AIM-120 very often desynced between clients

[falconzx]

We're encountering another BIG issue with new 120s in MP, in terms of De-sync and inconsistency of events observed between CLIENTS.

 

If you use those new missiles in a private server and you observe from 5-6 different clients what that 120 does, you will face 5-6 different trajectories, and endings. (in ext views, but it's easier comparing Tacviews)

 

Even some of them observe the missile exploding on target, the target doesn't die. In other different cases, the target tacview shows the missile as defeated doing loops and he suddenly explode without reasons (for him) because the server and the launching client tacview shows a direct hit.

 

Against Chaffs same story, on TACVIEWS of some clients you see that missile turning on chaffs, on some other client's TACVIEWS you see the same missile keep tracking target correctly!

 

This is completely ruining our MP experience, the fake explosion with F-16C's GBU12 was the first symptom of this netcode problems, and we urgently need a fix about it...

 

Another bad story about this NETCODE is the fact you cannot do fast manouvers like High-G barrel rolls, because it generates LAG and because of that you do a missile successful evasion. That's a big problem in terms of realism and MP balance and fairplay.

[AH_Solid_Snake]

I dont think this is limited to the AIM120, I recently started running a dedicated server for my online squadron and we've seen multiple missiles desync between clients almost at random.

 

 

The most egregious in our tests (i should still have both my local tacview and the server tacview) were the AIM7 and AIM54.

 

 

We've had instances of AIM54s passing through AI aircraft without detonating from anyones perspective (not proximity, actually phasing through the model) and more often AIM7s that track very differently based on perspective.

 

 

It seems in most instances the client state wins so if the client see's a good track followed by a splash then the server accepts this and on the server tacview you see an AIM7 miss entirely (usually going balistic off the rail) followed by an AI being destroyed seemingly at random.

 

 

The only missile we've never seen desync is the AIM9 but that might be because the smaller time of flight doesnt allow for much time to desync.

[dorianR666]

It seems in most instances the client state wins

shooting client decides hits. thats why other clients and server may see missiles fly through the target and not explode, their simulation is purely visual and doesnt count.

[noxyd]

Is this being addressed ? 

 

I regularly see cases where Tacview says a missile actually hit, but on my end nothing happened and I'm still flying. 

See attached, my ping is 10-15 ms range on this server, and I'm not doing any crazy evasive maneuvers.

 

Note that the date is not accurate, this is from Dec 24th 2020.

 

 

Edited December 29, 2020 by noxyd

[DoctorVixen]

I also have these problems, also after the first time spawned. i seem to be unable to get any missile hits, in tacview i don't even see myself anymore, only the first spawn.

 

growling sidewinder server?

Edited January 4, 2021 by DoctorVixen

[Csgo GE oh yeah]

On 6/24/2020 at 12:50 AM, dorianR666 said:

shooting client decides hits. thats why other clients and server may see missiles fly through the target and not explode, their simulation is purely visual and doesnt count.

Wait wait hold up ... Not the server !??!@#!@#

[dorianR666]

2 hours ago, Csgo GE oh yeah said:

Wait wait hold up ... Not the server !??!@#!@#

no, the shooting client.

[Csgo GE oh yeah]

brb writing 20 million haxx'z. -_- 

[GGTharos]

It was done this way to prevent certain hacks and this was successful.   It used to be the target client who controlled the missile a very, very long time ago.

 

You can complain about it all you want, the issue at this point isn't who controls the missile - it's that there is no sync, so 'desync' is really not appropriate.   The only action that is transferred is the fire command/missile spawn, and then impact if there is one.   Everything in-between is simulated on any client that isn't the shooter, so there's a change that each client (including the server) might see something different.

 

Implementing some rudimentary synchronization would be a nice start.

Edited January 9, 2021 by GGTharos

[Csgo GE oh yeah]

I honestly thought that in every multiplayer game synchronisation/lag compensation MUST be present. It's been in every game since the beginning of multiplayer
(20 years ago)
I understand a shooter is 'different' in a sense but the same principle applies no ? Also making this all client based, isn't that making things way too easy for cheats ?
There is no cheat problem in DCS thank god, so i don't think that should be the reason for server based hit calculation but some synchronisation seems very needed. Especially with the high pings in DCS. 

 

Edited January 10, 2021 by Csgo GE oh yeah

[dorianR666]

8 minutes ago, Csgo GE oh yeah said:

I honestly thought that in every multiplayer game synchronisation/lag compensation MUST be present. It's been in every game since the beginning of multiplayer (20 years ago)

multiplayer in DCS seems to be a bit of an afterthought.

 

bad sync, no mission planner, some triggers not working for clients (scenery remove), fc3 planes not receiving datalink contacts from other clients, jtac task not being able to handle two clients in one flight, and so on.

 

but it used to be worse in the past.

Edited January 10, 2021 by dorianR666

[Csgo GE oh yeah]

Yeah they don't really care about multiplayer, which is kind of understandable considering the low numbers . 
But maybe those online numbers would be higher if the experience was better. 
Not sure if DCS could ever 'take off' like other multiplayer games, but it would be awesome if it would. 
It's not that the general public hates flying games so .... Why not right ?

Edited January 10, 2021 by Csgo GE oh yeah

[DoctorVixen]

I think it's a big mistake not to focus on multiplayer,  multiplayer gaming is what helps to form a community. There used to be not much need for multiplayer with only an a10 and maybe a ka50...but now....

Probably multiplayer is what will make dcs big....it's should have focus....

 

If the client decides hits, why does mine always decide to shoot missiles that wont track, when i watch the track file i am not locking up the target on radar but seem to move the cursor around on the radar in a range of 160nm wich i never use, not locking targets and shooting missiles just maddog, then i crash into the ground....complete fantasy this track file....however maybe the track file is what is really happening and when i actually fly i think i lock stuff on radar but it's fake?  

 

It's very frustrating, u can't watch the track file because its bugged. and you are firing bvr missilles from within mar keep the track supported till pitbull, enemy doesnt even evade and its a miss.....its a miss because its in multiplayer...if i try to do it single player everything is working as expected. (ace ai, that evades when fired at so no drone).

 

maybe someone can make a mod. server should decide on hits.

Edited January 12, 2021 by DoctorVixen