My HP Reverb experience coming from O+

[crazyave]

It all depends on how much stuff you have running on your USB buses. If you have minimal USB equipment, you'll never see a problem. Most simmers though, with HOTAS, and numerous other controllers plugged in, will benefit from having a powered card. Svsmokey is right about the specific recommendation from Oculus. Its how I found my card.

 

 

 

I've got the O+, rudder pedals, FSSB, TUSB, keyboard, mouse, and a blue tooth USB receiver installed for USB devices. As far as power consumption goes I think just the HMD is using any significant power?

 

 

I read some threads about the power issue, but seems like the issues people saw were disconnects and major things, not bad SDE. Would I really see an SDE improvement potentially?

[eaglecash867]

I've got the O+, rudder pedals, FSSB, TUSB, keyboard, mouse, and a blue tooth USB receiver installed for USB devices. As far as power consumption goes I think just the HMD is using any significant power?

 

 

I read some threads about the power issue, but seems like the issues people saw were disconnects and major things, not bad SDE. Would I really see an SDE improvement potentially?

 

Time is money, and the card is only 28 bucks. Try it or don't. This discussion has exceeded the point of diminishing returns for me. :bye_2:

[crazyave]

I just unpacked the HP again and inspected the headphone with a big magnifying glass. Indeed, there are two tiny screws which are unscrewed inside. I'm not sure how to get to them, it appears I have to unscrew the large single screw that holds it to the headset to get to the small ones. The wiring also broke off just due to the weight of the headphone not being connected, so not much point in trying to fix it now. Just wanted to validate what was suggested above. The screws are either stripped out or came loose. Not a super easy fix though given the broken wiring too.

[crazyave]

I just went back through the whole battery of tests with the HP and compared back to back with the O+ again. Hopefully I can add better descriptive detail this time. I tried to get some pics but my phone camera and my professional camera were just not able to get a capture of what I see.

 

 

-The sweet spot in the HP is very small, like about the middle 20% of the whole FOV, maybe even less. Outside of that it drastically reduces and in addition you get a this effect, which I forget the name of, but basically the edges of things in the image get a gradient color coming off of them as they blur out. When I look to one direction with just my eyes it's a blue effect, and in the other direction it's a reddish effect. The quality of the image in the HP outside of the very middle sweet spot is worse than the O+ in my opinion. I think because there is such a difference in the quality of the sweet spot vs outside the sweet spot my eyes or brain pick up on it and it's harder to interpret as real, the immersion factor again.

 

 

-If all I did all day was read text in a small focused area the HP is definitely better, no question about it. But in fast moving scenery when you're really moving your head and eyes around to keep the target fixed on, I get a better experience with the O+ overall. It's immediately noticeable.

 

 

-My eyes caught the SDE pretty consistently, but I can imagine you'd get used to it after a while. Personally, I don't find the SDE in the O+ as distracting, yes, I know it's there, but my eyes just don't seem to catch it and focus on it like with the HP.

 

 

-The IPD issue is just in DCS, I get a slight cross eyed feel, it's very uncomfortable after several minutes and after taking the headset off my eyes are all screwed up for a while. I changed the IPD setting in DCS to extremes and everything in between and it had zero effect. I don't know if this is a DCS issue or something wrong with the HMD, but I didn't have that problem with my buddies HMD on his system, unfortunately that doesn't point to where the problem is.

 

 

-The image in the HP looks a bit further away than with the O+. Everything is bigger in the O+, and so feels more like you're IN the experience rather than looking at it through a window. Call it FOV, or whatever, but the immersion, for me, is definitely better with the O+ in regards to feeling like you're IN the scene.

 

 

-I felt the HP heat up and the screen started flashing in one eye at some point this time around. Possibly the cable, but seemed more like something else going on with the screen itself. It definitely runs hotter. Backlit LCD vs self lit OLED difference I guess.

 

 

Anyway, it's clear this a personal preference thing. There is no better or worse for everyone. I guess I'm an exception to what most people get out of it. Oh well, that's life.

[Secoda]

What is your IPD?

 

The guy who brought his Valve Index over for me to test had a large IPD and his experience with my Reverb kind of sounds like yours. Small sweet spot, etc.. It made sense for him to stay with the VI even with a lower resolution for the adjustable IPD.

[crazyave]

What is your IPD?

 

The guy who brought his Valve Index over for me to test had a large IPD and his experience with my Reverb kind of sounds like yours. Small sweet spot, etc.. It made sense for him to stay with the VI even with a lower resolution for the adjustable IPD.

 

 

 

When I adjust IPD correctly for my eyes with the O+ it says around 68mm on the screen. My buddy had his IPD measured and it's 71mm, and he didn't have any issues. The fact that his headset didn't have the IPD issue for me their tells me it was either my headset or my DCS install that has the IPD tweaked. I just don't know which as I didn't swap headsets with him to test, unfortunately. I don't think anyone needs to worry about this one, it was just something with my headset or DCS install.

[Tinkickef]

Interesting, this is the first I've heard of a PCIE USB card being required to make an HMD work. I don't recall any reviewers saying they needed it, otherwise I would have bought one. How many people have seen this improvement? Why is it not discussed? Why wouldn't the HMD manufacturers recommend getting one? It seems to be plenty of people are reporting great results but don't have an add on card, or am I missing something? Do you think it would help with my O+? If so, I'll pick one up, that's no problem, plenty of free slots.

 

 

The headphone's plastic connector was broken in half, definitely not a bolt missing or a nut coming out. Must have happened during packing. They are very flimsy, not hard to see why they broke it just packing the box. Again, not something I cared about, I don't use them. Just shows the quality they designed though.

 

 

Appreciate the suggestions, I'm certainly willing to give things a try, I'm just a bit skeptical given that no one has mentioned needing some of these things. As far as software settings go, I'm confident we tried everything possible to get the best performance out of the headsets. Maybe this last set that went out had more/different issues than other previous releases..?

 

It has been discussed at very great length in VR circles.........in fact before I change the system specs to my new rig, in my Sig, take a good look....

[eaglecash867]

I just unpacked the HP again and inspected the headphone with a big magnifying glass. Indeed, there are two tiny screws which are unscrewed inside. I'm not sure how to get to them, it appears I have to unscrew the large single screw that holds it to the headset to get to the small ones. The wiring also broke off just due to the weight of the headphone not being connected, so not much point in trying to fix it now. Just wanted to validate what was suggested above. The screws are either stripped out or came loose. Not a super easy fix though given the broken wiring too.

 

There is no wiring that connects the earpieces to the headband. There are two, tiny gold contacts on the headband, with a corresponding pair of gold contacts on the earpiece. HP designed it that way so that the earpieces could be easily, and completely removed. When screwed on tightly, the contacts on the headband mate with the contacts on the earpieces to make the electrical connection. There is no wiring that connects the two.

[Secoda]

I think for optimal performance in terms FOV and the sweet spot 63 or 64 mm IPD is best. The further you get away the worse it gets and pretty quickly it seems. At least one review suggested that 60 - 67 was about the maximum usable range in practice (not HP's guideline) but things quickly diminished after that.

 

The guy who tried my headset with the Valve Index I tested was 69 mm and his experience was suffering a lot compared to mine at 64 MM on the Reverb (we used the main menu in DCS to compare the sweet spot and FOV each of us had - I was shocked at the difference in view and clarity between us (64 mm and 69 mm). I think that is a negative of the Reverb. The optimal IPD range is very tight.

 

Then there is the distance from the eyes to the lenses which is also not adjustable on the Reverb but it is on the Valve Index. Some have found that adding padding to the face pad helps if the lenses are too close to their eyes. (affects FOV and halos appear)

 

From everything I have personally tested and read I would not recommend the Reverb to someone with an IPD of 68 or more. I have not heard from many on the lower end of the IPD range.

 

When I adjust IPD correctly for my eyes with the O+ it says around 68mm on the screen. My buddy had his IPD measured and it's 71mm, and he didn't have any issues. The fact that his headset didn't have the IPD issue for me their tells me it was either my headset or my DCS install that has the IPD tweaked. I just don't know which as I didn't swap headsets with him to test, unfortunately. I don't think anyone needs to worry about this one, it was just something with my headset or DCS install.

Edited July 29, 2019 by Secoda

[crazyave]

Broken connector. Wire broken off.

[crazyave]

SDE and weird rainbow effect on the sides of things...

[eaglecash867]

OK, now I see what you're talking about. The earpiece itself has come apart. It looks like you might have received a Reverb that was actually pre-owned, poorly inspected by the vendor after it was returned, and then went back into the vendor's inventory. There would have had to be a pretty good amount of force applied to that earpiece to get the screws to pull out of the plastic housing like that. You should definitely return that unit for a refund. Unfortunately, since you didn't report the damage right away to the vendor, you may have a difficult time convincing them that it didn't happen during use. If that turns out to be the case, you can probably just get HP to send a replacement earpiece to replace that broken one. They'll probably charge you for it, but at least replacing it is a simple procedure.

 

Its hard to tell for sure from the pics of the display, but that really looks more mechanical/optical to me, rather than being the display panel itself. Have you tried closing one eye and then the other to see if its there in both cases. Also, something about my Reverb that had me frustrated the first day I got it was this weird inconsistency in the image. That turned out to be the protective film on the lenses that I didn't know was there. You probably already removed that stuff, but I know from my own experience that the occasional brainfart can occur. ;)

Edited July 29, 2019 by eaglecash867

[Secoda]

Yes those plastic protective covers on the inside of the headset have caused many Reverb's to be returned. (a guy in my own squad fought it for a few days before he asked about the same thing) That is the first thing I thought of when I saw that "SDE". That is not SDE. I bet it is blurry too. HP should have stuck a piece of labelled cardboard in there and said remove these covers IMO. I saw them when I checked to make sure the lenses weren't scratched from the factory.

Edited July 29, 2019 by Secoda

[eaglecash867]

It would also explain the severely limited sweet spot. I was very close to returning mine for the plastic cover problem. Heh, after I figured it out though, I was just sure I was going to have a permanent palm print on my forehead. I facepalmed pretty hard. LOL

[crazyave]

LOL, man that would suck! These had a blue sticky plastic stuck on the lenses which I removed. I assumed there was nothing more than that... let me know if I missed it though! I don't think I did. The lenses look very quality, quite clear.

[eaglecash867]

LOL, man that would suck! These had a blue sticky plastic stuck on the lenses which I removed. I assumed there was nothing more than that... let me know if I missed it though! I don't think I did. The lenses look very quality, quite clear.

 

It probably wouldn't hurt to give the lenses a good rub-down with a clean, dry microfiber cloth to make sure any residual adhesive from the covers is removed. I have also noticed that because of the tight seal the Reverb forms on your face that the lenses will repeatedly fog up while there is still a temperature differential between the lenses and your face. This almost always happens when using the Reverb for the first time in a day. I fixed that by fixing the other problem of not being able to peak past the nose like I can in my CV1. The Reverb's nose seal is removable, so I took it out. That lets me peak over my nose so I can see my keyboard, and it gave the HMD enough ventilation to prevent the lens fogging problem. Also, don't forget the left eye/right eye troubleshooting to see if those distortions are only visible in one eye, or in both. Again, they really look more mechanical/optical than digital.

[hansangb]

Those SDE pictures look weird to me. I don't know that I see them in mine. But I'll check tomorrow if my woodworking project wraps up.

 

 

 

So the two things are 1) I can't believe USB card will eliminate SDE, and 2) You may just have gotten used to the softer/diffused O+ lens to even out the SDE.

 

 

And, maybe you have a dud.

 

 

 

But I'm going to to try really hard to see if I can see the SDE. It never bothered in me in CV1, so my brain may well be ignoring them.

[Tinkickef]

Those SDE pictures look weird to me. I don't know that I see them in mine. But I'll check tomorrow if my woodworking project wraps up.

 

 

 

So the two things are 1) I can't believe USB card will eliminate SDE, and 2) You may just have gotten used to the softer/diffused O+ lens to even out the SDE.

 

 

And, maybe you have a dud.

 

 

 

But I'm going to to try really hard to see if I can see the SDE. It never bothered in me in CV1, so my brain may well be ignoring them.

 

 

I can see a little SDE in my Reverb on consistent, light coloured backgrounds like the cliff house walls. BUT I really, really have to be looking for it. It is certainly not like Rift, it's more like almost seeing each pixel lit up brightly, rather than seeing the spaces between them.

 

Not noticeable 99.9% of the time and certainly not a problem for me.

[FoxTwo]

I can see SDE on the O+ if I focus on the pixels, but that really doesn't look like SDE that's just the fresnel lens artifacts. You have to focus beyond the lens otherwise you'll see it all the time.

[Harlikwin]

Windows 1903 patch and updated WMR for SteamVR Beta

Hey everyone -

 

If you are on Windows 1903, you can now download KB4507453 through Windows update.

 

We also have an updated WMR for SteamVR Beta available with a number of changes.

 

You can read the full details here:

 

https://steamcommunity.com/app/719950/discussions/0/1640915206497451607/

 

 

 

http://www.catalog.update.microsoft.com/Search.aspx?q=KB4507453

 

So I just updated to 1903. Downloaded that update, and it tells me its not applicable to my computer?

 

Also I can't see any of the KBxxx updates in my update history anymore so I'm not sure its installed. Reverb arrives later today.

[iFoxRomeo]

... Outside of that it drastically reduces and in addition you get a this effect, which I forget the name of, but basically the edges of things in the image get a gradient color coming off of them as they blur out. When I look to one direction with just my eyes it's a blue effect, and in the other direction it's a reddish effect....

 

 

Chromatic aberration

 

 

 

Thank you for your experience. I have the CV1, which I don´t use often. I´ll wait for the next generation of VR Headsets.

 

 

 

 

Fox

[louisv]

SDE and weird rainbow effect on the sides of things...

 

That is not SDE.

SDE is the lines between the pixels, so it is constant across the screens. This looks like an interference effect between some kind of residue and the lens. Clean your lenses and check again. With your eyes not the phone camera, because it could be because of the phone camera.

 

The point is you are the only person anywhere to complain about the SDE on the Reverb.

[boscoh]

Thanks for your review. The O+ has plenty of drawbacks but it is really hard to beat the OLED screen and the anti-SDE treatment. The OLED range really makes DCS "pop" and the lack of SDE is glorious. If only Oculus would make a Rift S with an OLED screen, I think it would be the best thing out there.

[jojo]

OLED screens from previous headset used pentile matrix with fewer sub pixel count which creates bigger SDE.

(appart from PSVR with OLED and RGB matrix but only 960x1080 per eye).

 

Samsung added a kind of “low-pass” filter to lower the SDE at the cost of sharpness.

 

I prefer the approach of HP with high density screen. It was the same with digital camera, past a certain sensor pixel density they got rid of the low-pass filter to improve sharpness.

[Harlikwin]

That is not SDE.

SDE is the lines between the pixels, so it is constant across the screens. This looks like an interference effect between some kind of residue and the lens. Clean your lenses and check again. With your eyes not the phone camera, because it could be because of the phone camera.

 

The point is you are the only person anywhere to complain about the SDE on the Reverb.

 

Seconded. Though various reviewers have said there is some minimal SDE (i.e. if you are looking hard for it, its there).

 

But neither the chromatic abberation or what you posted as SDE (the weird fresnel interference pattern) have previously been reported. So at a guess its a problem with one specific headset.