Carrier Landings

[kram56]

Hi Folks,

 

Since upgrading to 'FC' I am having a terrible time trying to land on a carrier.

 

In desperation I've decided to ask your advice :helpsmilie:

 

I realise that I'm probably hitting the deck a little early, thats to say before the first wire, could that be it ?

 

Anyway heres a "trk" file if anyone has the time to look.

 

 

 

Thanks in advance :thumbup:

[JaBoG32_Prinzartus]

Try to fly it without speed stabilizer. Your parameters looked quite allright. Although I'd flare a fraction of a bit more at touchdown to get proper AOA, but yours should also be fine.

 

My first attempt also failed like yours. Then I just decided to burn fuel in order to loose weight. With about 5000 Kg Fuel @ my second attempt it worked. Probably it is not a good idea to alnd with max fuel load @carrier.

[SuperKungFu]

Actually most pilots do not aim for the first wire. If you catch the first wire, you are sortof coming in a bit slow and you are in danger of hitting the back end of the ship. If you catch the third wire, you are going a little bit too fast. so try to go for the second wire. Also, watch ironhand's tutorial video on how to land. the key is to practice and you will eventually get it. Good luck.

[zaelu]

I always struggle with the trims when landing on carrier.... the tower is calling "to high" and "too low" like crazy... but most of the time at the end I slam the darn thing on the deck with or without "AB show off" thinggie. The Su33 simple :P FM tolerates a lot ;) .

[kram56]

Thanks for the input guys,

 

I've reduced the fuel load and have landed a few times successfully, although it's still not good enough.

 

It's true that I generally touch down before the first wire, I don't add full power as I come across the deck maybe that why?

 

Do you follow the Datum point right to the touch down or look at the deck for the final adjustments?

[chennuts]

I haven't watched the track, but based on a previous comment, you should NOT be flaring before touchdown on a carrier. Think about it.

[Alfa]

Thanks for the input guys,

 

I've reduced the fuel load and have landed a few times successfully, although it's still not good enough.

 

I think you just need to do enough landings to find your prefered style :) .

 

I personally like to stay a little higher and going a little faster than the HUD indications tell me to. On a low speed approach it is easier to drop altitude than to gain it(risk of stalling) and quicker to decrease speed via throttle/airbrake than to accelerate from near stall speed not least considering that you have gear and flaps extended(causing drag). Besides, as you mentioned yourself, it makes a difference how heavily loaded your aircraft is and you need to adjust your apparoch speed accordingly.......in this connection it is worth noting that on the real ship the maximum allowed return weight is some 25 tons.

 

It's true that I generally touch down before the first wire, I don't add full power as I come across the deck maybe that why?

 

Powering up at the last minute is only to ensure that you have enough energy to get airborne again in case you don't catch a wire.

 

Do you follow the Datum point right to the touch down or look at the deck for the final adjustments?

 

I start out concentrating on the instruments when lining up for the approach - the closer I get to the ship, the more I keep my eyes on the deck and only take quick glances at the instruments for reference.....sort of double checking that my speed and altitude are within my above mentioned preferences.

 

- JJ.

[S77th-konkussion]

I suggest you use the ADI as your primary approach instrument. I think you will find that it helps you line up better and stay in the groove more accurately. It shows you what corrections to make- but more importantly it shows you how MUCH of a correction is needed. This way- you don't over or under react.

 

I also think it's fine to stay "slightly" faster (maintain 290-310) and higher (+50m) than what is called for for the majority of the approach.

[JaBoG32_Prinzartus]

I haven't watched the track, but based on a previous comment, you should NOT be flaring before touchdown on a carrier. Think about it.

 

So you recommend to flare after touchdown?! :confused:

 

Usually (no matter if carrier or not) you touch down with the "rear" wheels first. In order to do that you HAVE to flare before touchdown.

 

Seems to be misunderstaning of some sort? As I am not native english speaking, forgive me if I am the cause.

[britgliderpilot]

So you recommend to flare after touchdown?! :confused:

 

Usually (no matter if carrier or not) you touch down with the "rear" wheels first. In order to do that you HAVE to flare before touchdown.

 

Seems to be misunderstaning of some sort? As I am not native english speaking, forgive me if I am the cause.

 

Flaring is pitching up before landing with the general aim of decreasing your sinkrate at the point of touchdown - it's supposed to provide a more gentle landing.

 

No-flare landings are standard practice on aircraft carriers - a flared landing, by virtue of a lower sinkrate, means you spend more time at a low altitude.

Bad plan on a short carrier flight deck. You want to arrive at precisely the right place at the right time, with no hanging around.

 

 

If you're flying the approach at the right speed, you'll be nose-high anyway and you won't need to pitch up so the rear wheels touch first.

 

If you're flying the approach in such a way that the nose wheel will touch the deck first, you're doing something wrong . . .

[S77th-konkussion]

"Flaring to land is like squatting to pee"

[chennuts]

:D

[S77th-konkussion]

So you recommend to flare after touchdown?! :confused:

 

Usually (no matter if carrier or not) you touch down with the "rear" wheels first. In order to do that you HAVE to flare before touchdown.

 

Seems to be misunderstaning of some sort? As I am not native english speaking, forgive me if I am the cause.

 

 

Prin- it does NOT appear to me that he was saying that. He definitely seems to be saying "do not flare"

[JaBoG32_Prinzartus]

I see, you are right. Probably flaring is not the appropriate word as it seems to be a soft form of "flaring".

 

Anyway, that is what I do when I keep slighlty above indicated approach speed and slightly above glide path during the approch:

 

Short before touchdown I reduce power do descent into the glide path and then I increase my AoA (thats what I meant with flaring) in order to touch down softly and reduce the last 10 -20 kph.

 

If you re totally on the glide path and your AoA is correct the whole approach, the last gentle pull on the stick is certrainly not necessary. Anyway I have never sucessfully done a "throttle" only approach without corrections, using the stick, yet. :cry:

[chennuts]

Once you get it right, I bet you'll be saying "how did I ever manage to land before?"

[S77th-konkussion]

FWIW- I basically leave the throttles at about 80% torque and use the brakes as needed to manage speed. I have a track on the downloads section of my site if you want to see it.

[kram56]

Thanks for all your input, I finally seem to be getting somewhere.

 

The turning point for me is hitting the deck with 2.5° of pitch. It would appear that the speed, sink rate and touching down position aren't critical :smartass:

 

Of course I'm only a newbie, what do I know :smilewink:

[Force_Feedback]

No wind, no waves, no traffic on the deck. Man, it's landing paradise. My approach is usually 1100kph (burn off some fuel, gain speed), about 4km out AB extended, throttles cut. Then comes some full rudder deflection together with some pulling on the stick, it will bleed off speed fast. When you're below 500 kph, gear, hook, AB extended/retracted depending on final speed. Usually 320 kph when do it, so extended. touchdown at 280, done. All that in under 2 minutes, no need to do ILS approaches and trying to be scientific about it. Just have the highest possible average speed without crashing.

 

BTW, it's better to extend the airbrake and to compensate with the throttle, the engines spool up faster than the airbrake extends/retracts.

 

For fun you can try landing the Su-33 without the hook, the final approach speed should be ideally 170 kph, but 190 is still good enough. Again, flaps, gear, airbrake, and if you don't want sore hands, some trim. Small sinkrate approach, prior to touchdown retract the flaps and apply wheel brakes. Steer your lump of metal to the right, so you can stop on the ramp. Be happy that you saved your plane from some metal fatigue and get some ice for the brakes.

[kram56]

Well Mr Force,

 

If it's exciting landings your looking for, I think I've got you licked.

 

Watch my second landing on this track:thumbup:

 

 

 

Not very serious I know :(

 

PS. Is it possible to get out of the plane, with the little ladder ?

[Design]

 

PS. Is it possible to get out of the plane, with the little ladder ?

 

No, it's not modelled.