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how to change the size of the cockpit?


misoswan
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Gotta love it when a 'tester' tells someone that their problem does not exist because he does not see it and, for that reason alone, will not be reported.

 

The physics of binocular vision, in a VR headset, has nothing to do with IPD but is directly tied to the spacing of the two virtual cameras used to generate a 3d perception. The fact that some devs choose to ignore this reality does not make it correct.

 

Thanks you for your kind words. I did report it, I just needed more information as I stated so I could write a proper description. I give up with you, you obviously have some infatuation with trying to be a dick to me. Good day, and you are welcome.

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Thanks you for your kind words. I did report it, I just needed more information as I stated so I could write a proper description. I give up with you, you obviously have some infatuation with trying to be a dick to me. Good day, and you are welcome.

 

My apologies. I overlooked the statement indicating that you had reported the problem. I still don't think you understand the underlying issue but that is another matter. Thank you for the time you have spent investigating this issue.

 

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Thanks you for your kind words. I did report it, I just needed more information as I stated so I could write a proper description. I give up with you, you obviously have some infatuation with trying to be a dick to me. Good day, and you are welcome.

 

 

 

He's a dick to everyone, best to just ignore him.

 

 

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There is the third as well, that is really the world scale.

 

1) IPD (HMD optics separation to wearer eyes)

2) Virtual Cameras separation (it says it all)

3) Virtual Cameras Focal Length (zooming, FOV)

4) Virtual Cameras Nodal Point

5) The virtual world scale.

 

I was assuming 3) FOV is tied only to the headset and not to the user.

If in the real world my vision is already distorted by glasses I thought it would not matter too much in the headset as I'm used to this distortion (I'm already seeing the world smaller than it actually is because of the glasses), but maybe it has more impact.

 

I think 2) and 5) are the same thing, the ratio between them is the actual parameter.

 

I'm more curious about 4), isn't that an optical thing? How would that affect the rendered picture?


Edited by PiedDroit
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My apologies. I overlooked the statement indicating that you had reported the problem. I still don't think you understand the underlying issue but that is another matter. Thank you for the time you have spent investigating this issue.

 

Merry Christmas. :santa:

 

You wont believe me, but I have researched and each of the games where the setting says "World Scale" internally it is overriding the IPD value used in the game from the hardware. World Scale is a term used because most people wont understand IPD and it seemingly changes the scale of the world, as does your IPD.

 

As an example, if I start DCS and a mission, press F2 to go to external view of a plane in flight and change my IPD on my oculus using the hardware slider, the World Scale does seem to get bigger and smaller to me. Try it, its pretty obvious. Obviously the IPD value also affects the distortion of the pixels due to the lense sweet spot, and thus, any other tweaking needs to be done in the game. IPD == World Scale, not sure how I can get you to believe this, but its how it works internally in the code.

 

Most games hard code the IPD value, I'm not sure if DCS does or not, but Elite Dangerous does, Assetto Corsa does or did (unsure what the current state is, i dont play it). But in the end the transform for the camera matrix has the IPD value applied to it, and when you change the "World Scale" slider in a game with this option, they are increasing and decreasing the IPD value used in the camera transform.

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You wont believe me, but I have researched and each of the games where the setting says "World Scale" internally it is overriding the IPD value used in the game from the hardware. World Scale is a term used because most people wont understand IPD and it seemingly changes the scale of the world, as does your IPD.

 

IPD does not change world size, it only affects to the "depth experience" (what is little wrong too as human brains calculate distance not by two eyes alone, but two eyes and their angle to focus point).

 

If you cover your other eye (like tape it to shut if you will) and then place a VR on, you can adjust as much as you want the DPI and the world scale does not change.

You can as well do the same thing in the reality, world scale doesn't change.

 

You can even build a periscope with wider separation to eyes, and the world scale doesn't change unless the periscope changes the focal length (magnification).

 

When we do 3D movies, we shoot two cameras synced together (very special feature required from the camera to be able be exactly in the sync) but we change "the IPD" aka camera separation by separating their off-axis.

 

ET+Atom+3D+Red+rig.jpg

 

In that setup, we calculate the distance from the camera to the distance we focus. Then we measure the distance to close- as far-part distances that we want to separate and how much. Then with that and simple math, we get to know the separation difference between the cameras how much we want something to "pop-out" from screen or how much we want something to be "behind" the focus distance.

 

We do NOT change the focal length by adjusting "the IPD" what so ever.

 

The lenses IPD adjustment doesn't change what so ever the magnification or FOV in the displays. Oculus added the IPD adjustment so the special lenses that has very specific small area focused, to be possible be positioned so it matches the person IPD who wears the HMD.

 

Only if we would change the magnification for the HMD screens, would we change how we perceive the screen size. Or if we would change the virtual cameras field of view (focal length) as the HMD screens sizes stays same.

 

 

If one person closes the other eye, they don't anymore have a "IPD" value, because they are perceiving the world via single eye, "a single virtual camera". The world size doesn't change if they open the other eye.

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IPD does not change world size, it only affects to the "depth experience" (what is little wrong too as human brains calculate distance not by two eyes alone, but two eyes and their angle to focus point).

 

If you cover your other eye (like tape it to shut if you will) and then place a VR on, you can adjust as much as you want the DPI and the world scale does not change.

You can as well do the same thing in the reality, world scale doesn't change.

Despite all the other ways of perceiving depth, I think binocular vision is the major contributor, not focal length.

Chaning world scale with camera separation works, it has been done in other sims.


Edited by PiedDroit
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IPD does not change world size, it only affects to the "depth experience" (what is little wrong too as human brains calculate distance not by two eyes alone, but two eyes and their angle to focus point).

 

If you cover your other eye (like tape it to shut if you will) and then place a VR on, you can adjust as much as you want the DPI and the world scale does not change.

You can as well do the same thing in the reality, world scale doesn't change.

 

You can even build a periscope with wider separation to eyes, and the world scale doesn't change unless the periscope changes the focal length (magnification).

 

When we do 3D movies, we shoot two cameras synced together (very special feature required from the camera to be able be exactly in the sync) but we change "the IPD" aka camera separation by separating their off-axis.

 

ET+Atom+3D+Red+rig.jpg

 

In that setup, we calculate the distance from the camera to the distance we focus. Then we measure the distance to close- as far-part distances that we want to separate and how much. Then with that and simple math, we get to know the separation difference between the cameras how much we want something to "pop-out" from screen or how much we want something to be "behind" the focus distance.

 

We do NOT change the focal length by adjusting "the IPD" what so ever.

 

The lenses IPD adjustment doesn't change what so ever the magnification or FOV in the displays. Oculus added the IPD adjustment so the special lenses that has very specific small area focused, to be possible be positioned so it matches the person IPD who wears the HMD.

 

Only if we would change the magnification for the HMD screens, would we change how we perceive the screen size. Or if we would change the virtual cameras field of view (focal length) as the HMD screens sizes stays same.

 

 

If one person closes the other eye, they don't anymore have a "IPD" value, because they are perceiving the world via single eye, "a single virtual camera". The world size doesn't change if they open the other eye.

 

In game programmable IPD does change depth. The IPD on the device sure, ill take you on that, but the ingame "world scale" IS based on the IPD value used when rendering the scene... this is the value changed in the new VR settings shown by Wags, I've even confirmed with him what this setting does. If you read up on all "World Scale" issues and solutions in all VR games implementing the "World Game" slider or value, internally it is changing the IPD used to render the scene. There is a concept of Hardware IPD and Software IPD sorry if this was not clear before. Anyway, im done argueing the point, it doesnt matter to me any more, the feature requested in this thread has been added and will be available in a later build for you all to see. Happy Holidays.

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It's a good feature. I play a lot of project cars, and you can adjust world scale in real time from the pause menu, and just one or two percent makes quite a difference to how big the cockpit feels. You don't need it that often, but when you do you are very glad of it. It will be a welcome feature to have in DCS, thanks for implementing it.

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It's a good feature. I play a lot of project cars, and you can adjust world scale in real time from the pause menu, and just one or two percent makes quite a difference to how big the cockpit feels. You don't need it that often, but when you do you are very glad of it. It will be a welcome feature to have in DCS, thanks for implementing it.

 

It also changes the speed perception. A higher number feels faster. I run with a setting of 1.30 so I can better gauge my speed going into a turn.

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...

Physical IPD on the HMD, AKA Focal IPD, Changes Focus, By Adjusting the IPD of the Lenses to Match your Eyes for clarity of the display behind the lenses and reducing eye strain.

 

Rendering IPD changes the IPD between the rendering viewports within the engine itself., thus adjusting scale.

 

 

Matching the Rendering IPD to the Focal/HMD's IPD will make every Appear 1:1,

 

Closing Rendering IPD will make objects seem larger, Opening Rendering IPD will make objects seem smaller..

 

Basically, you're scaling your head size, smaller Rendering IPD will shrink your head, making everything seem huge, larger Rendering IPD will make your head grow, making everything seem small.

 

Since DCS had a Static Value for Rendering IPD, user experience varied dependent on their Physical IPD Setting

 

The Same Applies to VR Video Recording,

if the Lenses while recording are close together, the video when played back with HMD will seem large in scale,

if the camera lenses are farther apart the video will play back and seem everything is smaller.

Which is why Video Content on VR Sites seem to have different Scales even though you have not changed anything on your HMD.


Edited by SkateZilla

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It should have something to do with the FOV we have now (about 75-85 degree horizontal) as that generates the experience for the space too, so it ain't about IPD but "binoculars" effect that you are having too long focal length.

 

Correct ansver. None of helmets have perfect FOV matching FOV of camera in game. If real FOV of lense in helmet is less than game camera FOV(in most cases real helmet's FOV is lower than mentioned in product description, unfortunately) all objects will look smaler than they are. Neither IPD changing or world scale will not help. Only adjusting game camera FOV to helmet's one.

screen.thumb.jpg.46bab9d54fcc848535c0153eb27a0be3.jpg

The higher diffence the smaller objects are in HMD. Because angular size is smaller.

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The lenses IPD adjustment doesn't change what so ever the magnification or FOV in the displays. Oculus added the IPD adjustment so the special lenses that has very specific small area focused, to be possible be positioned so it matches the person IPD who wears the HMD

That's only what i mean ,even if my english is too bad for some buddies:)

By the way players don't care about pseudo scientifics explanations,just seeing while playing With helmet VR on DCS world that the scale of cockpit seems slightly too little.

Now at least this post will be usefull to invite devs at doing something to add a feature that will permit to players ,as like in many other games,to adjust the scale as they want.

It would be a pity that DCS world cannot realise a feature widely widespread on many other games.

Anyway, im done argueing the point, it doesnt matter to me any more, the feature requested in this thread has been added and will be available in a later build for you all to see. Happy Holidays.

Thanks "Jabbers" to your report

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