Missing functionality in the Harrier

[Schmidtfire]

AGM-122 Primary & Hot mode. Missing Cage/Uncage functionality. Missing HUD symbology for caged seeker. Missing symbology when uncaged seeker symbology is HUD limited. Sensitivity should increase when uncaged.

 

TPOD - Laser Spot Search. Video does not freeze when in search mode.

[bkthunder]

Ability to taxi at IDLE power and adjust speed just by moving the nozzles

[Pikey]

OP: the links for the FM issues are broken.

There's a need for the problems with the FM to be outlined more clearly lest they get lost in subjective and non quantative posts saying "it's broken blah blah", which must be at all cost be avoided if this will be taken seriously.

Has anyone got any reasonable FM data to share for this?

Plenty of searchable pilot commentary:

"any roll or yaw in the hover or at low speed should become rapidly uncontrollable" -- the FM is extremely tolerant of low speed, has amazing roll and yaw stability and can recover, with a little bit of leeway, from 90 degrees over.

[Marsvinet]

The links are broken because the comments BKthunder made broke rule 1.16

[bkthunder]

The links are broken because the comments BKthunder made broke rule 1.16

 

Yeah that's correct, and I'm not going to paraphrase everything.

However, have a look at the NATOPS and search for the titles in the post (e.g. intake drag) and you will definitely find the full paragraph ;)

[ChickenSim]

Want to offer a correction that Force Correlate isn't missing.

 

It's not a feature of the 65F, the confusion stems from us currently having a 65G instead.

[CoBlue]

Shouldn't this thread be a sticky?

 

Also throttle detent, when?

There is currently no way to trip the JPTL by pushing the throttle through it. I believe this is done IRL by pushing through a detent that will prevent movement of the throttle too fast. Perhaps something where movement of the users throttle above a certain speed will trip the JPTL?

IRL it is a 35-lb. trip sensor.

When I brought this to Razbam's attention back in December 2017, they told me they intended to include this as a button press or modifier (they mentioned something like their Mirage solution for a similar "hard stop" there).I do not know how much of the DECU, MFS, or JPTL systems are modeled or simulated in high fidelity, beyond what they should look like in certain regimes.

 

 

 

 

[Marsvinet]

It could possibly be set as a sticky, but I don't think that it is necessary. I feel that pretty much all the major areas have been covered by my summary and the replies in the thread. With that I expect that Razbam has an internal list that cover at least what has been brought forward in this thread, hopefully using this thread as a source. So no need to beat the dead horse just yet.

[Harlikwin]

AGM-122 Primary & Hot mode. Missing Cage/Uncage functionality. Missing HUD symbology for caged seeker. Missing symbology when uncaged seeker symbology is HUD limited. Sensitivity should increase when uncaged.

 

TPOD - Laser Spot Search. Video does not freeze when in search mode.

 

Add to that Sidearm seems to be way too accurate for what it is. Compare it to the harm and how often it misses the target. Plus the sidearm warhead is very small relatively speaking. Sidearm only can home on 7 bands, so its likely it shouldn't be able to pick up EWR or other low band radars.

 

[TLTeo]

To be fair, the implementation of the HARM is also a bit dodgy compared to the Viper, so having a ARM that's a bit off is not unique to the Harrier.

[Harlikwin]

To be fair, the implementation of the HARM is also a bit dodgy compared to the Viper, so having a ARM that's a bit off is not unique to the Harrier.

 

I mean, yes and no. The sidearm is pretty much an LD10 (also badly modeled IMO), and it should really be somewhat worse than the HARM. I.e. if the radar goes off it has a pretty good chance to miss, most likely same with sidelobes (i.e. search radars) etc. It should be much more like a upgraded Shrike/Standard ARM.

[Fri13]

Please update the first post as updates are made, did it properly or not.

[Fri13]

Hopefully tomorrow when the final 2.5.x series patch comes out, we get to hear more about the added features for the Harrier and what to see from 2.7 update in March than just APKWS II rockets added to it.

 

 

[Marsvinet]

I will take a look at the first post and see what is in and isn't after the patch drops today. Have not been keeping track of the Harrier for a while, so I hope to see some progress.

[Fri13]

3 hours ago, Marsvinet said:

I will take a look at the first post and see what is in and isn't after the patch drops today. Have not been keeping track of the Harrier for a while, so I hope to see some progress.

 

I think these three things are already in:

 

• WS button toggles MAV FOV
• DMT slave to sidewinder
• [TPOD data such as coordinate display, north arrow etc]

At least when I select IRMV with SSS Up, I can use NWS button to toggle between WFOV and NFOV.

If you mean that there should be same for laser or LST, then that is of course a another thing.

 

The DMT slaving to Sidewinder was added in last patch. Did test it early January and it did - now thinking, work properly so SEAM mode and DMT slewing was there.

The TPOD at least show coordinates and compass rose. But the compass rose gets twisted very oddly sometimes so that you can't make out from it much. And the TPOD can deliver 100% correct coordinates instantly etc, you know the common problem in "magical knowledge" in Harrier sensors.

 

The upcoming patch today is having a couple things likely as reported in:

 

• Fixed: TD symbol missing dot in center (fixed with SVG)
• Fixed: DMT HUD symbology

 

[Marsvinet]

I think I got all the updated things. Please holler if otherwise

[dorianR666]

8 hours ago, Fri13 said:

north arrow

the north arrow is unfortunately bugged.

it displays direction to north in relation aircrafts point of view, not direction to north in relation to TGP point of view.

in other words, as you move designation 360 around your plane, the arrow wont rotate at all. making it entirely pointless.

 

razbam says its correct though.

[Fri13]

11 minutes ago, dorianR666 said:

the north arrow is unfortunately bugged.

it displays direction to north in relation aircrafts point of view, not direction to north in relation to TGP point of view.

in other words, as you move designation 360 around your plane, the arrow wont rotate at all. making it entirely pointless.

 

razbam says its correct though.

 

Why it wouldn't be correct?

 

I do not understand the compass rose thing fully, nor the INS slewing that should be done in polar coordination.

 

Like you are sitting in a cockpit, observing something with TPOD. Now you are same time listening radio and you hear a lot of communications with the compass values. East, South, North etc. So why would the TPOD show you that what is your aircraft heading in TPOD, when you have a HUD and you have other main means to look where you are flying like EHSDI? Why you need a third method, inaccurate as value for that to know where you fly?

 

Isn't it more important that when you observe something, that you know what directions you use for slewing (INS mode) and to use to move TPOD around the current position?

Like squad that you are observing around calls "North of us...." so you know to what direction you are suppose to slew the TPOD to see what happens at North?

Or you find something and you talk "East - South-East of your location...." Why you have the crosshair with meters scale so you know to tell the estimated range like "50 meters east of you".

 

I thought that the INS slewing mode is as well locked to compass so UP is same as NORTH, RIGHT is same as EAST and so on. So you can quickly and easily switch from TPOD slewing mode from point of view to compass rose mode so when you hear "East from us", then you just SSS Up for INS mode, and push to right and regardless your position or attitude, the TPOD gets slewed toward East.

 

 

[dorianR666]

1 minute ago, Fri13 said:

 

Why it wouldn't be correct?

 

Because in all other planes in DCS it works the other way. Seems unlikely Harrier specifically has a totally different north arrow behaviour.

And again, its useless. You already know where north is from aircraft point of view from multiple other instruments, including HUD.

 

10 minutes ago, Fri13 said:

Like squad that you are observing around calls "North of us...." so you know to what direction you are suppose to slew the TPOD to see what happens at North?

Exactly. What you describe is not possible with the current north arrow in Harrier.

Compare Harrier with Hornet for example. Rotate the TGP around the plane and watch the north arrow and see for yourself. Its difficult to explain in words.

[Fri13]

7 hours ago, dorianR666 said:

Because in all other planes in DCS it works the other way. Seems unlikely Harrier specifically has a totally different north arrow behaviour.

And again, its useless. You already know where north is from aircraft point of view from multiple other instruments, including HUD.

 

Exactly. What you describe is not possible with the current north arrow in Harrier.

Compare Harrier with Hornet for example. Rotate the TGP around the plane and watch the north arrow and see for yourself. Its difficult to explain in words.

 

Sorry, I do get what you say. But I am willing to give Razbam a benefit of doubt that they would know what they claim.

For me it doesn't make any sense. And why it doesn't make any sense?

 

Because I know that compass rose, coordinates and such, they are from the Litening targeting pod and not from the aircraft!

 

They are overlays from the TPOD own GPS unit and are embedded to the video feed that Harrier only shows. The customers can decide that what kind data is shown and how if they want to pay, but I must maintain possibility that I can be wrong. But regardless of all that, it just doesn't make sense that TPOD would repeat so many other instruments with a such generic information as 4-way compass rose so that pilot would get "about idea" where they are flying?