Supmua Posted November 13, 2019 Author Share Posted November 13, 2019 (edited) Realsimulator F-16SGRH Tips Can the rotary switch (including status LEDs) and the extra analog axes be used only with the FSSB R3 base, or would it work, say, with the Virpil CM2 base as well? Or can I use the Bluetooth connection to utilize all these extra functions? If so, is there any perceivable input lag with BT? BT is very prone to it apparently, especially on poorly configured host adapters. Also, can someone explain how I am to interpret the fact that the grip itself has "roll, pitch & yaw axes" to configure? With BT, you will have full functionality of the stick plus the ability to use the built-in roll pitch and yaw axes. There is minimal latency with any wireless technology, think of it as a PlayStation or Xbox controller. When you connect the stick to a gimbal base such as Virpil, you will have an option in DCS to bind axis input using the stick itself or the Virpil’s input, or any combination you want. For example, when I put it on my WarBRD base I would just use pitch and roll input from the base since the latency is superior, but I could also utilize extra Z(yaw) axis from the stick itself to control the rudder input or whatever I want as long as it is an axis input (slider zoom, radar elevation, light knobs, etc.) BT can be finicky and requires the right adapter and distance for perfect functionality, since there are potential interferences from all kind of things especially if you have multiple wireless devices at home. From my personal experiences, only one adapter that I tested has perfect connection (zero interruption) at my place—and that is CSR 4.0 dongle. Edited November 13, 2019 by Supmua PC: 5800X3D/4090, 11700K/3090, 9900K/2080Ti. Joystick bases: TMW, VPC WarBRD, MT50CM2, VKB GFII, FSSB R3L Joystick grips: TM (Warthog, F/A-18C), Realsimulator (F-16SGRH, F-18CGRH), VKB (Kosmosima LH, MCG, MCG Pro), VPC MongoosT50-CM2 Throttles: TMW, Winwing Super Taurus, Logitech Throttle Quadrant, Realsimulator Throttle (soon) VR: HTC Vive/Pro, Oculus Rift/Quest 2, Valve Index, Varjo Aero, https://forum.dcs.world/topic/300065-varjo-aero-general-guide-for-new-owners/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elecsys Posted November 13, 2019 Share Posted November 13, 2019 (edited) Ok, but how can the grip by itself measure deflection in the pitch, roll & yaw axis is what I am not understanding? What is the feedback that it creates input from? Does it have a gyroscope? And furthermore, does the rotary switch (or rather the individual profiles) allow for saving multiple configurations of the analog axes as well? EDIT: Ok, never mind the second question. I figured out that different analog settings can indeed be configured with every slot. Edited November 13, 2019 by elecsys Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supmua Posted November 13, 2019 Author Share Posted November 13, 2019 Ok, but how can the grip by itself measure deflection in the pitch, roll & yaw axis is what I am not understanding? What is the feedback that it creates input from? Does it have a gyroscope? Yes. Don't think of it in terms of traditional joystick where you need to have a base and a grip. It is an electronic grip with built-in X, Y, Z axis inputs. PC: 5800X3D/4090, 11700K/3090, 9900K/2080Ti. Joystick bases: TMW, VPC WarBRD, MT50CM2, VKB GFII, FSSB R3L Joystick grips: TM (Warthog, F/A-18C), Realsimulator (F-16SGRH, F-18CGRH), VKB (Kosmosima LH, MCG, MCG Pro), VPC MongoosT50-CM2 Throttles: TMW, Winwing Super Taurus, Logitech Throttle Quadrant, Realsimulator Throttle (soon) VR: HTC Vive/Pro, Oculus Rift/Quest 2, Valve Index, Varjo Aero, https://forum.dcs.world/topic/300065-varjo-aero-general-guide-for-new-owners/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elecsys Posted November 14, 2019 Share Posted November 14, 2019 Ok, thanks. It just interesting to me. So the yaw axis must be linked to some kind of force/torque sensor then, like in their FSSB base? Btw, is the break lever an analog axis as well? (any more than that?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elecsys Posted November 14, 2019 Share Posted November 14, 2019 Also, in your example of using the wired pitch & roll of the WarBRD base instead of the wireless one's of the F16SGRH: In that scenario you would also loose the rotary switch's ability to cycle between different settings for pitch & roll, right? Or is the Virpil (or the FSSB base for that matter) able to communicate with the stick and relegate input to it, when the rotary is switched to a different slot? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supmua Posted November 14, 2019 Author Share Posted November 14, 2019 (edited) Realsimulator F-16SGRH Tips US jet sticks don’t use paddles for brakes, especially the F-16 which is what this stick is modeled after hence no brake axis. Of course, you can bind anything including brake to the yaw axis but it is going to feel weird doing that. Virpil base only acts as a pass-through conduit to provide power to the stick, some buttons may work but they’re not supported. Only FSSB R3L base provides full functionality on par with BT mode. Warthog base is fully compatible with accurate button mapping but only supports 19 DX inputs + FOV Hat instead of 64 DX inputs. Regarding the rotary switch, since the base from other brands is considered a separate device there is no ability to modify those settings via rotary switch. There may be a plan to allow use of rotary switch as a bindable switch (dial knob, etc.) but they’re still discussing pros and cons of doing that. What is coming for sure is 1. Built-in Macro function, should be a game changer since it is hardware-based without the need to run app in background. 2. Ability to modify individual DX as well as keybind inputs with 3 different parameters; pulse width, pause, and duration limit. This to me is another game changer. Edited November 14, 2019 by Supmua PC: 5800X3D/4090, 11700K/3090, 9900K/2080Ti. Joystick bases: TMW, VPC WarBRD, MT50CM2, VKB GFII, FSSB R3L Joystick grips: TM (Warthog, F/A-18C), Realsimulator (F-16SGRH, F-18CGRH), VKB (Kosmosima LH, MCG, MCG Pro), VPC MongoosT50-CM2 Throttles: TMW, Winwing Super Taurus, Logitech Throttle Quadrant, Realsimulator Throttle (soon) VR: HTC Vive/Pro, Oculus Rift/Quest 2, Valve Index, Varjo Aero, https://forum.dcs.world/topic/300065-varjo-aero-general-guide-for-new-owners/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elecsys Posted November 14, 2019 Share Posted November 14, 2019 How would you rate the performance of the wireless analog axes? Is there a large performance delta between wired and wireless? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supmua Posted November 14, 2019 Author Share Posted November 14, 2019 How would you rate the performance of the wireless analog axes? Is there a large performance delta between wired and wireless? Wireless performance depends on the fixture. If you attach the stick to a plain rod then it is not that good since it's freely moving in all directions without resistance. If you attach it to a joystick base such as Warthog or Virpil then it's pretty good (not as good as wired, but very close). If you attach it to the FSSB R3L base then it won't move since there's minimal moving mechanism, but of course in this case you would want to use force sensing mechanism from that base instead of the mechanical one. This wireless axis input is meant for people who owns personal simpit, you can do quite elaborate stuff by building your own fixture/gimbal/or whatever to support the stick. PC: 5800X3D/4090, 11700K/3090, 9900K/2080Ti. Joystick bases: TMW, VPC WarBRD, MT50CM2, VKB GFII, FSSB R3L Joystick grips: TM (Warthog, F/A-18C), Realsimulator (F-16SGRH, F-18CGRH), VKB (Kosmosima LH, MCG, MCG Pro), VPC MongoosT50-CM2 Throttles: TMW, Winwing Super Taurus, Logitech Throttle Quadrant, Realsimulator Throttle (soon) VR: HTC Vive/Pro, Oculus Rift/Quest 2, Valve Index, Varjo Aero, https://forum.dcs.world/topic/300065-varjo-aero-general-guide-for-new-owners/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supmua Posted November 22, 2019 Author Share Posted November 22, 2019 The next update will include several new functions. Things are moving quite fast on the software side now and perhaps they can start focusing on the hardware side next. Macro: press a button once and it does multiple things Pulse: hold a button down and it does multiple things Digital mouse: mouse emulation including cursor movements so you can keep your hand on the stick Shift and Toggle: similar to DCS but cover an entire input template (memory slot), switching back and forth between memory slots quickly in shift or toggle mode (in addition to dial mode). PC: 5800X3D/4090, 11700K/3090, 9900K/2080Ti. Joystick bases: TMW, VPC WarBRD, MT50CM2, VKB GFII, FSSB R3L Joystick grips: TM (Warthog, F/A-18C), Realsimulator (F-16SGRH, F-18CGRH), VKB (Kosmosima LH, MCG, MCG Pro), VPC MongoosT50-CM2 Throttles: TMW, Winwing Super Taurus, Logitech Throttle Quadrant, Realsimulator Throttle (soon) VR: HTC Vive/Pro, Oculus Rift/Quest 2, Valve Index, Varjo Aero, https://forum.dcs.world/topic/300065-varjo-aero-general-guide-for-new-owners/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wicked.- Posted November 23, 2019 Share Posted November 23, 2019 The next update will include several new functions. Things are moving quite fast on the software side now and perhaps they can start focusing on the hardware side next. Macro: press a button once and it does multiple things Pulse: hold a button down and it does multiple things Digital mouse: mouse emulation including cursor movements so you can keep your hand on the stick Shift and Toggle: similar to DCS but cover an entire input template (memory slot), switching back and forth between memory slots quickly in shift or toggle mode (in addition to dial mode). Sounds like Foxy software without the programming language..... I LIKE IT! [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Intel i9 9900K @ 5.1Ghz HT Disabled, Asus RoG Strix z390E Gaming, 64GB G.Skill Trident Z 3200, Asus RoG Strix RTX2080Ti OC @ 1.9Ghz, 1TB Samsung Evo 970Pro M.2 TM Warthog, CH Pro Pedals, Saitek Pro Rudder Pedals, Samsung 49" Curved Gaming Monitor, Samsung 50" 4KUHD TV, Acer 27" Touch Panel, CV1, Pimax 5K+, Valve Index, FSSB3 Lighting, F-16SGRH, 3 TM Cougar's and a Saitek X36 that I can't bring myself to part with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supmua Posted November 28, 2019 Author Share Posted November 28, 2019 (edited) It looks like the non-bluetooth version is coming out soon, 330 Euros. These are available for pre-order now for both L and R handed versions. There is also the pro/military version which is five grand, lol. The pre-existing (bluetooth) version is now called the collector's edition. Edited November 28, 2019 by Supmua PC: 5800X3D/4090, 11700K/3090, 9900K/2080Ti. Joystick bases: TMW, VPC WarBRD, MT50CM2, VKB GFII, FSSB R3L Joystick grips: TM (Warthog, F/A-18C), Realsimulator (F-16SGRH, F-18CGRH), VKB (Kosmosima LH, MCG, MCG Pro), VPC MongoosT50-CM2 Throttles: TMW, Winwing Super Taurus, Logitech Throttle Quadrant, Realsimulator Throttle (soon) VR: HTC Vive/Pro, Oculus Rift/Quest 2, Valve Index, Varjo Aero, https://forum.dcs.world/topic/300065-varjo-aero-general-guide-for-new-owners/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ams999 Posted November 28, 2019 Share Posted November 28, 2019 Do you know whether the non-bluetooth version only works with the R3L or also with the R3? "[...] because, basically, in this day and age, if you get to the merge and no one's died - it's not good for anybody." - Keith 'Okie' Nance "Nun siegt mal schön!" - Theodor Heuss, September 1958 "Nobody has any intention of building a wall." - Walter Ulbricht, June 1961 "Russia has no plans to invade either Ukraine or any other country." - Vladimir Chizhov, Russia's ambassador to the EU, January 2022 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
horus-DCS Posted November 28, 2019 Share Posted November 28, 2019 Realsimulator F-16SGRH Tips It looks like the non-bluetooth version is coming out soon, 330 Euros. These are available for pre-order now for both L and R handed versions. There is also the pro/military version which is five grand, lol. The pre-existing (bluetooth) version is now called the collector's edition. The collector’s edition seems to be far more expensive than pre-existing version(650 vs. 450 euros), are there any advanced features for the new edition? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supmua Posted November 28, 2019 Author Share Posted November 28, 2019 Do you know whether the non-bluetooth version only works with the R3L or also with the R3? It should be compatible with the R3, but I’m not sure about all advanced functionality since the R3 supports 4 memory slots instead of 8 and I don’t have access to one. You might find a more definitive answer in realsimulator’s own forum. PC: 5800X3D/4090, 11700K/3090, 9900K/2080Ti. Joystick bases: TMW, VPC WarBRD, MT50CM2, VKB GFII, FSSB R3L Joystick grips: TM (Warthog, F/A-18C), Realsimulator (F-16SGRH, F-18CGRH), VKB (Kosmosima LH, MCG, MCG Pro), VPC MongoosT50-CM2 Throttles: TMW, Winwing Super Taurus, Logitech Throttle Quadrant, Realsimulator Throttle (soon) VR: HTC Vive/Pro, Oculus Rift/Quest 2, Valve Index, Varjo Aero, https://forum.dcs.world/topic/300065-varjo-aero-general-guide-for-new-owners/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supmua Posted November 28, 2019 Author Share Posted November 28, 2019 The collector’s edition seems to be far more expensive than pre-existing version(650 vs. 450 euros), are there any advanced features for the new edition? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk The collector’s edition is the same as the pre-existing model that is already in several people’s hands including myself—at least this is what I was told. The previous price was due to early access discount. I think that most people wouldn’t want to bother with Bluetooth hence the conception of the wired-only model. The advanced features will probably be mostly in software, a lot of neat novel features are being developed. PC: 5800X3D/4090, 11700K/3090, 9900K/2080Ti. Joystick bases: TMW, VPC WarBRD, MT50CM2, VKB GFII, FSSB R3L Joystick grips: TM (Warthog, F/A-18C), Realsimulator (F-16SGRH, F-18CGRH), VKB (Kosmosima LH, MCG, MCG Pro), VPC MongoosT50-CM2 Throttles: TMW, Winwing Super Taurus, Logitech Throttle Quadrant, Realsimulator Throttle (soon) VR: HTC Vive/Pro, Oculus Rift/Quest 2, Valve Index, Varjo Aero, https://forum.dcs.world/topic/300065-varjo-aero-general-guide-for-new-owners/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sk000tch Posted November 29, 2019 Share Posted November 29, 2019 (edited) Supmua- so which one is the non BT then? I’ve given up my attempt to convince them to sell a throttle from HE cockpit, so time to move forward without. Can you explain which is which, best for R3L, etc Edited November 29, 2019 by sk000tch just a dude who probably doesn't know what he's talking about Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wicked.- Posted November 29, 2019 Share Posted November 29, 2019 (edited) The one that Supmua and I have is the Bluetooth version allowing you to use it without a base. I use mine with the FSSB3L and therefore do not need BT. At the time I bought it I didn’t have a choice because it was made to order. You will now have a choice between having Bluetooth or not. Not having it will cost less but will have much if not all of the features ours do when connected to the FSSB3L. In all honesty I wouldn’t buy the Bluetooth version again at the price I did. I would buy the new version without it though as the price/features are exactly what I actually wanted. Edited November 29, 2019 by Wicked.- [sIGPIC][/sIGPIC] Intel i9 9900K @ 5.1Ghz HT Disabled, Asus RoG Strix z390E Gaming, 64GB G.Skill Trident Z 3200, Asus RoG Strix RTX2080Ti OC @ 1.9Ghz, 1TB Samsung Evo 970Pro M.2 TM Warthog, CH Pro Pedals, Saitek Pro Rudder Pedals, Samsung 49" Curved Gaming Monitor, Samsung 50" 4KUHD TV, Acer 27" Touch Panel, CV1, Pimax 5K+, Valve Index, FSSB3 Lighting, F-16SGRH, 3 TM Cougar's and a Saitek X36 that I can't bring myself to part with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
horus-DCS Posted November 29, 2019 Share Posted November 29, 2019 The collector’s edition is the same as the pre-existing model that is already in several people’s hands including myself—at least this is what I was told. The previous price was due to early access discount. I think that most people wouldn’t want to bother with Bluetooth hence the conception of the wired-only model. The advanced features will probably be mostly in software, a lot of neat novel features are being developed.Ok got it. Anyway, I have early BT version too, but would buy non-BT version if I have to since it was a real pain to keep the grip connected to my BT dongles properly. This grip ensures its stability and full features only with FSSB R3L base. Sent from my KFSUWI using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supmua Posted November 29, 2019 Author Share Posted November 29, 2019 Supmua- so which one is the non BT then? I’ve given up my attempt to convince them to sell a throttle from HE cockpit, so time to move forward without. Can you explain which is which, best for R3L, etc More info here, too many to list or describe. http://realsimulator.com/html/f16sgrh.html In general, the best version would be the collector's edition since it has extra electronic module, bluetooth, gyro sensors, etc. but most people will probably never use those including myself since mine is always connected to the R3L base (sometimes Warbird or Warthog base but just for the purpose of testing). If you have the R3 or R3L base and are not planning to use the stick with other bases, then the regular version is plenty since it is a lot cheaper and there would be really no extra functionality that you would want as most of the heavy liftings will be done through the R3L base. PC: 5800X3D/4090, 11700K/3090, 9900K/2080Ti. Joystick bases: TMW, VPC WarBRD, MT50CM2, VKB GFII, FSSB R3L Joystick grips: TM (Warthog, F/A-18C), Realsimulator (F-16SGRH, F-18CGRH), VKB (Kosmosima LH, MCG, MCG Pro), VPC MongoosT50-CM2 Throttles: TMW, Winwing Super Taurus, Logitech Throttle Quadrant, Realsimulator Throttle (soon) VR: HTC Vive/Pro, Oculus Rift/Quest 2, Valve Index, Varjo Aero, https://forum.dcs.world/topic/300065-varjo-aero-general-guide-for-new-owners/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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