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DCS vs "other sims" VR visibilty issue


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Is there anything I should look at tweaking in DCS? Without labels, I’m finding a no radar / no labels dogfight nearly impossible in VR.

Thanks

 

**EDIT** After playing with the settings and doing a ton of tweaking, I’ve come to realize the VR graphics aren’t limited like I had originally thought. The VR graphics are certainly comparable to other sims and I’m loving the sim again- this time in VR!


Edited by rweaves6

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I was wondering the exact same thing. It doesn't look like dcs' graphics are so much better/more demanding. I just asumed the poorer visability in dcs has something to do with it's game engine? but I'm just guessing here.

 

I'm also very much interested in some more, fact-based, explanations

 

(Although I'm afraid this thread won't have a long life here on the ED forum :P)


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This is "The DCS spotting issue" and there many many threads and youtube videos out there and it just simply scales oddly in DCS seemingly related to FOV and resolution.

 

It's not a VR only issue.

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This is "The DCS spotting issue" and there many many threads and youtube videos out there and it just simply scales oddly in DCS seemingly related to FOV and resolution.

 

It's not a VR only issue.

 

Ok thanks, I'll read up on that.

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Yeah it’s more difficult in DCS and best to use labels, must say though it does seem better lately, especially in maintaining a visual once the enemy has been spotted. Before they would be invisible as soon as they hit terrrain!

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Well I’ve read through the spotting threads and after more gameplay I’m now convinced that it’s a bigger issue then I earlier expected. There doesn’t seem to be any adjustments to settings that can straighten the issue out.

 

I have to say first though that I really wish there was something that could be done with this as I do love the product the DCS crew have developed. But as for VR, I just can’t seem to get around the visibility.

 

For example, in another flight sim I fly regularly, the visibility is obviously limited due to VR but where I find the difference is one is still able to spot. In fact I can generally spot other aircraft sooner than non VRers because of the smaller resolution. Where the disadvantage comes in is in identifying. The image won’t be as sharp therefore more challenging. But that really isn’t an issue because of the zoom mod that gives you 10x zoom.

 

With DCS, I find there’s no identifying or spotting. Instead, the way the game is rendered I just don’t see anything.

 

Again, im very impressed with DCS and am thankful for this amazing product. This is by no means a rant but rather me expressing where I feel they could make some adjustments. I will continue to buy their modules and support the team although it’s pretty difficult to fly in VR.

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Spotting is an easy fix for me.

I fly single player only, and have no shame

.

Yep I fly with labels, albeit the minimal selection.

Don B

 

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Spotting is an easy fix for me.

I fly single player only, and have no shame

.

Yep I fly with labels, albeit the minimal selection.

 

 

99% of the time, me too... :)

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99% of the time, me too... :)

 

Unfortunately me too. It’s a must.

 

I have a fair amount of online combat experience with other sims and so far, in DCSW, it is very tough for me in VR to even see the enemy, much less identify them. I am in no way casting shame on DCSW, I love the product and will continue to buy modules in the future, but in the department of spotting, DCSW needs some more work. For me, if I am above the enemy and looking down on them and the terrain, I rarely see them. One suggestion would be to have a darkening pixelation from say 10 km or so out that slowly decreases until you get within 1000m or some such. It is very easy for me to see the "dot" that is another fighter even 7 to 10 km out in other sims but I never see it in DCS. (It is a tiny, tiny bit better in 4K with the Track IR, but still not a strong feature of DCSW) And since this is a combat sim, and dogfighting is a main event, ... it needs attention IMHO.

 

100% agree, well said.

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is it just me, or something has changed in the last OB? it seems that I can spot better in VR.

 

Okay I made a similar observation but for me it was the Tuesday patch of the previous version, it gets a little more complicated as I updated to that version then rolled back because of VR issues, long story short updated to previous version again and even now the current version DCS 2.5.3.23788OB and a quick check of system stats and it all seems about the same CPU GPU and memory usage but RIft VR seems better and my system settings have not changed.

 

Yet I do not see any mention of changes so whilst DCS seems to be running better it just feels and looks better.

 

As for spotting aircraft I have no problems with a few Kilometres but that is about it for me in VR.

Control is an illusion which usually shatters at the least expected moment.

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I did a test run for spotting in VR.

80km starting distance - 1000m off the ground - noon time of day - no clouds - 1.2 PD all the way up to 1.8 PD - medium and high view distance - against typical fighter you might go against

 

 

With the Mig29S using the TWS to give me a basic idea where the target was, I was unable to spot the target until I got within 15-10km regardless of settings except higher Pixel Density settings would make it worse. If the target is above the horizion 15km is the absolute maximum spotting distance I can do even while knowing of the target location. If the target is below the horizion or in the grass I gotta get within 5km all the way down to 1km.

 

 

Missiles on the otherhand are completly impossible for me to spot now.

 

 

I love DCS and have every module but now with the inability to even spot an aircraft until extremely close, Im debating on moving on to somehting else because I'll never go back to a flat screen.

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I was unable to spot the target until I got within 15-10km regardless of settings except higher Pixel Density settings would make it worse. If the target is above the horizion 15km is the absolute maximum spotting distance I can do even while knowing of the target location.

 

Missiles on the otherhand are completly impossible for me to spot now.

Those seem like realistic distances. 10mi/ 15km is very far away to spot a fighter and missiles would be impossible to see unless they were in the boost stage or very large SAMs

Seems like you have unrealistic expectations in this regard.

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Very possible assumtion with that, but if we're going to go online, we have a pretty big disadvantage to the TrackIR users and their +30 power view magnification.

Disadvantage is something you just have to deal with in VR. VR isn’t really up to handling flight sims like this with its poor resolution. And monitor users can’t see objects that far away either. The max range I could possibly see a fighter at is about 10 mi but only if I know exactly where to look. And I can’t see missiles in flight but just briefly if they pass by close. In 4K I can identify much better but again that’s the price you pay in using VR

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I did a test run for spotting in VR.

80km starting distance - 1000m off the ground - noon time of day - no clouds - 1.2 PD all the way up to 1.8 PD - medium and high view distance - against typical fighter you might go against

 

 

With the Mig29S using the TWS to give me a basic idea where the target was, I was unable to spot the target until I got within 15-10km regardless of settings except higher Pixel Density settings would make it worse. If the target is above the horizion 15km is the absolute maximum spotting distance I can do even while knowing of the target location. If the target is below the horizion or in the grass I gotta get within 5km all the way down to 1km.

 

 

Missiles on the otherhand are completly impossible for me to spot now.

 

 

I love DCS and have every module but now with the inability to even spot an aircraft until extremely close, Im debating on moving on to somehting else because I'll never go back to a flat screen.

 

Would you mind sharing your grafx settings?

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Would you mind sharing your grafx settings?

Wouldnt mind at all.

 

 

My resolution is only 1920x1080 [only monitor i got]

[FYI I tested all these settings in VR and flat-screen mode]

 

[All targets were fighter sized, between altitudes of 600m to 1300m]

[i was using a Mig29S for its TWS2 mode so I didnt have the radar locking a target but could watch the radar position so I had a general idea of the target location but no real 'fix']

 

 

 

Preload range is maxed, because Im running 64gigs of RAM

 

 

 

For textures I tried Medium and High with no detectable difference, it only seems to have an effect on the instrument panel.

 

 

Visible range I tested between Medium and Extreme, the range the fighter would be noticable didnt differ.

 

 

Antialisaing [whatever its called] is off since I cant see any difference with the setting.

 

 

Shadows on High, because the shadow 'pop-in' seems to happen at a range of 500-1000m [not certain of that]

 

 

I know Im going on about this a bit much but Im having an easier time spotting ground targets than a sky silhouetted fighter at any range.

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Well I’ve read through the spotting threads and after more gameplay I’m now convinced that it’s a bigger issue then I earlier expected. There doesn’t seem to be any adjustments to settings that can straighten the issue out.

 

I have to say first though that I really wish there was something that could be done with this as I do love the product the DCS crew have developed. But as for VR, I just can’t seem to get around the visibility.

 

For example, in another flight sim I fly regularly, the visibility is obviously limited due to VR but where I find the difference is one is still able to spot. In fact I can generally spot other aircraft sooner than non VRers because of the smaller resolution. Where the disadvantage comes in is in identifying. The image won’t be as sharp therefore more challenging. But that really isn’t an issue because of the zoom mod that gives you 10x zoom.

 

With DCS, I find there’s no identifying or spotting. Instead, the way the game is rendered I just don’t see anything.

 

Again, im very impressed with DCS and am thankful for this amazing product. This is by no means a rant but rather me expressing where I feel they could make some adjustments. I will continue to buy their modules and support the team although it’s pretty difficult to fly in VR.

 

Oh dear, someone else who hasn’t set up his VR zoom in DCS.

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Oh dear, someone else who hasn’t set up his VR zoom in DCS.

 

The sole and only problem is the difference in max zoom level between flat screen and VR. I don't see why we VR users must be so restricted?

There's an addon on "that other sim" (which has natively the same illogical limitation) that permits to go to better max zoom levels.

There must be some kind of limitation (artefacts are visible when using aformentioned addon, but if that's the reason for putting a limit, I'm not ok with that) to VR, but a proper zoom level is a game changer and eliminates all difference between screen and VR users.

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