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What systems will the F/A-18C feature in Early Access?


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1a. So I thought I read that the F/A-18C radar can somehow "scan" the ground ahead for ground vehicles/detect/lock on to them?

 

 

1b. Or does that only work with some targeting pod?

 

 

2a. Is the F/A-18C targeting pod going to be in any way "better" (zoom?) than the DCS A-10C's targeting pod?

 

 

2b. Can we choose between more than one to equip?

 

 

2c. How many different targeting pods are being developed for the DCS F-18?)

 

 

3a. How will the DCS F/A-18C HMS + DCS AIM-9X combination compete vs. DCS MiG-29S HMS + DCS R-73 ?

 

 

3b. What are the angle limits of the F-18 HMS?

 

 

3c. in what terms are the DCS AIM-9X seeker (lock-angle? Flare resistance?) & propulsion-system (range?) better/worse than the R-73?

 

 

4. which laser guided bombs and how many (how many GBU-27 or -31 for example) of each type will the DCS F/A-18C be able to carry? (when having a targeting pod equipped)

 

 

5. what are the advantages of the DCS F/A-18C gonna be over the DCS M2000 ? (regarding everything, also wing design vs. delta wing design and RWR differences?)

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0) Your're in the wrong forum. The Hornet has its own subforum: https://forums.eagle.ru/forumdisplay.php?f=557

It's also an ED module and not a Belsimtek module, although they did assist in the development.

 

1) The radar can do that. It has a ground mapping radar mode. This is an early screenshot (2+ years old) that shows it looks like:

attachment.php?attachmentid=117059&d=1430413118

 

2) We will get the AN/ASQ-228 ATFLIR Targeting Pod. It should be more or less comparable to the Warthogs Lightening TGP.

 

3) It will probably work pretty well.

 

4) See here for weapons: https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=3285514&postcount=13

 

5) The Hornet will be better in pretty much everything except speed. It has better missiles, can operate from carriers and is a real multirole aircraft with great A-G capabilities.


Edited by QuiGon

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Thx 4 the link QuiGon!

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NOTAM (to DCS server-admins): Please adhere to the common sense gaming-industry administration-policy as most of the global gaming-industry does, after all there's enough hostility on the internet already which really doesn't help anyone. Thank you.    -    That moment when companies don't want to mention important facts in their ToS... -.-   -    Dell Visor WMR, Ryzen 5 3600 (6C/12T), RX 580 8GB

 basic DCS-community rule-of-thumb: Don't believe bad things that a DCS pilot claims about another famous DCS pilot without having analyzed the existing evidence - that would only be bullheadedly

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0) Your're in the wrong forum. The Hornet has its own subforum: https://forums.eagle.ru/forumdisplay.php?f=557

It's also an ED module and not a Belsimtek module, although they did assist in the development.

 

1) The radar can do that. It has a ground mapping radar mode. This is an early screenshot (2+ years old) that shows it looks like:

attachment.php?attachmentid=117059&d=1430413118

 

2) We will get the AN/ASQ-228 ATFLIR Targeting Pod. It should be more or less comparable to the Warthogs Lightening TGP.

 

3) It will probably work pretty well.

 

4) See here for weapons: https://forums.eagle.ru/showpost.php?p=3285514&postcount=13

 

5) The Hornet will be better in pretty much everything except speed. It has better missiles, can operate from carriers and is a real multirole aircraft with great A-G capabilities.

 

actually The Hornets radar mappng should be much Higher quality.

 

 

Whilst this is taken from the F15E Radar. the AGP73 utlized many AGP70 commonality and based on its technology. So SAR imaging qulaityshould be comparable between the two

 

 

000-F-15E-SAR.jpg

 

 

APG-76-Spot-6.jpg

 

When ED started the Hornet 2+ earlier years ago they initially had a post ODS but 90s model hornet with the earlier AN/APG73 Phase 1 radar, which A/G mapping still looked something akin 80s era radars like the earlier AN/APG 65 of F/A18A and Early C model hornets. ( like you see in screenshots.)

 

the Phase 2 Upgrades gives it SAR High resolution mapping.


Edited by Kev2go

 

 

 

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QuiGon answered some of your questions already. One thing to keep in mind is that the SS of the A/G Radar was based on the old APG-65 DBS; we should be getting the APG-73 with SAR imaging. This would result in a higher resolution image than what the SS shows. With that said ED has not gone into detail about the A/G Radar yet and we have to wait for any official word.

 

1a. So I thought I read that the F/A-18C radar can somehow "scan" the ground ahead for ground vehicles/detect/lock on to them?

1b. Or does that only work with some targeting pod?

Yes, the A/G Radar will have several modes, one of those will be a GMT mode that tracks ground moving targets. The targeting pod is a separate sensor.

 

 

2a. Is the F/A-18C targeting pod going to be in any way "better" (zoom?) than the DCS A-10C's targeting pod?

 

 

2b. Can we choose between more than one to equip?

 

 

2c. How many different targeting pods are being developed for the DCS F-18?)

The ATFLIR is just slightly less capable than the Lightning II.

3a. How will the DCS F/A-18C HMS + DCS AIM-9X combination compete vs. DCS MiG-29S HMS + DCS R-73 ?
It will actually be a slight advantage.

3b. What are the angle limits of the F-18 HMS?
The only one that I have read on the official unit is 90 degrees off bore axis. We have not received an official word from ED what the JHMCS will be capable of in-game.

3c. in what terms are the DCS AIM-9X seeker (lock-angle? Flare resistance?) & propulsion-system (range?) better/worse than the R-73?
90 depress off of the bore axis. When it comes to the flare resistance we do not know to what extent it will be molded in-game.

5. what are the advantages of the DCS F/A-18C gonna be over the DCS M2000 ? (regarding everything, also wing design vs. delta wing design and RWR differences?)
Way to many to mention...

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i wouldnt say that, atflir is a newer, more advanced unit with higher resolution than the litening ii.

 

I vaguely remember the discussion back in the days and I could simply be remembering wrong. If I am wrong, even better!

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Does anyone know if we will receive the Lightening during early access while we wait for the Atflir? I believe it the lightening can be mounted but correct me if I’m wrong.

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Does anyone know if we will receive the Lightening during early access while we wait for the Atflir? I believe it the lightening can be mounted but correct me if I’m wrong.

 

I don't think they will do that. I've not heard them saying anything like that.

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i wouldnt say that, atflir is a newer, more advanced unit with higher resolution than the litening ii.

 

And it's lighter. Drag index is probably smaller.

 

Does anyone know if we will receive the Lightening during early access while we wait for the Atflir? I believe it the lightening can be mounted but correct me if I’m wrong.

 

No, ED isn't going to make the Litening pod for the Hornet.


Edited by Vitormouraa
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caveat is that since the atflir is designed to track from higher altitudes, it's got even more of a drinking straw fov than the litening. litening will remain the better pod for the hog.

 

 

The more "drinking Straw" FOV will not be as big of a problem as one think where The Hornet has the luxury of an A/G radar ( as noted earlier it will have High res SAR capability) capable of detecting Ground targets and it has the option of then slewing the ATFLIR on to the area of where the radar is locked on and move on from there with the TGP controls to look for specific targets and for acquisition.


Edited by Kev2go

 

 

 

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I spoke to a few Hornet pilots (a few months back tbh) about A/G radar and ground clutter. And one of them flew Lot 20 (same model as ED's one). When it comes to A/G targets, the A/G radar isn't used for that, since the ground clutter makes it very difficult or nearly impossible to identify and track small targets on the ground with the radar. They'd use optical sensors instead, for searching, tracking and target designation.

 

A/G radar is actually used for mapping and terrain reconnaissance. So my suggestion is to not expect something like an AESA radar, or anything like that where you can see everything :D

 

You're probably going to be interested in using the radar to find big targets, such as buildings, runways, airplanes on the ground, stuff like that.

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I spoke to a few Hornet pilots (a few months back tbh) about A/G radar and ground clutter. And one of them flew Lot 20 (same model as ED's one). When it comes to A/G targets, the A/G radar isn't used for that, since the ground clutter makes it very difficult or nearly impossible to identify and track small targets on the ground with the radar. They'd use optical sensors instead, for searching, tracking and target designation.

 

A/G radar is actually used for mapping and terrain reconnaissance. So my suggestion is to not expect something like an AESA radar, or anything like that where you can see everything :D

 

You're probably going to be interested in using the radar to find big targets, such as buildings, runways, airplanes on the ground, stuff like that.

 

Except when the Lot 20s went into production in 1998. They still initially had the AN/APG 73 Phase 1. Phase 1s entered limited service in 1993, but did not enter full scale production until 1996. Phase 2 introduced High RES SAR imaging post production for Hornets via upgrades at the start of the 2000s with the last one not being delivered until 2006.

 

 

 

The quality of radar should be more aking to the image i provided, And not like the EARy WIP radar which would be more representative of the pre Phase 2 upgrades. ANd thats because ED initially started development with a earlier F/A18C of the 90s before going for a more modern iteration.

 

I never suggested the radar would be suitable or superior to attacking tagets like tanks to a TGP merely that if you detect clutter that resembles something of an armored formation you can lock target and slew TGP to investigate vs trying to randomly trying to scan target with TGP alone or with Eyes in a totally random manner.

 

So yes having a Radar capable for A/G ( especially with Higher res imaging) be welcome for the extra S/A, and its certainly far better than not having one at all.

 

 

It would be more helpfull within the context of your argument to ask your pilot friends to confirm Which radar version thier Hornets they flew had as i suspect its likely they still may have flown with the Agp73 Phase 1s or possibly even earlier AN/Apg65, as thier description of " its only good against finding airfields or other large targets and nothing else" seems more akin to the description of that of radars that did not yet have SAR technology for thier A/G modes.


Edited by Kev2go
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Kev2Go, what is the basis of your assesment? Have you used an A/g radar before? Your images provided are from a MUCH larger radar in the F15, apples snd oranges. Id have to go with Viro's assesments as he's hearing it from the horses mouth.

 

 

Its larger and has better detection range., however the comparison was the Quality of Imaging which is said to be comparable between the wto. SO Its not apples and ORanges as AN/APG73 was based on AN/APG70 technology which was used in the F15E. . FOr ease of Maintenance, parts Commonality, and for the fact it was less expensive than developing an entirely new radar from scratch.

 

 

https://www.raytheon.com/capabilities/products/apg73/

 

 

"Phase II of the APG upgrade completed development. It incorporates a motion-sensing subsystem with reconnaissance software, a stretch waveform generator module, and a special test equipment instrumentation and reconnaissance module.With these enhancements, the F/A-18 aircraft will have the hardware capability to make high-resolution radar ground maps comparable with those of the F-15E and the U-2 aircraft, and be able to perform precision strike missions using advanced image correlation algorithms."

 

Viro , appreciate him sharing his input, but all im saying he did not give enough necessary Context of mentioning which radar versions they flew with unless he can rectify this query with a followup post. In any case I guess we will have to wait for the A/G to see exactly of how its capabilities will be simulated in a virtual Environment.


Edited by Kev2go

 

 

 

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Your context is a manufacturers website, which its well known that they play up the capabilities of their products to sell units. There;s a good chance Viro's buddies did fly with this radar type if they've flown a hornet in the last 15 years....once again go with the horses mouth.

 

 

ANd your context are fallacious arguments not backed by any objectionable proof to counter my points.

 

 

One cant fully got with so called Horses mouth without any question IF it was not confirmed the radar type used was a Hornet upgraded with the the An/APG 73 Phase 2. All i said was The Description was akin sounding comparable to Biographical accounts of Hornet Pilots that flew in the Gulf war that had experienced using A/G modes, But back then they still only had the AN/ APG65's, on those C hornets.

 

 

This isnt just a mere manufactures Claim Its in other documentation.

 

here is jsut one eg, which was a report analysis.

 

https://www.forecastinternational.com/archive/disp_pdf.cfm?DACH_RECNO=328

 

 

 

 

I think you dont really understand the significant difference of what it provides.

 

Whilse the Older radars like the AN/Apg65 and the An/APG73 Phase 1 A/G mapping the radar using a conventional beam scanner the Concept of SAR is that it creates 2 or 3 dimensional imaging by using the motion of the radar antenna thus providing much better imaging resolution..

 

Obsiously the SAR radar of that time Its still not nearly as good As what AESA radars A/G imaging offers( such as AN/APG79 of the SH block 2 or An/AGP 81 of the F35) being able to nearly rival modern TGP in quality, but again you already have a image comparison OF early Hornet Pics ( which was a earlier AN/Apg73 model without the Phase 2 upgrades) vs SAR grade mapping provided a few post back to have a good idea of what to expect.

 

 

 

https://www.digitalcombatsimulator.com/images/newsletter/20150430/DBS-radar.jpg' alt='DBS-radar.jpg'>

 

 

000-F-15E-SAR.jpg

 

 

APG-76-Spot-6.jpg


Edited by Kev2go

 

 

 

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