Possibility of Mig 21 Landing and aerobraking as seen IRL videos.

[AeriaGloria]

You can aero-brake just about any aircraft with tricycle landing gear as long as the elevators have enough control effect. Doesn't matter what brand of plane it is.

 

Just hold the nose up after touchdown and there ya go. Some planes will plunk the nose gear down hard after main gear touchdown, so you have to 'grab' it with back-stick and hang onto it--ideally without dragging the exhaust nozzles on the runway, which really miffs the maintenance crew :)

 

 

I'm lazy so I just use the drag chute.

 

 

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Well if you ever do it in a MiG-21 tell us how or upload a track, because as far as I’ve ever seen there’s one video of Ironhand keeping the nose up for maybe second during a slightly fast landing, but it still can’t be held the way it can in videos of landings. I do think the flight model is pretty close, but if you try it in 21 you will find it very difficult

[rossmum]

Shmal posted a video of a successful aerobraking a while ago. It's possible, it's just difficult to do, especially if you're paranoid about a tail strike like I tend to be.

[AeriaGloria]

Was it done with a parachute?

[rossmum]

My bad, it was a touch-and-go without the nose dropping. Memory's getting hazy. :doh:

 

I'll have to muck around and see if I can get it to work myself. I haven't had much luck aerobraking anything, though. It's a little awkward with no stick extension and the risk of a tailstrike.

[klarc]

It is absolutely possible to do it every time, but you need to understand why it is a hard thing to do. There are a couple of things to consider:

 

 

1st: main landing gear of MiG-21 is positioned way back on the airframe, behind center of gravity of the plane. So when you touchdown and the main wheel tires make contact on ground, there is some friction force. Combined with gravity force / vertical descent rate on touchdown, the result is the whole aircraft wants to 'trip forward' and slam the forward wheel on the ground.

 

 

2nd: the plane must be flown by the book! It is one of the hardest aircraft to master and its no wonder they only allowed the elite pilots of all military pilots to fly it because it can easily get ahead of you. What i am trying to say is dont exceed maximum landing weight. 800L maximum fuel without stores is the limit for landing. Not only there is danger that the tires may blow but the added above maximum weight is problematic - described in 1st point.

 

 

So how do you do it then?

 

Well once you practice enough it becomes easy. I usualy do the standard approach, established on final leg at 370 kph, about 320 kph / 80m altitude crossing inner beacon keeping about 12 units of AoA on indicator, slowing down to 280-290 when coming above runway, establish level flight 1m above runway, keeping 280kph and 12 units of AoA and then cutting the throttle to idle. At the moment the main wheels touch the ground i pull on the stick and keep the nose up (about 10 AoA) untill 240 kph and then slowly stop the pull and bring the stick to center to let the nosewheel settle on the ground. If i slam the NW at touchdown on the ground i consider it a bad landing.

 

 

 

The key is good throttle control to keep correct speed and AoA and to establish a 0m/s descent rate 1m above RW just before touchdown. Practice makes perfect.

 

 

 

To end this wall of text, here is a link to a short video of polish MiG-21's landing on a highway (i believe it's from a polish movie: Between earth and sky):

 

 

 

Well, they're not the bis version so i dont think they have SPS installed but in principle its the same. Note the elevator movement - the impulsive pull on the stick on touchdown, and not even they can keep the nosewheel in the air everytime.

 

 

 

Happy MiG-21 landings fellow virtual pilots. :joystick::book: :)

[AeriaGloria]

Thanks for the write up!

[klarc]

I come back here to correct myself from the post i wrote before. It's one thing to be 'the wise guy' and writing how it should be done, but actually showing how to do it is another thing. This time i have tracks .

 

 

I fired up DCS and shot some approaches. So before someone starts accusing me of spreading missinformation, here are my final remarks:

 

 

1st of all when passing the inner marker at 12 units of AoA you need to decrease speed (320 to 290) and terminate descent to get just above runway without touching down. AoA in this phase goes from 12 to 15-18 units (sometimes up to 20) and should be held there untill mainwheel touchdown. There is no tailstrike danger - i believe that happens at 25 or so (did not test) but 20 AoA is still very safe. Cutting power to idle is not necessary when mainwheels are still in the air, but right after touchdown (easier to keep NW in air, you loose some runway length tho).

 

Next thing is aerobraking. Most effective when holding 20 AoA after main wheels touchdown. The nosewheel will drop down itself without adjusting the stick back to neutral. Place it there only after all 3 wheels are on the ground. That happens at around 200 kph. You can force it even lower (in the 180 range), with more progressive back stick pull to maximum - movement of the elevator must be carefully synchronized with nosewheel droping down in the deceleration process on main wheels.

 

 

 

6 tracks attached (checked that they're not corrupted). MiG is loaded with full cannon ammo (for roll stability), fuel at touchdown is 600-700 L, brake parachute was not used. All landings made at Nalchik airport, 3 in calm condition without winds and 3 with extreme crosswind and added turbulence. Made in DCS Open Beta version 2.5.6.54046

 

I hope this helps anyone.

MiG-21-landing-1.trk

MiG-21-landing-2.trk

MiG-21-landing-3.trk

MiG-21-Xwind-landing-1.trk

MiG-21-Xwind-landing-2.trk

MiG-21-Xwind-landing-3.trk

[Frederf]

No one is saying you can't maintain a nose high attitude while rolling but the stick required between 1mm level above runway and in contact with runway is not even close to the same.

[some1]

To end this wall of text, here is a link to a short video of polish MiG-21's landing on a highway (i believe it's from a polish movie: Between earth and sky):

 

That video contradicts your statements.

 

Look at

None of the aircraft slams the nose to the ground. They are more likely to bounce back in the air on hard touchdown than drop the nose. And it doesn't look like any pilot make a special attempt to aerobrake by pulling the stick - they just let the aircraft settle down and begin normal braking.

[Aluminum Donkey]

Good ol' MiG-21.

 

The airplane that flies like a shotgun slug, with the top speed of a shotgun slug, has the wing loading of a shotgun slug, has the cost-effectiveness and combat-effectiveness of a shotgun slug, and lands like a shotgun slug :D

 

 

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[Dirty Rotten Flieger]

Some of the most satisfying moments in the Fishbed were nailing an aero break after a successful PvP online sorte.

 

I've been using the SPS ... I approach just below 300km/h and without too much concern for perfect speed and decent rate but then just before touchdown I give it a little burst of the throttle just enough for the blown flaps to cancel out the descent rate to almost nothing just as the main wheels touch down.

 

For me the timing of this burst of blown flaps powered lift is what makes it work. The front wheel will usually still try to come down but this movement is gentle enough for a little back stick to counter if i get that burst of power right.

 

Very satisfying indeed.