F18c Startup

[Coco]

F18c startup... If you can turn the Batteries on, APU on, crank the right engine and start, crank the left engine and start and then just taxi and takeoff and fly around without any penalty or major malfunction, I kinda feel like the whole startup procedure is just hollow steps without true systems backing up the reason for having to do everything in a correct order. I think it devalues ramp starting if there are no malfunctions for not following correct procedures. Is this something that can be looked into?

[Jansgi]

Why would that cause a major malfunction?

[MrDieing]

Not sure if this is a troll post. If it is not, please list an example of what you think should malfunction.

[Manuel_108]

One unrealistic thing about it is that the HUD is fully functional without any INS alignment, but that's due to the fact that the INS is not simulated yet.

 

I don't know what happens in real life if you try to take off without the FCS BIT and whether that's possible or not, maybe that is what Coco meant? FCS BIT test is unrealistic anyways at the moment, work in progress I guess.

[Dreadnaut]

One unrealistic thing about it is that the HUD is fully functional without any INS alignment, but that's due to the fact that the INS is not simulated yet.

 

I don't know what happens in real life if you try to take off without the FCS BIT and whether that's possible or not, maybe that is what Coco meant? FCS BIT test is unrealistic anyways at the moment, work in progress I guess.

 

One issue is the DDI always displaying trim errors.

[Flamin_Squirrel]

My view is that there are shortcomings of the sim that don't represent the real thing, but perhaps not in the way the OP thinks.

 

You can't compare the bare minimum number of steps required to get the jet moving with the number of steps in the NATOPS checklist and assume because of the huge difference the sim isn't right. Many of the steps are to do things such as:

1. Ensure that switches are in a safe position on cockpit entry. They already are in a cold start so no worries there.
   
2. System checks. In reality very important, but why bother in your flawless virtual jet (and if you have failures enabled who cares anyway?!)
   
3. Operational setup. Radios, transponder, altimeter settings, waypoints etc etc etc a long list of things you have to consider in reality but don't in a sim.
   

 

I also suspect that there's plenty of damange you can do to a real jet - we just don't care because it doesn't result in a master caution - that would get you in trouble if it were the real thing.

 

One issue is the DDI always displaying trim errors.

 

Hmm. Can't see I have that problem. Only time I see it is forgetting to set trim before takeoff.

[AKarhu]

One unrealistic thing about it is that the HUD is fully functional without any INS alignment, but that's due to the fact that the INS is not simulated yet.

 

I don't know what happens in real life if you try to take off without the FCS BIT and whether that's possible or not, maybe that is what Coco meant? FCS BIT test is unrealistic anyways at the moment, work in progress I guess.

It can be skipped, yes.

 

 

The HUD would display more or less correctly without INS if in AUTO mode; could be s/n or operator specific, I don't remember for sure.

Edited January 28, 2019 by AKarhu

[NahkaSukka]

One issue is the DDI always displaying trim errors.

 

I only get that if i forget to set my stab to 16 or more when taking off from carrier. On the ground takeoff trim is enough.

[Eagle7907]

F18c Startup

 

The F18 is a high engineered advanced aircraft. Granted, I do see the point of the OP, but the forgiveness of the Hornet is made possible by the designers. From what I understand, there isn’t a requirement to do an FCS bit test. It says in NATOPS “IF no (FCS) reset”. Not “MUST do this every time”.

 

Everything that could be done is just integrity checks when done by checklist in manuals. The critical things are obvious bonehead things. Canopy, wings, flaps, trim, INS, seat, etc. plus all flight planning items like bingo, weapons, FPAS, etc

 

As far as fire tests, bits, etc. That’s purely just preventing a takeoff with a current malfunction. Those would come in handy after a repair.

 

The problem isn’t the F18. What the OP wants is DCS to have the ability to simulate latent malfunctions for a ramp start. That would make use of all the starting and taxi checks.

 

Worst one I can imagine is takeoff without a functioning arrestor hook. You wouldn’t discover that until next to the ship if not before leaving the deck! Even a malfunctioning speed brake could hamper ones efforts.

 

LOL. I can see it now. In settings menu, what maintenance tech do you desire? Blue Angel SSGT Perfection <——-I——-> Lowell Mather from Nantucket?

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Edited January 28, 2019 by Eagle7907

[Coco]

all I was trying to say is that it feels "hollow" if you can just start the jet up and go without having to do any startup procedure. The only thing that was noticeable was the nose was heavy on takeoff. Doesn't the A10c and KA50 have systems that are well portrayed from fuel flow to weight balance and sure there are other systems that I do not know about...

[Flamin_Squirrel]

You're still not really making sense. What exactly is it you're expecting?

[Eagle7907]

all I was trying to say is that it feels "hollow" if you can just start the jet up and go without having to do any startup procedure. The only thing that was noticeable was the nose was heavy on takeoff. Doesn't the A10c and KA50 have systems that are well portrayed from fuel flow to weight balance and sure there are other systems that I do not know about...

 

 

 

I got your message, and I thank you for the words.

 

I believe if you seek to simulate such failures, you can set them up in the mission editor, however that is set for that particular mission. It’s not like PMDG that will simulate wear and tear over time.

 

Granted, I think that would be neat to include, but most players don’t want that trouble of to over g an airframe or FCS fault puts you back X number of minutes of game play. Or if you over temp an engine, it will fail randomly. DCS is more meant for get up and shoot stuff. Not a procedure trainer. It was engineered to give players the option of how through they want to be in the game. As Wags calls it “eye candy”.

 

I previously played BMS Falcon before and liked it mostly until the keybindings and lack of support really sent me on this side of the fence. To be honest, Falcon is the same way as DCS when it comes to procedures. But do hear me out, there is more to come here at DCS. They are just really slow sometimes when it comes to innovation. It appears soon we will have animated deck crew guiding us around. I’m really looking forward to that!

 

PS Also they are starting on the F16 soon too. You will find me in that pit as well!

 

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

[gonvise]

Edited January 30, 2019 by gonvise

[Manuel_108]

That is a pretty relevant video, it really is a pilot friendly aircraft.

 

On a sidenote: Interesting that he sets the TGP to the MPCD.

[David OC]

all I was trying to say is that it feels "hollow" if you can just start the jet up and go without having to do any startup procedure. The only thing that was noticeable was the nose was heavy on takeoff. Doesn't the A10c and KA50 have systems that are well portrayed from fuel flow to weight balance and sure there are other systems that I do not know about...

 

If you want some real old school with switches for everything. Take a look at the DCS MI-8 ;)

 

[A2597]

Random thought...

Applies to MP servers only...but could it be set up so that the cockpit is left in whatever state the last player to fly that slot left it in, is the state in which you'll find it? (Just switch positions, trim, etc, damage would all be repaired. Essentially a clean aircraft).

 

 

Would mean you would have to do some additional pre-flight checks, and potentially make a more realistic startup.