2021 (and earlier) DCS Newsletter Discussion Thread

[Hoirtel]

1 minute ago, Desert Fox said:

 

Yeah. I was waiting for a parcel last week and the app said it would arrive around 1100 on the 24th... hell, it came 1330 on the 24th.

Why do they announce arrival at all if they can't make it?

Was sitting right at the door for two and a half hours straight waiting for it! Damn, how angry i was! I still am! Never ever get a parcel again! I quit!

You see! they could have said 14:00 and been early. LOL

 

Its not an issue really. I have no idea how difficult these things are to code and build, not easy I'm sure. They do say dates are subject to change. Its fine

[draconus]

I propose giving only year quarters in roadmap and ban "when" questions. DCS forum would be a better place then.

[Tippis]

Also, it's a full .1 version increase (well… numerically, it's two such releases, but 2.5.6 ended up essentially being 2.6 anyway).

Things will break.

Horribly. Unavoidably.

The reason it's delayed is that things are already breaking horribly, unavoidably, but so far only internally.

 

The more of that that can happen behind locked doors, the better. We're still very likely to see a month or two of post-2.7 fixes before it stabilises, and the end date for that is kind of likely to be the same irrespective of if ED releases in March or half-way through April. Are there other neat fixes in there that would be nice to get out earlier? Sure, but we'd only see a week or two of those being in place before the big one hits and everything becomes unstable by default since both ED and third parties will have to scramble to handle the fallout of 2.7 no matter what.

Edited April 1, 2021 by Tippis

[Silver_Dragon]

44 minutes ago, Lurker said:

 

Great...:( 
 

What's the point of releasing dates, if they are just gonna change them every week? 

 

 

ED always put a "little detail" with all ignore (from 2021 newsletter).

Quote

Please do take a look at our plan below but kindly understand that the dates are our best estimates as of writing this letter and may move around a bit as time goes by. 

Quote

The Mosquito is planned to be released into early access by the end of the 1st quarter of 2021.

Quote

The Mi-24P is planned for release in the 2nd quarter of 2021.

Quote

The early access AH-64D is planned for release in the 3rd quarter of 2021 and will be available for pre-sales as of February 2021 with a 30% discount.

 

ALL has subject to change and nothing has write in stone (from years ago)

[Lurker]

23 minutes ago, DD_Fenrir said:

 

It must be nice living in such polarisation. 

 

I mean, borderline delusional, and not in anyway reflective of the vagaries of real-life, but if you wanna get angry when real-life throws a cold bucket of water over your rose-tinted utopian filter of what should be, that's your right I guess.

 

Really? You're calling me borderline delusional for not liking the way that Eagle Dynamics has handled their customer communication, with regards to this particular (2.7) release? Does it give you some kind of thrill getting all high and mighty and taking a giant dump on another person online, just because? I mean seriously, it's not the end of the world or anything, and the reason why I posted is because I care about this hobby of mine but according to you I'm now a lunatic because I care enough to post about it. Thanks, thanks a lot. 

Edited April 1, 2021 by Lurker

[BIGNEWY]

25 minutes ago, Hoirtel said:

You see! they could have said 14:00 and been early. LOL

 

Its not an issue really. I have no idea how difficult these things are to code and build, not easy I'm sure. They do say dates are subject to change. Its fine

 

We make plans, we share them with you all, if plans change we let you all know. Everything is subject to change, we make it very clear. 

 

thanks

[Hoirtel]

Just now, BIGNEWY said:

 

We make plans, we share them with you all, if plans change we let you all know. Everything is subject to change, we make it very clear. 

 

thanks

I'm still hoping on the April Fools theory... no?

[Rudel_chw]

Just now, Hoirtel said:

I'm still hoping on the April Fools theory... no?

I’ve never ever seen ED joking with release dates .. so, why don't we wait for 2.7 while flying all the wonderful aircrafts that are already here, instead of complaining about a delay?

[DD_Fenrir]

Lurker, my hyperbole was meant to give you some pause for thought; I don't truly believe you're a lunatic.

 

I get your excitement for the Mossie and wholly understand your disappointment - and I feel it too - but at the same time, in your excitement, you seemed to have ignored all the caveats, disclaimers and provisos that come with every DCS release. You've been around long enough that this shouldn't come as a surprise.

 

Software development is a far more complicated animal than any other service or product in it's equivalent price bracket and has more in common with a construction project in terms of delays, knock-ons, and coordination issues. You can be individually on (or even ahead) of deadline on the piece of the project your working on yet when all the parts come together all of a sudden, despite the best efforts to avoid them, there's a clash, where two or more elements don't sync. Depending on the why or how, that might oblige you or more contributors to re-work their piece to fit; in the worst cases that could be a ground-up rework. Suddenly a project that looked to be on or even ahead of deadline is now beyond.

 

And being on the fringes of the industry I know software developers tend to give themselves some breathing room - but they can't give themselves too much, a close deadline helps to provide impetus and motivation to build the momentum to complete, whilst two, it can hurt profitability.

 

The upshot is that you cannot judge the industry like you would other services as they do not face the same challenges/issues. 

 

Ultimately we know why it was delayed; Nick wasn't happy with the 3D model. He believed it didn't reflect the quality that a DCS model should have. I think that's laudable, whilst also feeling a bit disappointed that I've got to wait a bit longer. But in the end I'd rather have better later, than sub-standard now.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Lurker]

@DD_Fenrir

 

Your hyperbole is the kind of stuff that the younger generation calls cyberbullying these days. It was rude and un-called for, and it completely missed the point as I was not talking about the Mossie at all. In any case, I'm aware of all the stuff you wrote but apparently Eagle Dynamics isn't. Or they just don't care, since they keep making the same mistakes over, and over again. Again, it's not about the delay, or being angry about the delay, it's about how ED publishes & handles their release information and it's supposed to be constructive criticism. Not an invitation for a lynch. 

Oh and as for the Mossie delay. That's actually the way it should be done. No firm dates given, no promises broken. 

Edited April 1, 2021 by Lurker

[BIGNEWY]

lets keep the feedback friendly here. 

 

thank you all.

[MAXsenna]

I propose giving only year quarters in roadmap and ban "when" questions. DCS forum would be a better place then.

Second that!

Sent from my MAR-LX1A using Tapatalk

[Tom Kazansky]

The solution is simple. The group that is fine with ED's way does not have to change anything. Those how are bothered because of constant delays simply add a month or a quarter or whatever they are comfortable with to the planned dates. Those have the chance to be happily surprised now and then. This is not meant sarcastically. It works.

Edited April 1, 2021 by Tom Kazansky

[Viking 1-1]

Better a delayed 2.7 then a broken 2.7 imo.

 

Take your time, ED.  

[Northstar98]

1 hour ago, Tom Kazansky said:

The solution is simple. The group that is fine with ED's way does not have to change anything. Those how are bothered because of constant delays simply add a month or a quarter or whatever they are comfortable with to the planned dates. Those have the chance to be happily surprised now and then. This is not meant sarcastically. It works.

 

This.

 

And while it does seem like Stockholm syndrome (at least that's my take) it helps offset disappointment somewhat.

 

When developers plan a date add at least 2 weeks, if they plan a quarter, expect it in the next one.

 

But I can see where Lurker was coming from, having something be a week away, to be another week away, then to be another week away - making it seem like it's perpetually going to be a week away is pretty frustrating, and I've been here a while.

 

Better to keep it restricted to a planned month or quarter, and only throw out a date when we're more certain about it. 

Edited April 1, 2021 by Northstar98
promise -> plan as per BIGNEWY's comments

[BIGNEWY]

10 minutes ago, Northstar98 said:

When developers promise a date add at least 2 weeks, if they promise a quarter, expect it in the next one

 

To be clear, we never promised, we said planned, and added it was subject to change. 

 

thanks

[Skysurfer]

2 minutes ago, BIGNEWY said:

 

To be clear, we never promised, we said planned, and added it was subject to change. 

 

thanks

 

Is the delay based on issues that were encountered during testing or do you simply need more time to implement Hornet features etc. to make the release more fleshed out and put that specific module "out of EA"? Just curious.

[BIGNEWY]

8 minutes ago, Skysurfer said:

 

Is the delay based on issues that were encountered during testing or do you simply need more time to implement Hornet features etc. to make the release more fleshed out and put that specific module "out of EA"? Just curious.

 

Testing, the team need a little more time. 

 

thank you

[Mars Exulte]

3 hours ago, Lurker said:

 

I'm sorry but that's simply not true. If there is a curse, it's of their own making. It's not exactly rocket science, and the vocal minority is just that. A minority. I would much rather have NO date at all, rather than a vague date, because that way there is room for error. Everything else is pandering, or sofistry. In any case writing a date, and next to that date (subject to change) is quite honestly an insult to their customers intelligence. 

 

 

  I, too, take my video games seriously, but this is really ridiculous thinking. They haven't lied or extorted money from each anybody. They haven't hurt anybody. It's a video game. People with this thinking need to go outside more often. Saying it's ''no big deal'' isn't ''pandering'', it's what a well developed, mature person thinks about their video games regardless of context.

[AKULA_OPTIMUS]

Problems come when you are so specific about launch dates, even if you make clear it's an estimate. It creates a lot of spectation, you kown. 

[Corvine]

It's just a game.

 

No, scratch that. It's just an upgrade to a game that is already amazing. I could wait an extra couple of weeks if that's what it takes. In any case, I have yet to meet a development team that delivers on their promised (or shall we say "planned" ) deadlines.

Edited April 1, 2021 by Corvine

[Northstar98]

47 minutes ago, BIGNEWY said:

To be clear, we never promised, we said planned, and added it was subject to change. 

 

thanks

 

Yep, I'll edit my post to avoid confusion. But it detracts from what I was trying to say.

 

For anybody reading whatever planned date, add 2 weeks at least, if it's a quarter expect in the next one etc.

 

But it might be better on ED's part to stick to a more ambiguous date until there's more confidence of what date it will be. Of course there's going to be last minute hickups that go wrong, and that pushes it back - that's fine, it's unavoidable. I've been here long enough to know the nature of the beast. 

 

Then again, we'll get the same complaints if no date was planned so there's probably no winning either way.

[Mr. Big.Biggs]

1 hour ago, BIGNEWY said:

lets keep the feedback friendly here. 

 

thank you all.

I really wish you would just release it as is so that people will stop bitching about missing a date and commence with the sure to follow 50 pages of “why did you release it if it doesn’t work perfect “. Posts....

[BIGNEWY]

3 minutes ago, Northstar98 said:

 

Yep, I'll edit my post to avoid confusion. But it detracts from what I was trying to say.

 

For anybody reading whatever planned date, add 2 weeks at least, if it's a quarter expect in the next one etc.

 

But it might be better on ED's part to stick to a more ambiguous date until there's more confidence of what date it will be. Of course there's going to be last minute hickups that go wrong, and that pushes it back - that's fine, it's unavoidable. I've been here long enough to know the nature of the beast. 

 

Then again, we'll get the same complaints if no date was planned so there's probably no winning either way.

 

It is difficult trust me  

I have found that giving the community the latest news / dates as soon as possible and updating it if and when it changes the best way. Most people like to be kept informed. 

 

Thank you

[Northstar98]

7 minutes ago, BIGNEWY said:

 

It is difficult trust me  

I have found that giving the community the latest news / dates as soon as possible and updating it if and when it changes the best way. Most people like to be kept informed. 

 

Thank you

 

Meh, fair enough then - if that's what works for you, and you're the person who actually deals with it then that's absolutely fine.

Edited April 1, 2021 by Northstar98