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OT: Venezuela's new SU-30MK2's


Tomahawk674
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Actually our armed forces have been getting a major overhaul. It is not only about the adquisition of new equipment, but there's been a change in how things are maintained, and we have brough back into working order many things that had been abandoned/neglected.

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Are there any flankers prepared to carry other missiles than russian missiles aside from chinas aircraft?

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its not how they are maintained...its for how long you will get replacement parts from the big RU :D

 

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Hmmm. I don't see why we wouldn't get replacement parts from Russia. This being a russian board, most should know how well relations between our two goverments are.

 

Even after the US threatened economic sanctions against the Russian company reponsible for the sale of the Su-30s, it still proceeded.

 

 

The US has stopped giving us parts, and tried to enforce some kind of weapon embargo. For a while there our F-16s were grounded. However work arounds were found and they are operational again.

 

And I'm not trying to bash any goverment or anything, people just push for their own interest, and like we all know, most people's interests creates conflict with each other.

 

I'm just happy we have these planes to call our own now.

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US has only embargoed upgrades, they didnt embargo the parts. That was a fact because US didnt want you to get the Su-30 in exchange for your falcons maintenance.

 

BTW, the leap over the falcons wasnt so great as you might think... with a simple upgrade kit you would have capabilities that you can only hope for from the russians.

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Those are cool looking Flankers! There is no fighter airplane in the air today that looks as good as Flanker.

 

Just now, I am finishing building a Su-27 plastic model. Went to Wal Mart and got me a little airbrush and paints from Tower Hobbies and etc. It will look nice when finished.

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US has only embargoed upgrades, they didnt embargo the parts. That was a fact because US didnt want you to get the Su-30 in exchange for your falcons maintenance.

 

BTW, the leap over the falcons wasnt so great as you might think... with a simple upgrade kit you would have capabilities that you can only hope for from the russians.

 

Ignorance is bliss.

 

Range without sacrificing weapons?

2 engines are always better than one?

Not having to be on US' balls all the time to get parts, upgrades, "open source" for hardware code?

 

NOT A GREAT LEAP YOU SAY? :megalol:

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They're just one someone else's balls instead bud. Don't kid yourself.

However I will agree that this model is likely a better performer than any F-16 :D

 

Ignorance is bliss.

 

Range without sacrificing weapons?

2 engines are always better than one?

Not having to be on US' balls all the time to get parts, upgrades, "open source" for hardware code?

 

NOT A GREAT LEAP YOU SAY? :megalol:

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And the US did embargo parts. Lack of replacement parts was the reason so many of our F-16 were inoperative.

 

Spain was told not to sell us their CASA transport planes because they had US-made components. Optional systems were found and the sale mantained.

 

Politics are a tough game...

 

Now we need a skin of these Flankers for Flaming Cliffs... anyone?

 

:D

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Ignorance is bliss.

 

Range without sacrificing weapons?

2 engines are always better than one?

Not having to be on US' balls all the time to get parts, upgrades, "open source" for hardware code?

 

There are prons and cons with the flanker VS the F-16.

 

The best thing about the flanker is the range, but everything else was in favour of the F-16. Looking at the venezuelan site, I can see a whole arsenal of modern weapons that will be no longer purchased.

 

You got Python 4 in F-5's wich is better than the R-73 and the flanker cant carry it.

Derby and R-darter that were under consideration for the F-16's and now have no aircraft to be fitted. These are way better than any R-27 or RVV-AE you --may-- get.

 

Not having to be on US' balls all the time to get parts, upgrades, "open source" for hardware code?

 

You think the russians arent going to do the same? :lol:

 

2 engines are always better than one?

 

Its not proven that 2 engines are safer than one, infact the only engine of the F-16 will outlive 4 of the flankers. I guess your not familiar with their overhaul and replacement life cycles. ;)

Not to mention the money that it will cost to fly a plane wich spends ALOT more fuel and requires a maintenace and logistics plan that will also cost you over time much more than the F-16.

And then you will see how long it takes for the parts to arrive from russia on the other side of the planet and the reliability of their services compared to the US.

 

NOT A GREAT LEAP YOU SAY? :megalol:

 

To do what but to pi$$ off the US?

As far as I can see theres no opposition on south america that the Upgraded F-16's wouldnt be able to match anyway. You think you will match US aircraft with 24 airframes?! :lol:

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One thing to add is this:

 

Venezuela is very focused on the transfer of technology.

 

It is a problem when you need to get parts from any country be it the US or Russia, but I'm sure our goverment is taking steps to transfer any technology it can the products it is buying.

 

One example is that we have engineers in spain learning about the naval equipment being bought from spain, not just learning how to use it.

 

Like when we bought AK-103/104 rifles, first we bought 100,000 from Russian, but we will set up a manufacturing plant for these rifles and their munition.

 

Like a said, many steps are being taken to try to be less dependant of foreign production.

 

Also, I doubt our government is trying to piss off anyone, nor are we preparing for war as some may say. We just had very outdated equipment all around, and it was time for an upgrade. We couldn't get it from the US so we got it from Russia. We have great relations with most everyone (Including Brazil, Argentina, Bolivia, etc) and armed conflict is extremely unlikely to ever happen. 24 airframes is enough to cover our small country.

 

The most probably use any of these Flankers will get is participation in the yearly Cruzex exercises.

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I understand that, but Russia wont let you poke on the source code nor make your own engines, not even india and china gotten the permit for that. Your deal aint anything different from what we've donne to our hardware. Theres always offsets of the deal but youll never be self sufficient. Not much more than you were with the F-16's.

 

Chances are you wont.

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Self sufficient, probably not, better off dealing with Russia, probably yes.

 

It's just the way things are between the 2 governments. Originally, we had to beg and plea to get the F-16s in the first place, and thing only went downhill from there. And that was with a past government that was very close to the US.

 

So far Russia has proven to be a very different story. Things with the sales and training are going great.

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on the topic of an f-16 vs su30..i would say that 2 engines are better than one, if u lose an engine on a f-16 u screwed and the chances of u getting back home are very slim..at least with the su-30 u can still bring it back home, so this saves u the aircraft..and how many times do u hear about an viper whose landing gear collasped on landing?! yeah, and in terms of fuel yeah i guess u can save a little on that,but when u think about it how many times do pilots have to Dump fuel before they can land so that the gear dosent collapse? there are good points and bad points to everything, and as much as i love the viper it still has its problems, ones that can really hurt it in terms of matinence..sure the su has its problems too but i think they are not as primary to take it out of service as the vipers..

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It's a shame about the the US/Ven tension, and such a waste. Frankly....well I won't get into it, but I like Chavez. SU-30 is as good as it gets if you don't build AC yourself.

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And if you loose one on two engine aircraft, chances are the best option is to eject.

 

but when u think about it how many times do pilots have to Dump fuel before they can land so that the gear dosent collapse?

 

that is done on every aircraft. there is a maximum landing weight value and you must follow that. you are alowed a small percentage (1-3%) of landing with more then that.

 

24 airframes is enough to cover our small country.

 

you should get more... if russians get dependant on US again, like they were when we needed them, and stop cooperating, you are gonna need to use some aircraft for parts.

 

You think you will match US aircraft with 24 airframes?!

 

As long as they are in good shape, they will not need to be mathed.. US wouldn't dare to.

Never forget that World War III was not Cold for most of us.

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Quote:

You think you will match US aircraft with 24 airframes?!

As long as they are in good shape, they will not need to be mathed.. US wouldn't dare to.

 

why would the US be fighting Venezuela anyway? and why do so many of these topics turn into either a F-22 pwns/sucks flame war, or something to do with one country or another fighting the US?

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