The Dynamic Campaign... WHEN?!?!?

[Harlikwin]

Yeah, I am sure it will be looked at to see if it's feasible, It would even be important to MP Dynamic Campaigns if there was a server crash or needed a restart.

 

On that note I'd be super curious about what an MP online dynamic campaign would look like? A series of air missions that could be populated by either players or backfilled with AI units?

[Silver_Dragon]

In my opinion the ED should take inspiration from the other sim that has an excellent dynamic campaign, you know what i mean... In doing so, they should have a clear idea of what is the MINIMUM level we expect for a dynamic campaign.

 

The "other" sim has none to do with a RTS dynamic campaign, and ED has very clear they has not building a 24/7 campaing.

[The Falcon]

The "other" sim has none to do with a RTS dynamic campaign, and ED has very clear they has not building a 24/7 campaing.

Wait a sec, are you telling me that it's not planned to do a 24/7 dynamic campaign like the other sim?

[QuiGon]

and ED has very clear they has not building a 24/7 campaing.

Where did they say so?

[Raven68]

The "other" sim has none to do with a RTS dynamic campaign, and ED has very clear they has not building a 24/7 campaing.

Where did they say so?

 

I would like to know this also.

[NineLine]

Wait a sec, are you telling me that it's not planned to do a 24/7 dynamic campaign like the other sim?

 

The other sim shouldn't be in the equation (it in no way has the same gameplay aspects of DCS World), ED is building what meets the needs for DCS World, both SP and MP. There are not many details out, so its best to wait on more news than getting carried away with guessing and such.

 

Also, saying "the other sim" isn't much better than outright naming the other sim, the discussion should be 100% on DCS World, nothing else.

[The Falcon]

Standing 100% on DCS; Usually the term dynamic campaign suggests a simulation of war in a theater with armed forces and different factions with various strategies guided by the AI. In all this the player must be put in the shoes of a pilot who carries out missions in a world of war alive 24/7.

Any campaign that does not look like this cannot be defined as "dynamic"

I therefore hope that the ED for dynamic campaign means the one described above.

Edited August 8, 2019 by The Falcon

[StandingCow]

The other sim shouldn't be in the equation (it in no way has the same gameplay aspects of DCS World), ED is building what meets the needs for DCS World, both SP and MP. There are not many details out, so its best to wait on more news than getting carried away with guessing and such.

 

Also, saying "the other sim" isn't much better than outright naming the other sim, the discussion should be 100% on DCS World, nothing else.

 

I mean, forum rules aside (discussing other sims), people in other spaces ARE going to compare this dynamic campaign to other dynamic campaigns no matter what anyone says...

 

There is huge potential here for this to be everything we ever wanted or a huge disappointment. Just too early to guess at this point which it will be. :)

[Harlikwin]

I mean, forum rules aside (discussing other sims), people in other spaces ARE going to compare this dynamic campaign to other dynamic campaigns no matter what anyone says...

 

There is huge potential here for this to be everything we ever wanted or a huge disappointment. Just too early to guess at this point which it will be. :)

 

He's right 9L, no matter what the forum rules are, reality is that folks will compare and will have expectations. And franlkly the source code for that campaign system is available for good or ill and its like 20 years old at this point....

[NineLine]

He's right 9L, no matter what the forum rules are, reality is that folks will compare and will have expectations. And franlkly the source code for that campaign system is available for good or ill and its like 20 years old at this point....

 

Not really, so let's get it out of the way, the OTHER game is a 21-year-old game that was built around a single aircraft.

 

DCS World is meant to not only incorporate a wide variety of aircraft but allow for the addition of new ones, not to mention multi-eras. So while it's going to happen, compared to what ED is shooting for is not going to work. We have to take into account aspects like Combined Arms, Multiplayer with both sides being controlled, etc. I will go as far as to say people would be more disappointed if ED just copied the OTHER games campaign system.

 

So once again, you may feel tempted to compare OTHER games, but this is a DCS World forum, we need a campaign unique to DCS to take into account all that is DCS. If you think ED's team is not aware of other games, then you need to think again. It's not going to be a fast addition, it will be a lot of work, they are striving to build something that probably hasn't been done to this scale ever before.

 

Many of us, including me, played the OTHER sim(s), while they were great, they were different, DCS World will be different too.

 

SO do this, talk about what you want to see in a dynamic campaign system, but leave out the words "... like other sim" and it will all be good, you guys can do it, I know you can.

[cthulhu68]

I was wondering if dynamic campaign would bring with it a new "dynamic" mission editor or at least new features to current mission editor.

[jared9191]

For a long time we've said that a DC was more a matter of when rather than if. It is only until last year that we found a talented engineer to create "war simulation" in which the DC operates. It was only last year that we announced that it is now in development.

 

This is a very high-priority item for us with good progress. However, this is a highly complex undertaking and it will take time, but certainly not "5 years".

 

Once we have interesting and significant news to pass along on this task, we certainly will.

 

Thanks

 

Wags, will we be getting a general AI improvement or overhaul with the DC?

 

For example enemy bogeys can sometimes display some very weird physics, or how friendly AI wingman can't currently manage their fuel.

 

Thanks!

[NineLine]

Issues with AI fuel consumption are known and being looked at, certainly not hinged on the dynamic campaign.

[The Falcon]

..Multiplayer with both sides being controlled..

So if I understand correctly we can fight not only with the enemy AI but also with real players. This is certainly a novelty. What I would like is that it was not a mandatory thing for various reasons. First of all the guarantee of a certain realism, the players aren't efficient as a good as AI can be, the second thing is not knowing when I have for example a dogfight with a real player or the AI, this could annoy some.

Edited August 8, 2019 by The Falcon

[NineLine]

Well, the point would be to encompass all parts of DCS World, including Multiplayer where you are fighting against human and AI on the other side.

[Harlikwin]

Not really, so let's get it out of the way, the OTHER game is a 21-year-old game that was built around a single aircraft.

 

DCS World is meant to not only incorporate a wide variety of aircraft but allow for the addition of new ones, not to mention multi-eras. So while it's going to happen, compared to what ED is shooting for is not going to work. We have to take into account aspects like Combined Arms, Multiplayer with both sides being controlled, etc. I will go as far as to say people would be more disappointed if ED just copied the OTHER games campaign system.

 

So once again, you may feel tempted to compare OTHER games, but this is a DCS World forum, we need a campaign unique to DCS to take into account all that is DCS. If you think ED's team is not aware of other games, then you need to think again. It's not going to be a fast addition, it will be a lot of work, they are striving to build something that probably hasn't been done to this scale ever before.

 

Many of us, including me, played the OTHER sim(s), while they were great, they were different, DCS World will be different too.

 

SO do this, talk about what you want to see in a dynamic campaign system, but leave out the words "... like other sim" and it will all be good, you guys can do it, I know you can.

 

 

I agree that DCS-W is a much bigger and therefore harder and more general system.

 

With that said.

 

1.

I want different TYPES of air campaigns.

For example, something like Allied force in the balkans looked ALOT different than Desert Shield, and Desert Storm. Or "southern watch" or Rolling Thunder.

 

So abstracting from that:

 

Limited war type campaigns, where you are primarily targeting strategic targets along with SEAD/DEAD. (i.e. no CAS) (Balkans) no real friendly's on the ground.

 

Battlefield preparation campaigns: ala Desert shield/Iraqi Freedom: Basically hitting things like comm points/bunkers, emplaced units along with SEAD/DEAD etc. Again, no real friendly units on the ground aside from maybe SF teams lasing scuds or other targets. You can add in inserting SF teams, or downed pilot retrival for helos.

 

Full on Battle campaigns: I.e. Desert Storm, CAS/strike the whole enchilada. And in this case I want a FEBA complete with AI ground units slugging it out and having to de-conflict strikes with arty and so on so forth.

 

2. On the more tactical level (this is a totally non exhaustive list)

 

1. I want friendly and enemy AI doing stuff around me 24/7. Both in SP and MP.

 

2. I want to be tasked to a squadron that does mission types XYZ (depending on the airframe). I want to fly intelligence gathering missions (ok, I don't but I want the AI to fly them). I want to be assigned a mission, and if we screw it up and live to tell about it I want to have to do it again. Or if the enemy fixes the target etc.

 

3. I want to run out of smart bombs, and TPODs. I want logistics to be my problem.

 

4. I want to blow up supply convoys that are supplying tank formations, that stop when they run out of gas. I want to protect my supply convoys.

 

5. I want to blow up bridges so the supply convoy can't get anywhere.

 

6. I want bridges to be fixed and I want engineers building pontoon bridges over rivers under a SAM/AAA umbrealla so thick I could walk on it.

 

6. I want to be shot at by SAMS that move, that pop up from nowhere on my 6. I want to be in the kill box. I want the enemy SAM commander to go HO HO HO over the radio as he launches on me.

 

7. I want IADS, I want EW! I want to bomb dummy targets because our intel guys aren't as smart as they think they are.

 

8. I want redfor GCI with a wit sharper than Jester and a boris banedov accent.

 

9. I want to know my AI wingman, and actually care if he lives or dies. I want to pick his callsign to be bob, or cuddles.

 

Edited August 8, 2019 by Harlikwin

[NineLine]

Great, and you shared all that without mentioning any other sims. See it is possible ;)

 

[Harlikwin]

Great, and you shared all that without mentioning any other sims. See it is possible ;)

 

 

Honestly I haven't even played that sim in a decade so its hard for me to compare, memory being a bit fuzzy and all.

[The Falcon]

1. I want friendly and enemy AI doing stuff around me 24/7. Both in SP and MP.

That's the point of "dynamic campaign", without it there is nothing for me:smilewink:

 

3. I want to run out of smart bombs, and TPODs. I want logistics to be my problem.

I don't know how realistic this can be, what do you mean exactly?

[The Falcon]

Obviously I believe that everyone wants a page where you can see in real time what happens in the theater of war, nothing must be hidden.

[Baco]

I think that having a competent but fallible AI. Is a must for any dynamic campaign. I think right now its the biggest challenge for DCS to have a credible dynamic campaign.

That Said, I think that actual scripts and advance code right now, come very close to making missions dynamic enough. We only need a persistent world around it.

[Tom Kazansky]

Obviously I believe that everyone wants a page where you can see in real time what happens in the theater of war, nothing must be hidden.

 

 

I'm just thinking about how a DC with human opponents will work. Will there be a mole on each side who acts like a JTAC for his friends on the other side?

 

 

Or/and will a real time map of all friendly and enemy units serve as target acquisition data source?

 

 

Is there any info from ED out there about this?

[Harlikwin]

That's the point of "dynamic campaign", without it there is nothing for me:smilewink:

 

 

I don't know how realistic this can be, what do you mean exactly?

 

Logistics were/are a major, if not the decisive factor in any campaign. Looking a GW1 coalition forces ran through most of the war reserve stocks of PGMs (for ww3) in a matter of weeks, and they were heavily rationed to begin with, and only a small percentage of aircraft were rated to carry them. Same thing with TGPs, in a squadron there might be one per plane or less if some are down for repair.

[The Falcon]

Or/and will a real time map of all friendly and enemy units serve as target acquisition data source?

 

 

I think we will see this for sure. I believe that the missions are pre-packaged and that it is possible to replace oneself in AI. So I can't imagine how and how useful it would be to be a spy.

 

 

 

I also believe that ED on this side wants to surprise us, precisely with a map where we will visualize certain but also ingote information, such as unidentified planes approaching the front line etc..

[The Falcon]

..Same thing with TGPs, in a squadron there might be one per plane or less if some are down for repair.

This will greatly complicate the fight and could unbalance the campaign, we'll see how they tackle this problem.