe a temporary one). Also it just feels strange to turn left and right before the merge while the other jet is coming at you nose hot (other jets seem to suffer less with this issue since jets like F-18, F-14, and Mirage aren't afraid of going slow, but the Viper does).

 

Again, valid point. I want the G tolerance fixed too but ED says it's a larger fix because they didn't make different levels across aircraft. In theory a G warm up is supposed to last for awhile, I haven't tested in DCS how long it actually has an effect, I've just noticed that it does.

 

 

 

Sent from my LM-G850 using Tapatalk

Edited September 23, 2020 by Snake122

[Hummingbird]

Yeah, unfortunately the only way to fly the F-16 the way it was designed to be flown is to disable g-effects. But then you have to roleplay the gloc after-30 or so seconds. Hopefully this gets fixed soon.

 

Well considering the majority can do 9 G for 45 sec in an upright seat, it should be even longer in the F-16 tilted seat.

[=Panther=]

G-Tolerance is on the change list for the patch.

[Buddyspike69]

Anyone tested yet? Too busy with the parent life unfortunately. Sustained 9g possible?

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[TAW_Blaze]

There is also a comment about generic increase of g tolerance. I'm curious what these 2 combined amounts to.

[BuzzU]

I just tried it. The second I hit 9G's I was out.

[SCPanda]

Still very hard to hit 9 G (actually never did before I was nearly blacked out), the max I got without blacking out was 8.8. It seems they haven't fixed the ITR issue Hummingbird was talking about and testing.

 

I noticed the increase in G-tolerance tho, now g-warm up isn't needed before the merge unless you are going super fast like 500 knots.

[Hummingbird]

Well that's a bummer

[BuzzU]

Still very hard to hit 9 G (actually never did before I was nearly blacked out), the max I got without blacking out was 8.8. It seems they haven't fixed the ITR issue Hummingbird was talking about and testing.

 

I noticed the increase in G-tolerance tho, now g-warm up isn't needed before the merge unless you are going super fast like 500 knots.

 

 

I got 9.2 G's but I used a clean plane to test it. You might be going into it slower than me too.