DCS World Patch Notes Discussion Thread

[schmiefel]

I agree with most of the stuff mentioned above. Me as a very dedicated and thankful user would be ok with a higher fixed price or a subscription-based amount for DCS to be a polished, finished and optimized program. Actually, you can see dcs as a pseudo professional program. But probably under funded to reach these professional status and expectations. A lot of its users expect professional quality given the nature of the branch and the complexities it goes with this. A lot of professional software is (sometimes insanely!) expensive (protools, Cubase, final cut, premiere, photoshop.... prepar3D). Not saying I want insanely expensive software but just saying I would pay a lot more to have my beloved software with equal and linear expectations. Wether that is good for the business or a reachable goal given the niche branche it is remains another question. But man, what I would pay to have DCS with:

 

- optimized (engine)- new engine?

- finished (modules)

- finished/realistic assets

- finished/improved weather and clouds

- bug free (or 97% at least)

- dynamic campaign

- polished in all aspects

- ...

 

That would be worth so much! I’d pay hundreds for that!

 

However, still enjoying DCS a lot and thankfull it exists.

 

As this thread is for patch discussion I just want to give some food for thoughts that there is even in patching things a big difference between

 

a) productive software = that is software that lets you run your business (!) and mostly earn money with it or deliver training aids that have a public interest (like professional military and flight simulators that cost hundreds of millions dollar, have professional payed support, quality assurance etc.)

b) entertainment software = that earns (at least) money for the developer / publisher and returns fun and entertainmant to the customers

 

There is maybe c) entertainment software that is used for professional (= making money with it) entertainment, but that needs most of the time different and more expensive licences etc. and doesn't happen with DCS to my knowledge so far.

 

Therefore delivering patches for DCS is mostly to keep the publisher in business by entertaining its customers with better functionality and quality and not to professionalize its product itself for a productive professional market.

[BIGNEWY]

Hi all

 

We are moving to longer patch cycles to enable more time for testing.

 

I have updated the patch status post with our next planned date for open beta.

 

https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=273255

 

Next open beta patch is planned for 15th July

[speed-of-heat]

Hi all

 

We are moving to longer patch cycles to enable more time for testing.

 

I have updated the patch status post with our next planned date for open beta.

 

https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=273255

 

Next open beta patch is planned for 15th July

 

Bravo sir :thumbup:

 

I hope a longer release cycle works well for you from a QA pov!

[imacken]

Hi all

 

We are moving to longer patch cycles to enable more time for testing.

 

I have updated the patch status post with our next planned date for open beta.

 

https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=273255

 

Next open beta patch is planned for 15th July

 

Excellent idea in principle, but that does mean we are stuck with the unreadable, sun-soaked DDIs on the Hornet for a month!

[zildac]

May not be ideal but the LCD DDI mod is a good workaround as is the display readability MOD.

[imacken]

May not be ideal but the LCD DDI mod is a good workaround as is the display readability MOD.

 

Have you got a link to those? Maybe the one I am using, but just to make sure.

[Rosebud47]

Hi all

 

We are moving to longer patch cycles to enable more time for testing.

 

I have updated the patch status post with our next planned date for open beta.

 

https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=273255

 

Next open beta patch is planned for 15th July

 

:thumbup: very good move to provide better quality with DCS World.

Next step definitely has to be to stop the open beta/early access madness to more reasonable situation, like having access to open beta/early access only for a short period, like four weeks before mayor updates/new stuff is being brought to DCS World for registered public stress test only.

Hotfixes for single broken functionality within the modules should be separated and implemented as quick as possible.

There´s no way to provide quality than to focus 100% on to the stable version for development and users.

[zildac]

Have you got a link to those? Maybe the one I am using, but just to make sure.

 

 

Sure, this is the LCD DDI MOD (White text by default)

 

 

https://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/en/files/3306396/

 

 

And this is the display readability MOD (useful for higher res screens but clashes with the above)

 

 

https://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/en/files/3301897/

 

 

The LCD MOD with the white text works well for me tbh...

[speed-of-heat]

yep i use both of them (or bits of them)

[zildac]

yep i use both of them (or bits of them)

 

 

I really like the LCD MOD, you can also use it with the "dusty" cockpit MOD but the pit overwrites the LCDs (I think) and the CRT's are very reflective so may negate the benefit.

[imacken]

Sure, this is the LCD DDI MOD (White text by default)

 

 

https://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/en/files/3306396/

 

 

And this is the display readability MOD (useful for higher res screens but clashes with the above)

 

 

https://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/en/files/3301897/

 

 

The LCD MOD with the white text works well for me tbh...

 

Thanks. Yes, those are the ones I have tried.

 

The reflectivce glass on the DDIs is very interesting. Not sure how realistic it is though.

Edited June 16, 2020 by imacken

[Eaglewings]

@Bignewy

 

Is there any news on the dcs update servers?

I still cannot update beyond 2.5.6.49798.

I have seen some other guys having same issue.

[BIGNEWY]

@Bignewy

 

Is there any news on the dcs update servers?

I still cannot update beyond 2.5.6.49798.

I have seen some other guys having same issue.

 

Make sure you are on open beta, Latest stable version is 2.5.6.49798

 

Try replacing your updater using the troubleshoot here

 

http://updates.digitalcombatsimulator.com/

 

if that does not help please contact support directly

Edited June 16, 2020 by BIGNEWY

[zildac]

Thanks. Yes, those are the ones I have tried.

 

The reflectivce glass on the DDIs is very interresting. Not sure how realistic it is though.

 

 

:thumbup:

[donkeyrider]

I think you are too quick to conclude the main problem is QA. I think its more likely their main problem is an old game engine that is being held together with spit and glue, and that is constantly being urgently updated to accommodate all the new content, but no one can afford the time to fundamentally rewrite parts that need rewriting. Some else called recently called it "code debt" and this exactly that it is.

 

Ive seen similar problems too often. I once got hired as a project manager in a company making point of sale software. In that company customers literally had a direct phone line to developers (I kid you not) who where constantly asked to add features urgently. Features that the base layer often had no provisions for and that had to be shoe horned in under extreme time pressure. The software base layer was neglected and abused for 10 years because no customer ever asks to upgrade the database engine and API layer to something that is more robust and more manageable. Even an army of testers would not provide bug free stable releases in that scenario.

 

The only solution was to stop devs answering the phone, have sales reps stop promising customers new features that weren't already in there , and lock up a team of devs in a basement with no phone and rewrite the db and APIs.

 

I didnt manage to convince the company owners of that, they said it would hurt sales and be far too costly. They wanted to be able to bill almost every hour that their devs worked. So I left. And a few years later the company went bankrupt.

 

ED risks getting in to a similar situation. code debt is piling up The problem isnt just QA or project management, its the business model that only benefits from adding new content that may break the core or require urgent changes, and almost nothing from improving the underlying core. As long as business is good, proper management may allocate the required resources to maintaining that core. But the moment it starts going wrong, the business model forces them to focus on what generates short term revenue, even if that means adding substantially to their long term (code) debt. It becomes a viscous cycle thats extremely difficult to get out of.

 

I think you hit the nail on the head with this post. I feel at times that ED is too generous. The base game is free and continually updated so it means the only revenue is new modules / maps etc.

 

The long term solution is to move to an X-Plane type pricing model where new versions are a pay for item. As a community we are expecting ED to develop dynamic campaigns, new clouds, lighting models and have no direct revenue for this. It doesn't make sense to me, especially for a niche product like this. It's not unreasonable to pay, say $40-$50, for DCS 3.0 to underwrite that development.

[BIGNEWY]

Hi all,

 

where possible please keep this thread for patch note discussion.

 

thank you

[ThorBrasil]

The next update is scheduled for July 15. I hope that ED manages to solve a good part of the problems. I'm hoping that everything will work out. :beer:

Source: https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=273255

[stormrider]

I think you are too quick to conclude the main problem is QA. I think its more likely their main problem is an old game engine that is being held together with spit and glue, and that is constantly being urgently updated to accommodate all the new content, but no one can afford the time to fundamentally rewrite parts that need rewriting. Some else called recently called it "code debt" and this exactly that it is.

 

Ive seen similar problems too often. I once got hired as a project manager in a company making point of sale software. In that company customers literally had a direct phone line to developers (I kid you not) who where constantly asked to add features urgently. Features that the base layer often had no provisions for and that had to be shoe horned in under extreme time pressure. The software base layer was neglected and abused for 10 years because no customer ever asks to upgrade the database engine and API layer to something that is more robust and more manageable. Even an army of testers would not provide bug free stable releases in that scenario.

 

The only solution was to stop devs answering the phone, have sales reps stop promising customers new features that weren't already in there , and lock up a team of devs in a basement with no phone and rewrite the db and APIs.

 

I didnt manage to convince the company owners of that, they said it would hurt sales and be far too costly. They wanted to be able to bill almost every hour that their devs worked. So I left. And a few years later the company went bankrupt.

 

ED risks getting in to a similar situation. code debt is piling up The problem isnt just QA or project management, its the business model that only benefits from adding new content that may break the core or require urgent changes, and almost nothing from improving the underlying core. As long as business is good, proper management may allocate the required resources to maintaining that core. But the moment it starts going wrong, the business model forces them to focus on what generates short term revenue, even if that means adding substantially to their long term (code) debt. It becomes a viscous cycle thats extremely difficult to get out of.

 

 

 

 

Agreed. I have seen that movie before.

[gunterlund21]

BIG Im glad to hear about the new patch schedule. Hopefully this will bring quality to each patch versus quantity.

[Grandma]

Agreed. I have seen that movie before.

 

 

Same story for the software company I worked for - glad ED is getting the hint

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[twistking]

Hi all

 

We are moving to longer patch cycles to enable more time for testing.

 

I have updated the patch status post with our next planned date for open beta.

 

https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=273255

 

Next open beta patch is planned for 15th July

 

 

Seems reasonable. Hope that works out well!

 

I hope that will indirectly improve stable version also.

 

Have you also looked into the possibility of doing hotfix-patches for stable-version, instead of having to wait for the whole beta cycle, if only a small game-breaking issue made it through?

Generally i find stable to work "good enough", but there have been multiple occasions were a major bug got through to stable and there was no fix for month...

It would be very beneficial for the health of stable branch (and mental health of user base), if there was the possibility to quickly hotfix a problem on stable.

 

Thanks.

[Lenux]

Hi all

 

We are moving to longer patch cycles to enable more time for testing.

 

I have updated the patch status post with our next planned date for open beta.

 

https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=273255

 

Next open beta patch is planned for 15th July

 

New weather engine and clouds are coming, pretty soon

Hopefully

[Shadow KT]

Hi all

 

We are moving to longer patch cycles to enable more time for testing.

 

I have updated the patch status post with our next planned date for open beta.

 

https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=273255

 

Next open beta patch is planned for 15th July

 

Can we get a hot fix for the horizon bloom before that, my eyes are bleached :music_whistling::lol:

 

Besides that, good I guess. I hope to see the AI crashed and path finding sorted

[bart]

Sure, this is the LCD DDI MOD (White text by default)

 

 

https://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/en/files/3306396/

 

Excellent mod, just tried it. Thanks for sharing it.

 

On topic.....Good idea about the updates, just hope we do get hot fixes and module specific fixes as soon as they are available as was said earlier. A four week wait for a simple but essential fix is a loooong wait!

[zildac]