WINWING F/A-18C HOTAS 2019.9.30 RELEASE

[memoric]

Hello

 

 

So do I understand it right? The soft center is the one with more resistance? Doesn't make any sense to me?:huh:

[chaos]

Early days and reviewers need more time to properly review the hardware.

 

Biggest issues that I’ve noticed in Jabbers’ stream so far... Split throttle causes 1 part to interfere with the other and quite a few switches on the throttle stand are momentary action switches which limits their usefulness. No dedicated slider for zooming. There is a slider but seems to only control throttle friction. As for the stick... no clear center and the springs are too soft. This is largely a personal preference though.

 

Hardware seems solid with good quality switches. It looks badass!

[Dudikoff]

There is a slider but seems to only control throttle friction.

 

From what I've seen in the video (and I only saw parts of it), it's visible in the Windows Device screen so it could be mapped to anything in theory.

 

The real question is if it can be decoupled from controlling the friction control (in the software/drivers?) so you can use it as an axis, while you can set the throttle friction to some fixed value.

 

Or is it perhaps setting the friction mechanically when being moved around (i.e. the friction lever is physically adjusting the friction of the throttle lever)?

Edited October 15, 2019 by Dudikoff

[icemaker]

The friction lever actually adjusts the friction of the levers.

[StandingCow]

Early days and reviewers need more time to properly review the hardware.

 

Biggest issues that I’ve noticed in Jabbers’ stream so far... Split throttle causes 1 part to interfere with the other and quite a few switches on the throttle stand are momentary action switches which limits their usefulness. No dedicated slider for zooming. There is a slider but seems to only control throttle friction. As for the stick... no clear center and the springs are too soft. This is largely a personal preference though.

 

Hardware seems solid with good quality switches. It looks badass!

 

 

yea, hopefully the throttles bumping each other can be a quick fix with a spacer or something.

[horus-DCS]

I’m still waiting for the throttle only option...

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[WINWING]

yea, hopefully the throttles bumping each other can be a quick fix with a spacer or something.

 

Early days and reviewers need more time to properly review the hardware.

 

Biggest issues that I’ve noticed in Jabbers’ stream so far... Split throttle causes 1 part to interfere with the other and quite a few switches on the throttle stand are momentary action switches which limits their usefulness. No dedicated slider for zooming. There is a slider but seems to only control throttle friction. As for the stick... no clear center and the springs are too soft. This is largely a personal preference though.

 

Hardware seems solid with good quality switches. It looks badass!

 

I must say this unbox show has no enough prepare. Our biggest mistake is not send streamers the manual before they begin.

 

For example, the LR handle sync is a design for OPEN/CLOSE the "throttles bumping each other", because we have no LOCK for LR.

 

 

A more detail video is here.

https://www.facebook.com/winwing.cn/videos/733108397204681/

 

And we adjust/calibrated the machine by laser before leave factory, but Jabbers change the CAM and Spring with out read manuals and prepare, so he flight a un-adjust joystick in the rest video. I can understand he don't want such thing.

 

Jabbers is the first streamer you love who show it first, I know he want to show for you, but our HOTAS is something complicate than Game Joystick, need read manual very careful, and adjust by patience.

 

Hope other streamers could prepare carefully for this "Machine", and show your fans the the most important information.

 

Thanks for Jabbers' 4 hours hard work, have a good rest and play more.

[Dudikoff]

The friction lever actually adjusts the friction of the levers.

 

Yeah, I saw that in the video, but then I don't understand why it also has an axis sensor if it can't be re-purposed?

 

The image above shows some other adjustment which might be connected to this (i.e. "THRUST LEVER NEUTRAL XXXX TENSION" OFF / ON)?

 

Not sure if Jabbers perhaps was too eager to show of the system as soon as possible or perhaps he didn't really prepare for it intentionally (e.g. to provide a realistic unboxing demonstration of the issues a customer might encounter while assembling the system), but whatever the reason it definitely ended up being useful for everyone.

Edited October 15, 2019 by Dudikoff

[StandingCow]

I must say this unbox show has no enough prepare. Our biggest mistake is not send streamers the manual before they begin.

 

For example, the LR handle sync is a design for OPEN/CLOSE the "throttles bumping each other", because we have no LOCK for LR.

 

 

A more detail video is here.

https://www.facebook.com/winwing.cn/videos/733108397204681/

 

And we adjust/calibrated the machine by laser before leave factory, but Jabbers change the CAM and Spring with out read manuals and prepare, so he flight a un-adjust joystick in the rest video. I can understand he don't want such thing.

 

Jabbers is the first streamer you love who show it first, I know he want to show for you, but our HOTAS is something complicate than Game Joystick, need read manual very careful, and adjust by patience.

 

Hope other streamers could prepare carefully for this "Machine", and show your fans the the most important information.

 

Thanks for Jabbers' 4 hours hard work, have a good rest and play more.

 

 

Good to hear sir! Really looking forward to getting this HOTAS, I have full confidence in you all. :)

[dburne]

Strange that they would say the manual is needed for proper adjustment but did not send one or make available for download for Jabbers for his review.

[WINWING]

Strange that they would say the manual is needed for proper adjustment but did not send one or make available for download for Jabbers for his review.

 

it's ours mistake. we send manual to jabbers after beginning.

the beta manual could be download now in our website.

[Bullant]

Yeah, I saw that in the video, but then I don't understand why it also has an axis sensor if it can't be re-purposed?

 

I guess so you can map it to the same control in DCS and have the lever move in game when you move the physical lever?

[Bullant]

Reading the manual now, this concerns me a little

 

·Enter the afterburner, there are two ways to

operate

The first type:

STEP1 Lift the lever up first. STEP2 Push the grip forward.

The second type:

Go directly to the second step. Push the grip hard, and the lever will automatically unlock.

(We prefer to use the first step of the operation. This helps the product to last longer.)

 

I would hope that using the push through would not in any way damage or wear out the throttle, considering it is the way the aircraft is supposed to operate?

[lolwut845]

looking at the schematics below that, I'm not too concerned about the AB push through. The physical bump looks sturdy. Might even be able to replace/machine that part in the unlikely event it wears out.

 

Jabbers video got me even more hyped. Can't wait to receive mine !

[WINWING]

Reading the manual now, this concerns me a little

 

 

 

I would hope that using the push through would not in any way damage or wear out the throttle, considering it is the way the aircraft is supposed to operate?

 

Don't worry, we have auto-test more than 10 thousands push through to AB, no little damage, high quality structure.

[RogueSqdn]

I unfortunately don't see any dimensions of the throttle base in the PDFs on your website. I DO see a link that says dimensions, but the files in that RAR are not anything I know how to open (I was expecting a PDF drawing).

[Dudikoff]

I guess so you can map it to the same control in DCS and have the lever move in game when you move the physical lever?

 

Hmm, good point, haven't thought of that as I so wanted it to be used for something else in other modules. Nice attention to detail.

 

I see from the manual that the adjustment I mentioned was for some middle detent or something. It also mentions not to adjust it with too many turns at a time to avoid damage, so better left alone I guess.

Edited October 15, 2019 by Dudikoff

[chief]

Back to the cams thing. Aren't we getting all the cams in the order. I got my virpil cm2 base and it included all the cams in case you wanted to change them. Are we not getting the same with the winwing? For this price, I hope so

[A2597]

I must say this unbox show has no enough prepare. Our biggest mistake is not send streamers the manual before they begin.

 

For example, the LR handle sync is a design for OPEN/CLOSE the "throttles bumping each other", because we have no LOCK for LR.

 

 

...

 

Thanks for Jabbers' 4 hours hard work, have a good rest and play more.

 

 

First: Awesome on having though through this and making an adjustment.

Second: Thanking Jabbers after he gave what can only be called a "Fair first impression" of the product, perceived faults and all lends a lot towards your credibility and professionalism. I know that as the manufacturer there must have been moments where you cringed because he missed something that was adjustable (the paddle switch adjustment which he found on stream, or the above issue with the throttles hitting each other) but you'll get much further just working with the reviewers to address the issues (And maybe sharing here as above that it was just an oversight) goes a long way towards building trust with the community!

[RogueSqdn]

I unfortunately don't see any dimensions of the throttle base in the PDFs on your website. I DO see a link that says dimensions, but the files in that RAR are not anything I know how to open (I was expecting a PDF drawing).

 

After a little more research, I found a Solidworks viewer for free and it appears that the panels are 408mm at the right (longest) side, 376mm at the left (shortest) side, and 207mm wide. From the top of the panels to the bottom of the throttle base appears to be 231mm (about 9 inches).

 

It appears it will fit within the basic dimensions of my cockpit, I'll just have to cut a new top plate for my left console and install some braces for it to fit in and stay still.

[memoric]

@winwing

 

 

Is this right that the soft center has more resistance than the hard center?

Can we choose between these two when ordering?

 

 

Thank you

[MilesD]

This was only my second time watching any live stream, and I found it very interesting. I thought I saw where Jabbers said WinWing requested the unboxing live stream.

 

Great job from Jabbers with a completely unfamiliar product, and hats off to Winwing for accepting responsibility for not having the instructions available for Jabbers prior to the live stream. I know Winwing is probably very busy now trying to finish up hundreds of small details before the initial shipments go out. I was also impressed with WinWings professional responses to the live stream.

 

I don’t know if it’s appropriate, but since Winwing was in the chat room anyway, I think it would have been helpful to have Winwing on voice standby for Jabbers. That way you could address issues and explain features in real time. I’m sure that as you watched, you wanted to inform Jabbers about an important procedure that he had no way of knowing about. Just a thought for upcoming streamers.

 

Great job guys, looking forward to Jabbers follow ups once he gets everything sorted.

 

Miles

Edited October 15, 2019 by MilesD

[Jabbers_]

SOOOOO that stick base doesn't look too promising. Almost not wanting the hotas until its up to snuff. I'm getting cold feet on this one.

 

The stick seems to need a lot of fine adjustment between the spring combinations, the different cams, the offset adjustment (my term...), and the clutch. So i didnt wanna conclude anything last night on that aspect. Need more time to understand and get things sorted here.

 

Hello

 

 

So do I understand it right? The soft center is the one with more resistance? Doesn't make any sense to me?:huh:

 

No the Soft center has less resistance to get out of center. The Hard one was noticeably (by a lot) different.

 

Early days and reviewers need more time to properly review the hardware.

 

Biggest issues that I’ve noticed in Jabbers’ stream so far... Split throttle causes 1 part to interfere with the other and quite a few switches on the throttle stand are momentary action switches which limits their usefulness. No dedicated slider for zooming. There is a slider but seems to only control throttle friction. As for the stick... no clear center and the springs are too soft. This is largely a personal preference though.

 

Hardware seems solid with good quality switches. It looks badass!

 

Agreed, this was 100% not a review, just an unveiling. The throttle bumping is something I overlooked in the manual, being that it was given to me 1/2 way through the stream I didn't refer to it as much as I should have. Not having a slider for the zooming might be solvable, just need more time to figure it out.

 

I must say this unbox show has no enough prepare. Our biggest mistake is not send streamers the manual before they begin.

 

Yes, probably should have prepared more, but at the same time I think its a good thing to do it this way to, see what steps along the way may be to complicated. You guys are engineers, most of us aren't so given these kinds of experiments we both learn what may need to be addressed (if anything) in future revisions.

 

And we adjust/calibrated the machine by laser before leave factory, but Jabbers change the CAM and Spring with out read manuals and prepare, so he flight a un-adjust joystick in the rest video. I can understand he don't want such thing.

 

Jabbers is the first streamer you love who show it first, I know he want to show for you, but our HOTAS is something complicate than Game Joystick, need read manual very careful, and adjust by patience.

 

Hope other streamers could prepare carefully for this "Machine", and show your fans the the most important information.

 

Thanks for Jabbers' 4 hours hard work, have a good rest and play more.

 

I understand your probably teeth grinding about my approach. I get it. But I stated multiple times that I needed more time to understand it. I have 2 other gimbal bases that have similar cam setups and I understand the mechanics within them a bit so it wasnt overly complicated. The only that was new to me was adjusting the cam position after the spring was loaded in, not something needed to be done in the 2 other sticks I have. I will spend more time figuring this out though, I'm sure we can solve the issues I was encountering (which are likely all on my side)

 

Not sure if Jabbers perhaps was too eager to show of the system as soon as possible or perhaps he didn't really prepare for it intentionally (e.g. to provide a realistic unboxing demonstration of the issues a customer might encounter while assembling the system), but whatever the reason it definitely ended up being useful for everyone.

 

To eager maybe, but only because so many people asked for the stream and only because the pre-sale is going to end pretty soon here and those people wanted to try and save some $$, and I cant blame them this is a pricey product. I dont mind making mistakes, I also don't mind making a fool of myself. I rarely read directions on most things (I learn better this way... call me weird for it). Typically I break out the instructions when I get stuck ... as seen in this stream ;)

 

This was only my second time watching any live stream, and I found it very interesting. I thought I saw where Jabbers said WinWing requested the unboxing live stream.

 

This was not WINWINGS request.

 

 

Great job from Jabbers with a completely unfamiliar product, and hats off to Winwing for accepting responsibility for not having the instructions available for Jabbers prior to the live stream. I know Winwing is probably very busy now trying to finish up hundreds of small details before the initial shipments go out. I was also impressed with WinWings professional responses to the live stream.

 

Thanks and also hats of to WINWING for jumping in the stream and giving me guidance when I got off track, it was appreciated.

 

I don’t know if it’s appropriate, but since Winwing was in the chat room anyway, I think it would have been helpful to have Winwing on voice standby for Jabbers. That way you could address issues and explain features in real time. I’m sure that as you watched, you wanted to inform Jabbers about an important procedure that he had no way of knowing about. Just a thought for upcoming streamers.

Yup, totally unplanned though so that would have been tough to do. I am going to try and put together a Skype call with ALEX at some point to clear things up with the cams and springs ;)

[Wmacky]

Has the video version gone up yet? I don't see it.

 

Being on the east coast, I had to bail at 1:00am as I had to get up for work at 5:00am, and I missed a bunch of the stream.....

 

I didn't want to stop watching after waiting so long, but had no choice. I fallen asleep at my desk twice already! :)

 

Oh, and thanks for getting us this much anticipated info!!!!!!!!

Edited October 15, 2019 by Wmacky

[Jabbers_]

Has the video version gone up yet? I don't see it.

 

Being on the east coast, I had to bail at 1:00am as I had to get up for work at 5:00am, and I missed a bunch of the stream.....

 

I didn't want to stop watching after waiting so long, but had no choice. I fallen asleep at my desk twice already! :)

 

Its currently only on twitch and parts of it got muted. Ill likely throw together a video tonight summing things up if I have time for youtube...

 

Twitch