The F-15 Eagle vs SU-27 B Flanker Thread

[selu_99]

Dear Community,

Welcome to the Eagle vs Flanker thread :) where I would like to post the pros and cons of each plane, and not infesting other threads with the same matter. There is only one rule that has to be followed: no killing!! stop insulting and accept others opinions!!

this thread is yours, reply saying:

1.- Which plane you consider to be better.

2.- What are the pros and cons of that plane.

3.- What convinced you to choose one or another.

Please, follow this pattern and peace will reign.

Thanks.

[D-Scythe]

Dear Community,

Welcome to the Eagle vs Flanker thread :) where I would like to post the pros and cons of each plane, and not infesting other threads with the same matter. There is only one rule that has to be followed: no killing!! stop insulting and accept others opinions!!

this thread is yours, reply saying:

1.- Which plane you consider to be better.

2.- What are the pros and cons of that plane.

3.- What convinced you to choose one or another.

Please, follow this pattern and peace will reign.

Thanks.

 

Jeez, another one?

[A.S]

Flanker vs Eagle Post from the Past

 

Prodigy gave me that link and relating to this topic ...here it is ..ENJOY

 

http://http://mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/flankers_pages/flanker_combat.html

 

 

"....There has been talk of mock combat between Su-27's and F-15's when a Su-27 and a Su-27UB made a goodwill visit to Langley AFB in the USA.

Depending on whose story you believe - the Russian's wiped the floor with the Americans (according to the Rusians) - or there was no mock combat - the Russians cheated and turned what was some formation flying into air combat and caught the F-15's off guard (according to the Americans). I make no conclusions - I am just reporting what has been claimed ......."

[selu_99]

That link has nothing to do with this game. In reality flanker is said to be better, but in the game some consider it to be the eagle.:)

 

Im referring to the game

[SuperKungFu]

this thread is already going downhill. Simple answer- it all depends on the pilot. ;)

[selu_99]

this thread is already going downhill. Simple answer- it all depends on the pilot. ;)

 

what you mean?:)

[Pilotasso]

Uh-oh...did someone opened the same old can of worms? :D

[Maverick-90]

uuh theres that smell again.....this one's dead a little time now isn't it? well at least it smells like it was xD

[Pilotasso]

It used to be called Mr Ed (Ed-ED, get it?) and people keep beating it alot. :D

[GGTharos]

The reality is that each aircraft has its strengths and weaknesses.

 

You'll find F-15 drivers that regularely beat up on Su-27's, and vice versa.

[upyr1]

That link has nothing to do with this game. In reality flanker is said to be better, but in the game some consider it to be the eagle.:)

 

Im referring to the game

I've heard BVR = Eagle Close in Flanker:pilotfly:

I like them both the IRST is cool and so is the AMRAAM

[britgliderpilot]

The reality is that each aircraft has its strengths and weaknesses.

 

You'll find F-15 drivers that regularely beat up on Su-27's, and vice versa.

 

I concur with GGTharos' assessment.

[4c Hajduk Veljko]

1 V 1, Flanker can hold on its own in Lock On. However, lack of ARH missiles make the Flanker useless in multiple airplane engagements.

[Pilotasso]

Nope...thats mainly because you would have to lock him up anyway, ARH or not, take the mig for example.

[GGTharos]

The 504th uses flankers successfuly in multiple engagements against arh-toting opponents.

[Pilotasso]

Flying low and slow is often suicide and is responsible for more deaths than AMRAAM itself is. Anyone please explain to me why keep flying low.

 

Tired to see people complain how the flanker should own the F-15 when they do not fly proper tactics in the first place.

 

Flown a few hours ago on 169 where all F-15's were owned big time. Guess what...they were all flying low. I came in high and took 3 out in a single sortie, with the Su-33. I didnt fly specialy well. The eagles were do ones making my life easy. Once defensive there was no contests against the F-15's. All their missiles fall short above 3 miles, while I got almost sure kills up to 25 km in chases.

 

Since I fly all aircraft, it would be insane from my point of view to give more punch to russian planes. Throw in AWACS and we're in heaven. That untill the F-15 is fixed. After that let me at those Su-30MKI's. Let'em come anytime. ;)

[ViperEagle]

Disclaimer: I am an American who has a great deal of pride in the F-15C Eagle . I live near a Air National Guard training base, infact the only one, for Air National Guard F-15's and also it trains Active Duty F-15 pilots, so I see the F-15 ALOT.

 

However, I also have a sweet spot of love for the Su-27 Flanker. I find it to be the equal and in some ways, superior to the F-15 Eagle. it's beautiful, just as the Eagle is, and it's powerful and dangerous. I'm very happy Mexico may be getting some, because then I wont have to travel half-way around the world to see a Su-27!

 

That being said, I am going to make this analysis as unbiased and factual as I can.

 

=======================================================

• I've found that the 1.12A/B Eagle is so badly porked, I actually reverted to 1.02 just to get some semblance of sanity.
   
  In reality, both aircraft have pro's and cons, if we're talking about the IN GAME Aircraft..well...
   
  The Eagle has advantages over the Flanker IN (NOTE in 1.02 AND in 1.12 *sometimes*)
   
   
  The Trans-sonic, mid to high altitude fight (400-600 mph/ 20,000-35,000 feet) fight is the Eagles sweet zone. Thats where it's wings are optimized for, it's also where it is superior in several ways to the Flanker.
  
• 
  If the Eagle can keep the Flanker in the BVR realm and is flying correctly, isnt down low or launching from 40 NM away, then the Eagle can win. And likely will.
  
• If the Eagle gets in a WVR/BFM fight, if the Eagle can keep his/her speed up between 350-500 knots, isnt loaded down by excess fuel such as tanks and full internal, and can keep the fight between 20,000-35,000 Feet, the Eagle CAN and DOES have a slight advantage over the Flanker in sustained turn rate, acceleration and stability, and can gun the flanker down in those conditions.
   
  The Eagle has a MUCH more " point and click" radar.
   
  The Eagle can carry 8 Aim-120 AMRAAMS, giving it a "launch and leave" capability closer in.
   
  When the Eagle is loosing a turning fight, it can transition to the vertical quickly, and keep an advantage, even in a defensive engagement.
   
  When used properly, the Eagle can take on multiple opponents using the TWS Multi-Launch capability.
   
  The "work load" on the Eagle driver is much less than the Flankers, allowing the Eagle driver to concentrate more on the fight and less on manhandling the aircraft.
  
• 
  Like it or not, the Eagle can SPAMRAAM and throw out 3 or 4 Amraams and take off, allowing them to go active and killl the flanker when it is out of range of the Eagle, since the Eagle has likely gone to Zone 5 burner and burned out of the Flankers sweet zone.
   
   
   
   
  However, the Flanker does have some advantages as well.
   
  It has longer internal legs, as much as a Eagle with a tank and full internals. It's heavier than the Eagle when it does this, but it can also maintain a fight with afterburner (reheat for our British gents) longer.
   
  It has a much more powerful gun. It's 30mm can take down an Eagle much more quickly with fewer hits than the Eagle can with it's 20mm. However it doesnt has as much ammo, so you better be a good shot, cause you dont have much spray time. But when it hits, it does massive damage.
   
  It can carry more Missiles as well. The Eagle can carry a maximum of 8 AAM's. The Flanker can carry 10 AAM's. This gives the Flanker a better "buffer zone". The Flanker can use more SARH missiles to force the Eagle on the defensive, and close in, when the Eagle is at low energy/defensive, and make a kill using heaters. However, the Eagle can also pop off an AMRAAM in "pitbull" and kill you close in, very easily. However, on the same note, it's possible that your R-27's have already killed the Eagle.
   
  It has superior low speed manuverability/low altitude manuvering characteristics, with a superior sustained/instantatious turn rate at LOW SPEEDS AND/OR LOW ALTITUDE. Down low and slow, it can eat Eagles for breakfeast, lunch and dinner. Up higher it is at a disadvantage between 20,000 and 40,000 feet, higher up or lower than 15,000 or so, it has a slight advantage. Keep that Eagle under 350 and below 15,000, and you can kill him.
   
  It has something that makes it LETHAL when the fight goes to the merge. It has a Helmet Cueing System combined with the R-73 AND it's HOBS manuverability, and that Eagle will have to work doubly hard to stay alive in a WVR/ BFM fight. The Eagle in LOMAC does NOT have this, therefore, it's a massive advantage in a turning and burning fight.
  (Note: Modern USAF/USANG F-15's do have the Aim-9X and Joint Helmet Cueing System with a more modern and capable HOBS capability, however, that is not modeled in LOMAC, tho with the Black Shark and SU-25T, it should now.)
   
  The Flanker is larger, and can absorb a little more damage than the Eagle and still fly and fight another day.
   
  While pretty, the Kobra is a pointless manuver in ACM. It leaves you with zero energy practically, and exposing a huge target for a Eagle to gun or throw a Sidewinder at you. Every time I've fought a Flanker and they do that, I've won. Keep it to airshow routines.
   
   
   
  CONCLUSION:
   
  When it comes down to it, Situational Awareness, Support, and most of all, the skill of the two respective pilots will determine who walks away, and who takes the Silk let-down. I personally fly F-15's mostly, however, the moment you DO NOT RESPECT your opponent OR his aircraft, you're the one who's going to be eating that shell or missile because you got arrogant.
   
  NOTE:
   
  The discussion above was in regards to how LOMAC has made the aircraft. If you want me to compare the most modern varients of the Eagle and Su-27 (I am not including the Su-30 family or the Su-33's because the question was Flanker (Su-27) vs. Eagle), then I would say the F-15C with the AN/APG 63 V3(AESA radar) , Aim-120D and Aim-9X is in a slightly better position than the Su-27SM

[hitman]

^^ I like his analysis.

[Ardillita]

1 V 1, Flanker can hold on its own in Lock On. However, lack of ARH missiles make the Flanker useless in multiple airplane engagements.

 

Sorry, this is not correct, you can perfectly beat multiple oponents useing the correct tactics with your flanker

[D-Scythe]

That link has nothing to do with this game. In reality flanker is said to be better, but in the game some consider it to be the eagle.:)

 

Im referring to the game

 

Wow.

[Frostie]

So we are agreed then that the F15 is slightly better than the Flanker in the same way that the Su27 is marginally better than the Eagle , good case closed.

[hitman]

I disagree.

[upyr1]

The 504th uses flankers successfuly in multiple engagements against arh-toting opponents.

can you talk about the tactics you use or recomend to get the most out of the Flanker as that is the topic here. Not which is better but how to best use the AC. It comes down to the pilot and if you don't know how to flay a Flanker against an Eagle your Eagle bait and if ya can't fly an Eagle against a Flanker your craine food

[GGTharos]

I would suggest asking the 504 guys, but in my exprerience you can actually F-Pole an F-15 quite well and your missile will get to him before his missile will get to you, heck, with a good F-Pole the AMRAAM might never reach you.

 

If he turns around to run away, do the same, get some distance and re-set to a better position.

 

If he doesn't, remember he's firing more missiles at you so fire back - when you fire and he turns to A-Pole, launch an ET ... at this point you could turn away and run, and if you're the least bit lucky the guy will go all agressive on you, try to chase you only to take your ET in the face.

 

In the Flanker you really have to use the Radar/Heater combo.

 

You wanna fight either: Long range fight (about 25km - just inside burn through so he can't drop your lock) OR very close, where you have an advantage with your archers and HMS.

 

You do NOT want: Very long range (missiles are easy to evade) OR medium range (basically between 5 and 20km) because you have zero advantage there (namely active radar guided missiles) and it's basically a matter of luck.

[Pilotasso]

GG I would like to play VS you, me in F-15 and you in flanker. Your tactics sound interesting and you seem so very confident. ;) :D

 

Preferrably in team enviroment, 1 VS 1 is all bout who can dodge missiles the best frontaly.