Question about upcoming radar search target hot lines

[Santi871]

In wags' latest videos we can see the RWS symbology for search targets has changed - they are now a white box with a velocity vector coming out of it.

 

 

Is this accurate? I was under the impression the "hot lines" that show in RWS search targets can only point fully upwards (opening target) or fully downwards (closing target)

Edited December 7, 2019 by Santi871

[Harker]

Isn't RWS supposed to just show detection bricks, without velocity vectors altogether?

[nighthawk2174]

From all the manuals I've seen this is accurate - the full blocks - I've never heard of or seen any indication that this changed from earlier blocks. As too the direction they point it does seem a bit odd they are pointing in different directions maybe just a bug?

Edited November 26, 2019 by nighthawk2174

[DefaultFace]

The direction they point has to do with the radar being a B-Scope display I'm pretty sure. The HSD will show the true heading, but I'm pretty sure the radar shows the trails such that a trail pointing towards the bottom of the screen is coming directly at you, and towards the top is flying directly away. ie targets flying parallel will not necessarily show parallel tracks.

 

As to why the lines show up in RWS idk.

[Santi871]

Isn't RWS supposed to just show detection bricks, without velocity vectors altogether?

 

RWS can't determine velocity vectors, but it can determine closure rate.

 

Certain viper versions show that with hotlines, which is what I showed in the second picture. Certain versions only show the bricks. But I've never seen full aspect vectors in RWS, hence the question.

[Beamscanner]

This has to be WIP.

 

All single hit detections should lack a velocity vector. This should be true for both TWS and RWS search hits (non-trackfiles)

 

A single detection (small square with inbound/outbound line) has range, azimuth, elevation and doppler.

 

Doppler alone wont tell you the targets vector. It only tells you if the target has positive or negative doppler shift.

 

You need two or more correlated detections (ie trackfiles) to determine target heading.

[Beamscanner]

The direction they point has to do with the radar being a B-Scope display I'm pretty sure. The HSD will show the true heading, but I'm pretty sure the radar shows the trails such that a trail pointing towards the bottom of the screen is coming directly at you, and towards the top is flying directly away. ie targets flying parallel will not necessarily show parallel tracks.

 

As to why the lines show up in RWS idk.

 

The APG-68 did get the ability to add up/down lines on raw hits (even in RWS). Its not a velocity vector, just says if target doppler is + or -

 

The real question is which model in what year got this capability.

[Frederf]

RWS search contacts have current position (white brick), faded history (up to four progressively faded bricks), and radial velocity line.

 

Santi is absolutely correct that the display is wrong. Radial velocity on a B-scope can only be vertically upward or downward. The lines being at other angles is nonsense. Remember it's a Doppler radar and a single return is enough to display radial velocity. RWS for contacts never shows full target velocity vector, only the radial component.

 

Only tracks have full target velocity vector and tracks require correlation of more than one return.

 

APG-68v5 on 4.2 tape is plenty new for this feature.

[Santi871]

APG-68v5 on 4.2 tape is plenty new for this feature.

 

It's modern enough indeed, but the question is whether it was removed at some point. Perhaps to prevent cluttering the display.

 

 

And

 

 

Full blown velocity vectors is bug/wip/needs to be fixed though, I think.

Edited November 27, 2019 by Santi871

[Harker]

RWS can't determine velocity vectors, but it can determine closure rate.

 

Certain viper versions show that with hotlines, which is what I showed in the second picture. Certain versions only show the bricks. But I've never seen full aspect vectors in RWS, hence the question.

Yeah, with that, I agree. I misunderstood your original question as to mean that you though that velocities were resolved in RWS and the up/down hotlines were just a compact way of presenting them to the pilot (contacts with vectors towards you have a down line and away from you, an up line). As everyone else says, AFAIK, RWS bricks should carry info for position coordinates and Doppler only, not fully resolved vectors, so I agree, this seems like a bug/WIP.

[Santi871]

RWS search targets should *not* have a full heading vector

 

Hi,

 

RWS search target symbology is bugged:

 

 

1. RWS search targets can only display fully hot or fully cold vector based on closure rate - called Search Doppler Vector (later renamed to Enhanced Search Display), ie target is getting closer or further away. Not full heading vector.

 

2. For older tapes (M5.2 and below), Search Doppler Vector is only displayed for RWS search targets under the cursor. Otherwise, RWS search target is simply an upright filled white square.

 

I can provide track later if really needed, just busy right now and wanted to get this reported.

[QuiGon]

Related discussion thread: https://forums.eagle.ru/showthread.php?t=256044

[Frederf]

From other thread interesting detail: " For older tapes (M5.2 and below), Search Doppler Vector is only displayed for RWS search targets under the cursor."

 

Since DCS is 4.2 tape only the cursor contact should get it's radial velocity line.

[amalahama]

Up. This needs to be fixed